$25 1966 Cortez. Estimated restoration costs please?

[pmodzele83]

I bought this at a thrift store today. I was going to sell it since I stopped playing guitar ages ago (I only played for a few years as a teen). But this thing sounds so damn nice it has me wanting to play again.

 

I was wondering if someone can give me an idea of how much it would cost to get this thing in tip top shape again. It has a crack on the back, and its missing the "truss rod cover" I believe its called. Other than that it looks solid and the neck is straight.

 

I did some research and from the serial number its from 1966. I looked online and in mint shape some of them are quite valuable, I'm not sure if this one would be just as valuable as the ones I've seen. So I'm not sure if its even worth restoring.

 

Thanks for your help.

 

[brianh]

Well "tip top shape" leaves a lot to interpretation.

 

Fixing the crack, resetting the neck, upgrading the tuners, leveling and recrowning the frets and a complete refinish job could easily exceed $500.

 

You might want to take it to one or two good luthiers in your area to discuss options and get some quotes.

[TommyK]

"Restore"?

 

I'd get the crack fixed and replace the truss rod cover. I would, also, carefully remove the 'thrift store' price tag.

 

Other than that, if she's a player, which she is, leave her be and just play her.

 

If you have ambitions of refinishing, I'd shy away from that. She appears to have 'patina of honest wear'. Usually.. usually, re-finished guitars of this age look re-finished and this could actually hurt a resale value, not to mention the tone.

 

She appears to have the plastic bridge of that era. Keep an eye on it. If it shrinks, cracks or moves, replace it. There's no value in crystallized plastic.

 

You could 'flip' it on Ebay for much more than you paid for it, without doing a thing to it.

 

You got the bargain of the year.

[Ship of fools]

I will tell you what not to do, except for repairing the crack on the back with some proper cleating and the truss rod cover is no big deal, but dont' do anything else or you will reduce the price by a lot, it has a lot of natural checking and enough bumps and bruises it keep it in the average catagory and with the crack value wise would be between $500-750.00 one in excellent shape of course would be anothe 500.00-700.00 more that floating bridge was first introduced to the Cortez line in 62 and actaully hold up better then bone sometimes just as Tommy mentioned do not try to change anything honest wear is a better selling feature for buyers.Ship....................oh and that is the steal of the century good on you a rare find for such a small price.

[peeper]

BTW a good rule of thumb for crack repair is $100 per inch.

[brianh]

BTW a good rule of thumb for crack repair is $100 per inch.

That's what she said!

 

Sorry, couldn't resist...

[pmodzele83]

Thank you for your help.

 

I have a few more questions;

 

If someone fixes the crack in the back will that part of the guitar look 'new' because of the re-finishing? Will it stand out from the rest of the guitar?

 

I searched online for a truss rod cover, but found nothing. Is it even possible to buy a replacement for such an old guitar?

 

Would buffing the lacquer a bit be something advisable? I want to make it look as nice as it can, and still make it look original.

 

I appreciate everyone's help. Had I had a guitar that sounded this great as a kid, I would have never stopped playing.

[brianh]

Thank you for your help.

 

I have a few more questions;

 

If someone fixes the crack in the back will that part of the guitar look 'new' because of the re-finishing? Will it stand out from the rest of the guitar?

 

I searched online for a truss rod cover' date=' but found nothing. Is it even possible to buy a replacement for such an old guitar?

 

Would buffing the lacquer a bit be something advisable? I want to make it look as nice as it can, and still make it look original.

 

I appreciate everyone's help. Had I had a guitar that sounded this great as a kid, I would have never stopped playing.

[/quote']

A good luthier can make it blend pretty well. You can have a TRC made inexpensively if you can't find a used one (it's unlikely you will find one anyway). You can try polishing it by hand, but buffing with a pedastal buffer should be left to the pros. As mentioned above, honest wear will not diminish it's value. A hack refin or buff job will...

[carverman]

Congrats on your find! The Cortez is similar to the Gibson LG2 flattop I think,

and the now Extremely rare FT45/50 from Epiphone NYC in 1941.

EDIT: The Cortez is listed as an FT45 in the vintage guitar website.

It had a 14.5 inch body with square shoulders similar to the Martin "00" instruments.

The original Epiphone Flat tops were was discontinued in 1949.

 

This is a Kalamazoo produced model in 1966..along with the Caballero (Kabayerro), Texan, Frontier, El Dorado

and the very rare moustache bridge ...Excellente, which today is worth it's weight in gold, as very few of these

premium (and hard to get) dreadnoughts were produced then.

 

The bridge on the Caballero was the resin as mentioned, as it was the entry line "small flattop" with an

all mahogany body and top. This was not the case with the Cortez which had the adjustable ceramic composition bridge, although from the picture, it does look like the black composition bridge that

Gibson was using on some of their more economical models produced then.

Not sure what their reasoning was though, as wooden bridges even with the adjustable saddle were

not scarce back then.

 

The sound posts for this bridge were set into a wooden bridge plate underneath the top. The adjustable

soundposts and bridge allowed the player of this model to set the action depending on string guage etc.

 

Definitely worth fixing, IMO.

Here's what someone is asking for a '66 Cortez in a bit better shape..but this gives

you an idea what these vintage guitars go for these days..they just ain't making

them anymore!

http://www.garysguitars.com/catalog/1966-epiphone-cortez-epa0152

[pmodzele83]

Thanks for the reply Carverman.

 

I'll have to find someone in town to take a look at it in person and give me advice as to what is best for it. I want to make it look the best it can, but I also want to maximize its value.

 

Thanks again to everyone, I appreciate your time.

[TommyK]

Sometimes a luthier can get glue into the crack, then line up the wood and close the crack. If there is a gap where there is much daylight, there are some clamping techniques that can be employed to close it up. Then cleat(s) can be glued to span the crack to reinforce. A good luthier can, with skill and a bit of luck, make the outward appearance almost invisible to the casual inspection without any finish work being done.

 

As far as buffing. Buffing compounds are usually of the past variety. Like paste wax on a scratch on a car's finish, the buffing compound will get into the cracks/ crazing, and be difficult to remove by buffing. The compound will take on a white coloration after it dries. What this will do is make the flat parts of the finish look shiny, but the crazing will be white. Bottom line, with a crazed finish such as this, buffing or waxing can make the crazing more prominent.

[duane v]

I'll bet a good Luthier will have her up and running for $300

[brianh]

I'll bet a good Luthier will have her up and running for $300

Duane, Marie and Becky are dead...

[Ship of fools]

Not sure about that 100.00 per inch, cleating a back often is very reasonable as they usually don't have to cleat every inch of a back break and please do nothing to the body of the guitar as it would decrease the value tremendously as for the one Caverman linked to that one is in Top excellent shape but I doubt that he is going to get that much for it, an auction at Christies Auction House had one recently in the same shape that sold for just over $1250 US in 100% shape ( well almost ) but there are those that collect these and sometime are willing to pay just that much more for one to finish their collection from that time eara and if it were from 58-64 you could increase the value by upwards of another $1000.00.

Just out of curiosity what was the serial number and is there a number stamped on the back of the headstock also as some of the serialization numbers from this time were off.Ship

[carverman]

Thanks for the reply Carverman.

 

I'll have to find someone in town to take a look at it in person and give me advice as to what is best for it. I want to make it look the best it can' date=' but I also want to maximize its value.

 

Thanks again to everyone, I appreciate your time.[/quote']

 

Are you sure that is a crack right through the mahogany? Looks like a deep scratch from the picture,

and a luthier can fill that scratch with nitro cellulose (brush on) and buff it up.

 

If it is right through, then a clear epoxy bead will work on the inside part of the

back and provide the stability. Being the back, it's a lot easier to repair than

the spruce top, but it shouldn't run you too much, I would think..it looks like

a easy to do repair.

 

As far as the trc cover, you should be able to cut one yourself out of some b/w/b

plastic..drilling out the holes in the right place to match the 3 screw holes would be

the trickiest part.

 

As far as value, well maybe the one I pointed to may be a bit overvalued in asking

price, but as I indicated, it's definitely worth more than $25, so even if you

have to spend $200 or so on repairs and a new trc, the value will still be worth

more than that to somebody that appreciates these vintage guitars..and maybe

even plays them as well.

[pmodzele83]

Ship of Fools: The serial number is 806295. I checked a website and it said 1966 or 1969. I looked a pics of 66's and they looked like mine, so that's what I figured it is. The model number is 'ft-45n'.

 

Carverman: I think the back is Rosewood? I looked at the Mahogany versions and they were a lighter color. And yes it is a crack. There's not space in between, and it looks like someone with experience could 'pop' the two sides back together, since one side is slightly raised.

 

I found a TRC cover on eBay for $10 that is a reproduction of 60's Epiphone TRC Covers. I'll probably buy and see if I can 'age' it to fit the look of the guitar.

[carverman]

Carverman: I think the back is Rosewood? I looked at the Mahogany versions and they were a lighter color. And yes it is a crack. There's not space in between' date=' and it looks like someone with experience could 'pop' the two sides back together, since one side is slightly raised. [/quote']

Very easy to fix.

Those never were available with a rosewood back AFAIK..at least not from Gibson in the late

60s. We had the entire line in our store back in 67/68/69..except for the Excellente

which was too hard to get and very expensive. I think it's a type of mahogany,

but not sure if it was Honduras, which was still available then, but banned now,

(except for any still hoarded in luthier vaults).

 

I found a TRC cover on eBay for $10 that is a reproduction of 60's Epiphone TRC Covers. I'll probably buy and see if I can 'age' it to fit the look of the guitar.

 

Just a little bit of fine #0000 steel wool?

[Ship of fools]

Actually its listed as having a Walnut back.

00 style with spruce top, round soundhole and tortoise pickguard, whitebody binding, Walnut back/sides,cherry neck 20 fret rosewood fingerboard with pearl dot inlays.

And the dating looks to be just about right in that time slot 66 or 67 and don't bother trying to age the truss rod cover, just let it do it naturally, it'll be fine no one really cares to much about that aspect.Ship

[carverman]

Actually its listed as having a Walnut back.

00 style with spruce top' date=' round soundhole and tortoise pickguard, whitebody binding, Walnut back/sides,cherry neck 20 fret rosewood fingerboard with pearl dot inlays.

And the dating looks to be just about right in that time slot 66 or 67 and don't bother trying to age the truss rod cover, just let it do it naturally, it'll be fine no one really cares to much about that aspect.Ship[/quote']

 

Yes, you are right. The original Ft45 was walnut back and sides, neck made of cherry,

top straight grained spruce.

Walnut is a good tonewood too. Some of the NYC Epiphones were handcarved walnut back as well,

like the 1934 Broadway acoustic archtop.

[teegar]

On the crack repair, I'll do a bunch of things myself but I'll leave crack repairs to pros. I've had several repaired in the old archtops, and certainly they were less than $100 an inch. I took them to an excellent builder/ restorer, who charges by the hour, not the inch, and I've had 4 inch cracks repaired for $25. maybe it helps that I've also had him do neck resets, which are considerably more costly! But you should get away for well under $100 for just the crack repair, IMHO.

[Harrison]

I agree, I had my texan cracks fixed by a repairer who fixes and build violins, cellos and guitars, she charged me £15 for clamping and fixing 2 cracks. If I'd taken it to some of the rip off repairers in central London it would have been more like £100.

Really nice find you have there, I'm always wishing to find that amazing guitar in a thrift shop - you never know..

 

my advice is maybe try a few repairers of cellos, violins etc as some of the guitar repairers tend to be a bit far up their own arse!

 

cheers

 

Alex.

[pmodzele83]

I contacted a couple luthiers online.

 

One guy that just does repairs quoted me $500!

 

Another guy, Dennis Kwasnycia quoted me only $250 (for the same amount of work as they both outline the same stuff)... and this guy makes AMAZING guitars. I figure that is a fair price especially with the talent this guy has.

 

I will probably ask him to fix it. I am moving to Toronto in a few months, so I'll probably bring it to him in person.

 

But like you guys said, I will try to find someone who fixes violins and other string instruments... maybe I'll be able to get the same quality work for even less.

 

 

 

 

On another note.... I went to the same thrift store today.... guess what I saw? A vintage guitar case.... that looks almost exactly the same as mine, roughly same period of time... I open it up.... no guitar. DAMN. Maybe I missed another big deal?

[Harrison]

I like the sound of that thrift store! good luck with your repair mate!!!

[zombywoof]

Does it really matter - assuming the repairs will not cause you to dip into next weeks food money to or hide out when the landlord comes round for the rent.

 

I just picked up an old Harmony Sovereign for $100. It will probably cost me more to have the neck reset than the thing is worth in dollars. But this guitar puts a smile on my face so it is worth it to me.