Hungrycat Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 I don't think this guy would understand what this label is even when the customer service from Gibson tells him that those pickups where made BY gibson... but it's NOT gibson. Except they ARE Gibson pickups. Made in Nashville and shipped to wherever Epiphone is doing assembly these days. They probably just get the "Epiphone USA" sticker to denote that they going to be used for Epiphones. I'd put money on the fact that they are exactly the same as "Gibson" P-90s, except the sticker. Because (as far as I know) Gibson makes two models of P-90. Neck and Bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 I'd put money on the fact that they are exactly the same as "Gibson" P-90s, except the sticker. Because (as far as I know) Gibson makes two models of P-90. Neck and Bridge. Well, here's where it gets interesting. A real honest to goodness Gibson P90 does not come in R & T versions. There is only one true dog-eared Gibson P90, with either a black or cream plastic cover. The EP-90 pickups do come in two versions, primarily to raise the bridge pickup, and another difference is that they have metal covers which are soldered to the pickup. So Rockerberry has a valid point. Even though the EP-90 is made by Gibson & most likely is wound the same as a Gibson P90, the literature should have continued to use the EP90 designation (similar to Elitist specs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hungrycat Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 A real honest to goodness Gibson P90 does not come in R & T versions. There is only one true dog-eared Gibson P90, with either a black or cream plastic cover. I thought they came wound in two different specs for neck and bridge? About 8ohm for neck and 10 ohm for bridge? Maybe you can only get one version aftermarket, but I could have sworn there are multiple different windings offered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonzoboy Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 The Gibson USA P-90s that are in my Limited Edition 1965 John Lennon Casino both read 8.10 Kohm and 6.433H while on the Elitist the pups are 8.10 Kohm but 6.45H. These specs are Epiphones own according to the spec sheet of the 2008 catalogue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockerberry Posted November 12, 2011 Author Share Posted November 12, 2011 Except they ARE Gibson pickups. Made in Nashville and shipped to wherever Epiphone is doing assembly these days. They probably just get the "Epiphone USA" sticker to denote that they going to be used for Epiphones. I'd put money on the fact that they are exactly the same as "Gibson" P-90s, except the sticker. Because (as far as I know) Gibson makes two models of P-90. Neck and Bridge. Hungrycat, it's a shame to dissapoint you about the "EP90" Vs "Gibson P90". You could check it by yourself here: Epiphone Pickups Gibson P-90 Description: Historic '50s tone with classic "dogear" cover. Warm and soulful. Magnet: Alnico-V D.C. Resistance: 8.1K ohm Induction @ 1KHz: 6.433H Elitist EP-90 Description: Made by Gibson USA. Historic '50s tone with classic "dogear" cover. Warm and soulful. Magnet: Alnico-V D.C. Resistance: 8.1K ohm Induction @ 1KHz: 6.45H They are not the same pickups, there is no sense as you said about sticking a label for pickups that are going to be used on an Epiphone. So, can you tell me why epiphone and gibson company promote the Epiphone IBJL as being mounted with GIBSON P90, instead of warn that they are mounted with EP90 BY GIBSON????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockerberry Posted November 12, 2011 Author Share Posted November 12, 2011 Well, here's where it gets interesting. A real honest to goodness Gibson P90 does not come in R & T versions. There is only one true dog-eared Gibson P90, with either a black or cream plastic cover. The EP-90 pickups do come in two versions, primarily to raise the bridge pickup, and another difference is that they have metal covers which are soldered to the pickup. So Rockerberry has a valid point. Even though the EP-90 is made by Gibson & most likely is wound the same as a Gibson P90, the literature should have continued to use the EP90 designation (similar to Elitist specs). I'm agree with you, so the only thing i have to say is that changing the literature and maintaining the same pickups is a scam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 I thought they came wound in two different specs for neck and bridge? About 8ohm for neck and 10 ohm for bridge? Maybe you can only get one version aftermarket, but I could have sworn there are multiple different windings offered. Nope, they're the same, other than soapbar vs dog-eared. Interestingly, the Gibson P94 does come in R & T versions, even though it's supposed to be the humbucker-sized equal to a P90. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hungrycat Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Gibson P-90 Description: Historic '50s tone with classic "dogear" cover. Warm and soulful. Magnet: Alnico-V D.C. Resistance: 8.1K ohm Induction @ 1KHz: 6.433H Elitist EP-90 Description: Made by Gibson USA. Historic '50s tone with classic "dogear" cover. Warm and soulful. Magnet: Alnico-V D.C. Resistance: 8.1K ohm Induction @ 1KHz: 6.45H They are not the same pickups, there is no sense as you said about sticking a label for pickups that are going to be used on an Epiphone. So, can you tell me why epiphone and gibson company promote the Epiphone IBJL as being mounted with GIBSON P90, instead of warn that they are mounted with EP90 BY GIBSON????? Who do you think makes "Gibson" labeled pickups? I'll give you a hint: it's Gibson USA. You, my friend, are getting WAY to worked up about a label on the bottom of a pickup. It doesn't matter what it says, it's a USA made pickup. They're both the same, and the specifications you posted prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 I'm agree with you, so the only thing i have to say is that changing the literature and maintaining the same pickups is a scam. Well, as scams go, it's not much of one. The bottom line is that the EP-90 is simply a Gibson-made P90 pickup in a slightly different housing. Since this appears to be a critical issue for you, maybe you should check out the new '61 Reissue Casino which may very well have the real deal P90s in it (& sells for $200 less than the IBJL). I can't confirm this, but they are black plastic covered P90s. Anyone pulled one of these pickups out & looked on the back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Vega Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Some people seem to really be wrapped around the axel about this. So I popped out the bridge PU in my 61 Anniversary Casino. No stickers, no engraving, no writing in Sharpie, no nothing. However, I have no reason to doubt the pickups being a P90R and P90T set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I popped out the bridge PU in my 61 Anniversary Casino. No stickers, no engraving, no writing in Sharpie, no nothing. However, I have no reason to doubt the pickups being a P90R and P90T set. Thanks for taking a look under the hood, but note that if they are standard Gibson P90s, there's no R or T set. The current ES330L would probably be the best example. On the 330, the pickups & covers are identical, but Gibson has placed a spacer under the bridge pickup to bring it closer to the strings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Posted November 15, 2011 Share Posted November 15, 2011 Rockerberry, I bought one of the IBJL guitars a while back and had the same complaint. Several people at the time told me that the pickups were the same as Gibsons, and though skeptical at first, over time I have to say I agree. Maybe Epiphone and/or Gibson intended to put Gibson stickers on the pickups and it fell through the cracks, or maybe they just made a mistake with their advertising. I know the principle of it probably bugs you as it did me, but I think if you were to buy some Gibson branded P-90's and install them in your guitar, you wouldn't be able to tell any difference because they are literally the same pickups. Hope this helps. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aster1 Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 'm agree with you. I`m fine with the sound of my guitar, as well as i am with the sound of my Epiphone Les Paul Special II, my first guitar and the lowest price guitar from epiphone that you can afford. I was just asking about this topic, because i think the specs listed on the web site, make buyers think they are acquiring a guitar mounted WITH GIBSON USA P90, and the highest standards of manufacture and finest materials GIBSON is known for. If the guitar doesn't have what is listed with, the buyer is being cheated, EVEN when the final result sounds satisfactory. But we are talking about spending money in something you really wanted, because you can get a good sound from a Gibson and from an Ephiphone made in china as well. I just inquire what i paid for. Getting back late here. But I agree on the cheating part. Just tell us what anything has correctly, then we have the choice to get or not get. Doesn't matter to me if it does sound good. Right is right and my policy in business is to tell everyone the facts & truth and let the chips fall where they may. Have you called Gibson/Epi Tech Support yet to have them explain? Hey, where's one of the Gibson site moderators? I bet they can find out quickly!! Aster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aster1 Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 Well, as scams go, it's not much of one. The bottom line is that the EP-90 is simply a Gibson-made P90 pickup in a slightly different housing. Since this appears to be a critical issue for you, maybe you should check out the new '61 Reissue Casino which may very well have the real deal P90s in it (& sells for $200 less than the IBJL). I can't confirm this, but they are black plastic covered P90s. Anyone pulled one of these pickups out & looked on the back? If I get a chance tomorrow I pull the pups off my new 50th Aniv Casino and check. Got to get back outside & mow the leaves now. Winter's closing in on me in I-OA WAY. Wish I could go for a ride on the Sportster instead of the Cub Cadet!!! Aster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 If I get a chance tomorrow I pull the pups off my new 50th Aniv Casino and check. Aster - Vic Vega did that in post #35, so you might want to save yourself a bit of time. The most obvious telling point would be the pickup covers. If they are shaped differently (neck pickup slanted, bridge pickup taller, or any other variations between the two), then they are not identical to the Gibson branded P90, of which there is just one version for neck & bridge. All of that said, the pickup winding process is probably identical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aster1 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Aster - Vic Vega did that in post #35, so you might want to save yourself a bit of time. Thanks, Missed that with my overwhelming desire to right the lawn tractor and get leaf chopping in my eyes. Anyone said what's on an Elitist yet? I was thinking those were to have been USA Gibson's as well. Mine may need to be restrung & may look tomorrow. Aster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockerberry Posted November 20, 2011 Author Share Posted November 20, 2011 Getting back late here. But I agree on the cheating part. Just tell us what anything has correctly, then we have the choice to get or not get. Doesn't matter to me if it does sound good. Right is right and my policy in business is to tell everyone the facts & truth and let the chips fall where they may. Have you called Gibson/Epi Tech Support yet to have them explain? Hey, where's one of the Gibson site moderators? I bet they can find out quickly!! Aster Hi Aster, Writing to epiphone/gibson customer support was the first thing i did. And this is the mail they replied to me: "Thank you for writing. This appears consistent with a 2011 Inspired by John Lennon Casino. The pickups were made by Gibson USA, but as they were built specifically for Epiphone for use in these models, they are labeled “Epiphone” on the pickup. Unfortunately, we aren’t certain about the lack of the black toggle switch washer. Thank you for the inquiry." THEN i called to my epiphone dealer (in Argentina) inquiring about the scam, but they were surprised too as they looked their stock being labeled "epiphone usa EP90", and they still have no response from epiphone/gibson usa. As you could read, this pickups are "MADE BY" gibson built SPECIFICALLY for this model... SO i conclude is not a GIBSON P90, probably different materials and manufacture standars were used to built this pickups instead of what real deal GIBSON P90 must use. Again, i'm not complaining about the sound of the pickups, but i still feel like i´ve been cheated because that "gibson usa p90" advertising was the main reason i bought this guitar, otherwise, i would have bought an epiphone casino with bigsby and then upgrade the pickups with real GIBSON P90. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 So, the question STILL remains: Are they different? How are they different? I don't see that the response from Gibson really says anything except they were made by Gibson USA. It would be nice to know what they are exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Anyone said what's on an Elitist yet? I was thinking those were to have been USA Gibson's as well. The Elitist Casino has the same EP90 pickups as the IBJL Casino. For the Elitist, the pickups have always been correctly described in Epiphone's literature. Well, make that up until the 2010 catalog where the specs mistakenly listed the Elitist as having humbuckers. Oops! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blueman335 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Aster - Vic Vega did that in post #35, so you might want to save yourself a bit of time. The most obvious telling point would be the pickup covers. If they are shaped differently (neck pickup slanted, bridge pickup taller, or any other variations between the two), then they are not identical to the Gibson branded P90, of which there is just one version for neck & bridge. All of that said, the pickup winding process is probably identical. +1. If Gibson made them in the USA, they're not really Epiphone PU's. They're Gibsons, and there's no issues. If the bridge has a higher resistence, then they put a few extra turns on to balance the output with the neck PU, which is widely considered to be a good thing. A lot of players don't like uncalibrated PU's (ie. the neck is louder due to the increased string energy). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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