Rigormortis Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 I have a 1982 335 that I'm going to fix up a bit--strings, pickups, pots--and I need some advice from someone who plays a 335 a lot. First, I'll tell you what's on there--12-54 strings. These are pretty heavy, even for me. I play a Strat most of the time anduse 10-49. Pickups--humbuckers made by Gotoh. They are not bright, which is okay. They are mellow and perhaps a bit mushy. Pots--The rhythm volume pot is either on or off--not much volume control. I suspect a wiring issue or a bad pot. It's a beautiful black guitar, with no blemishes except some age crack in the lacquer. I already have the classic Stratocaster single-coil sound and want this to be my humbucker guitar that can get the Gibson sounds. I'd like it to be a versatile, easy player, with a good melodic capacity, able to do well with some string bending. Any suggestions? I'd like to know what came with the guitar originally and what the best upgrades are for what I'm seeking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny_uk Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 Hi I am one of those people who loves to leave the guitar as original as possible. Anyway, change the strings to your desired gauge, set up the harmonics and off you go. If you feel confident about rewiring or changing the pots then go ahead. In all cases I would always get a good recommended Luthier to look at my guitar for a diagnosis if needed ! Good luck and keep us all informed Johnny ps I love those heavy gauge strings even if you don't ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobv Posted November 7, 2008 Share Posted November 7, 2008 Great plan, a 335 would be a nice addition to your arsenal. If the guitar already had her pickups swapped out there's no crime in shopping for new ones. The rest depends on your experience with a soldering iron. There's an outfit called RS guitarworks that sells wiring harnesses that have most of the work done for you, or you could just order the parts and wire her up. As for pickups, the Custom Shop considers the Burstbucker 1 and 2 to be the closest thing to the original late fifties PAF's (which would have been in the 335 in its inception in '58) and that's what they use in the Historic Reissues (both for the 335 and the Les Paul reissues). However they are not potted, and if you are going into gain territory they could squeal microphonically (realistically by that point an ES might be feeding back anyway so wax potting might not be essential for this guitar - others can please weigh in here if you've tried the two kinds). If that's a concern then you might want to think about Classic '57 pickups because they're wax potted, and they're what was previously thought to be the closest thing to a PAF ('57 Classics are used in the current production of ES335's and I have them on my ES339). If you want a meatier, midrangier sound then the slightly overwound 490R and 490T are a nice choice (they're what comes on the Lucille model; I have them on an Epiphone Dot; they're also wax potted). If you're tempted to go with aftermarket pickups I'd urge you to call Lindy Fralin and describe what you're looking for and he'll help you figure out a custom wound set (not expensive, either). As for strings, consider that the shorter scale length on a Gibson means that the same gauge strings will not have as much tension as the longer scale Fender you're used to. This might explain why I never noticed that Fenders ship with .009's and Gibson ships with .010's until I read about their specs. So if you already play .010's on the strat then you may want to go "one louder" on the Gibby (sorry, couldn't help it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 7, 2008 Author Share Posted November 7, 2008 Thanks guys! Yes, the pups were already switched out at some point, but I think the pots are stock. A complete wiring re-do is probably what I need. I've done a lot of guitar soldering over the years and have relied on other players to recommend the best stuff for the particular guitar. I think the Gotoh pickups I have are a '57 copy, probably the closest thing to what the guitar had originally, or perhaps Gibson was using Gotoh as a manufacturer? I like them okay, except they seem a bit mushy to me. I get the normal 335 feedback when I'm situated just so in relation to the speakers, but nothing that can't be fixed by moving or turning away. I've removed the pickups and looked at them, and I don't think they are wax potted. I wouldn't mind getting Gibson brand, IF they are really the sound I'm looking for. As I said, I already have a great guitar for the single coil sounds, and I need something smooth and melodic for the Gibson humbucker sounds. I also like the way humbuckers sound with the gain up, or mild overdrive, which as you know can't be duplicated with a single coil. What do you think about the '57 Classics? I see that Gibson has a '57 Classic Plus, for the bridge pup. I've never heard anything about the 490. I recognize BB King's sound, and I like that fine, but I'd like to listen to a few other tunes that were done with a 335, for sure, and let you know which sounds I'm most interested in. Any suggestions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny_uk Posted November 8, 2008 Share Posted November 8, 2008 I seem to be listening to a lot of Larry Carlton, why not give it a try and see what you think? Ever heard of Steve Marriott from Small Faces, Humble Pie fame?? This guy has a unique blues sound and in my opinion one of the worlds most under-rated guitarists of all time. Go to UTube, type in Steve Marriott and watch some of the "Packet Of Three" videos. Listen to a song called "Five Years Too Long" I have 57 classics on my 335 and love the sound, wouldn't change them for the world ! Johnny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 8, 2008 Author Share Posted November 8, 2008 Yeah, Johnny, I'm leaning toward the 57 Classic in the neck and 57 Classic Plus in the bridge. I'm still open to non-Gibson pups as well, if anyone has a good reason for going that way. Steve Marriot is really good. I didn't know that was a 335. "Five Long Years" (my album) sounds a little like it could be played on a Strat. I looked at that yellow 335 he has with Packet of Three, and I'm wondering what pickups he has in there--not stock? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny_uk Posted November 9, 2008 Share Posted November 9, 2008 Five Long Years was played on his 335. Steve had classic 57's with the covers taken off. It was a fairly common thing to do back in the 70's and 80's, It supposedly gave you a higher dirtier output. In my opinion the difference was minimal. His son Toby now has that guitar. Are you able to try a few 335's with classic 57 pickups? Johnny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmartem Posted November 9, 2008 Share Posted November 9, 2008 I have 57 classics on my ES135 and they sound like sixties humbuckers to me ,chaulky in a good way,not too much gain,nice jazz sound out of the neck pickup.I have a Strat with a Seymour Duncan 59er in the neck position and a Seymour Duncan Pearly Gates in the bridge.The Pearly gates is suposed to sound like Billy Gibbons Les Paul and it does have a nice greasy snarl to it ,almost Tele like.You can get some great in between sounds with these two pickups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KennyF Posted November 9, 2008 Share Posted November 9, 2008 My 339 is my first and only guitar with '57 Classics and I have to say, I'm pleasantly surprised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 9, 2008 Author Share Posted November 9, 2008 I'm pretty far from a guitar store with a 335. I want to set my 335 up so that it is quite different in voice to a Strat. What can a 335 do that a Strat cannot? And how would I accentuate that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny_uk Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 It really doesn't matter how you set up your 335...it will never sound like a strat. Just stick on the classic 57's and play Johnny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troels Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 I have a 1982 335 that I'm going to fix up a bit--strings' date=' pickups, pots--and I need some advice from someone who plays a 335 a lot. First, I'll tell you what's on there--12-54 strings. These are pretty heavy, even for me. I play a Strat most of the time anduse 10-49. Pickups--humbuckers made by Gotoh. They are not bright, which is okay. They are mellow and perhaps a bit mushy. Pots--The rhythm volume pot is either on or off--not much volume control. I suspect a wiring issue or a bad pot. It's a beautiful black guitar, with no blemishes except some age crack in the lacquer. I already have the classic Stratocaster single-coil sound and want this to be my humbucker guitar that can get the Gibson sounds. I'd like it to be a versatile, easy player, with a good melodic capacity, able to do well with some string bending. Any suggestions? I'd like to know what came with the guitar originally and what the best upgrades are for what I'm seeking. [/quote'] My suggestion is Gibson own Classic '57s. These are sounding VERY nice in a 335 - clean as well as distorted. The Classic '57 is one of best pick ups ever from Gibson - and they've actually made quite a few well sounding PUs over the years. Pots, toggle and jack should be changed along with the PUs - using 500 kO pots. 335 are usually supplied with fast necks - but to my taste 12-54 is VERY heavy strings. I use 0.009 to 0.042 on my 335 - as the PUs are powerfull enough to get their signals from lighter strings. It's all a matter of taste - but I think it's easier and faster to play with lighter strings - and they don't stress the guitar that much either. 0.010s (to 0.046) bends easier on a Gibson compared to a Fender due the the slightly shorter scale lenght on a Gibson - so maybe that is the gauge for you - for instance Gibson Brite Wire 0.010". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 12, 2008 Author Share Posted November 12, 2008 Thanks for the advice. I'm going to order the Gibson 57 Classics and try going down to 11's or maybe 10's. I have some 10's from when I used to play 10's on the Strat, but I figured they would be way too light for a 335. Just as well give them a try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djroge1 Posted November 12, 2008 Share Posted November 12, 2008 Check out mr335.tv all the videos are good, but check out one called room 335. Larry Carlton is playing his Gibson Signiture ES 335 and it comes with the 57's already mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 16, 2008 Author Share Posted November 16, 2008 I have a hard time getting those Larry Carlton videos to upload, but they do look like information I could use, especially the 335 setup info. I bought new pickups--Gibson '57 Classic for the neck , and '57 Classic plus for the bridge. And I bought four new Gibson pots. So I should have a good start at reconditioning my 335 and getting it back to factory specs or better. I think everything else is okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djroge1 Posted November 16, 2008 Share Posted November 16, 2008 Rigormortis, I just noticed you are in Alaska. I lived there for 3 years and loved it - Elmendorf AFB so obviously I was in Anchorage. Where do you live? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 17, 2008 Author Share Posted November 17, 2008 I live in Haines. You probably went through here if you took the ferry. This is what my guitar looks like, except I have black speed knobs. I like the gold a lot, but I think I'll get the gold speed knobs, instead of the tophats. http://www.guitarcenter.com/item/expandedimage.aspx?t=4&img=GibsonMemphis/518921.035_sn-01386745_close_angle.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 17, 2008 Author Share Posted November 17, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hall Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 IMO 1. as suggested, see a pro luthier 2. 57's 3. ES-335 is the most sound versatile guitar Gibson manufactures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djroge1 Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 I live in Haines. You probably went through here if you took the ferry. This is what my guitar looks like' date=' except I have black speed knobs. I like the gold a lot, but I think I'll get the gold speed knobs, instead of the tophats. http://www.guitarcenter.com/item/expandedimage.aspx?t=4&img=GibsonMemphis/518921.035_sn-01386745_close_angle.jpg [/quote'] We took the ferry out of Alaska when it was time so yes we stayed the night in Haines before loading onto the ship. As I remember, you're not too far from some place that has bunches of Bald Eagles. Man I miss Alaska! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albertjohn Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I have 57 classics on my 335 and love the sound' date=' wouldn't change them for the world ! Johnny[/quote'] +1 on the 57s. I think they are used in a few current Les Pauls as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 20, 2008 Author Share Posted November 20, 2008 My new '57's are waiting for me at the airport, where we go to pick up our UPS shipments. !!! It was blowing snow sideways today; so the airport and the little office out there was closed and the windows were dark. The girls left a note on the windowpane that said they went home--no use being there since no planes could fly. In the meantime, I got some replacement pots from Gibson in the good ole US Mail, and some new gold speed knobs. The eagles are hunkered down. I saw a lot of them leaving yesterday and the day before--clear and cold, and time for the out-of-towners to head back home. I live in the Bald Eagle Preserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otaypanky Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 I'm glad to hear you decided on Gibson pick-ups, especially since you mentioned several times you wanted the 'Gibson sound', I couldn't see going anywhere else. I have a wonderful old '66 ES-335 that I bought from a school friend in '68 for the sum of $200. And that $200. included a '66 Deluxe-Reverb ! Ah, the good old days ~ IMHO, so much of your final tone is the result of YOU, and not simply which pick-ups. I often play at places where people see me show up with different guitars and different amps. But they say I always sound like 'me', whether it's a 335, a LP, an Epi, a Strat, a Tele ~ 'Doesn't matter. And the same with amps. However, one piece of hardware that I thin does actually make a major contribution to your final 'sound' is the cable. I go straight from guitar to amp with no effects in between, and I have found that a cable can make a huge difference with the end result. A guitar that sounds wonderful with the volume pots on 10 can sound like someone threw a blanket over the amp when you roll the pot down a bit. But it's often the cable being used that makes the difference. My cable of choice is a Vovox, a bit pricey but worth it, or a George L. For many years, like you, I have been using heavier strings, 11's on my Strats and 335, and 11's or 12's on my LP. But as of my last string changes, I have decided to try using the gauge that the manufacturer installs on the guitar originally. To my surprise, I have not lost quality of tone as I had expected. Here's my old friend 335 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 21, 2008 Author Share Posted November 21, 2008 NICE! Mine is more modern looking--at least what they thought was modern, with the Les Paul style bridge and speed knobs. I got it barely used in '82, but it's actually an '81 according to the serial number. I've always assumed the pickups and pots were original, but they are definitely made by Gotoh, which I can't account for. Perhaps the original owner thought he was upgrading or else the store parted it out to make a few more bucks, or Gibson used Gotoh as a manufacturer. I'm not expecting a huge difference in tone with these '57s, but I hope to hear some improvement. I'm mainly interested in getting it back to its original setup specs and perhaps improving it from there. The volume pot definitely needs fixing. I know quite a lot about Stratocasters and all the slight variations to bring out the tones; but I don't know much at all about the 335, since there is not as much internet discussion about this instrument. With my Strat, I got the biggest tone change from raising the action, finding a good cord, and tweaking the amp! I built my favorite Strat from parts and had to learn everything--neck woods, fret wire, body wood, pickups, bridge, nut, tuners, finish. . . all the things about the guitar that actually shape the tone. I have a few modern things on my Strat, but I went back to the original specs in most things, particularly the vintage bridge, which made a tone difference as well. But you're right--it's the player that shapes the tone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rigormortis Posted November 22, 2008 Author Share Posted November 22, 2008 Well, I got the '57s in and they sound really strong, much more complete than the Gotohs that were in there. I'm surprised to be getting so much of that blues tone from the 335, since I've been associating it with my Strat. I guess the old pickups were just too dark to bring it out. I put in new Gibson pots and caps as well. But the packaging on the pots was melted into one of the lugs and I broke one pot getting it out of the package. So I have one more pot to replace to be all new electronics. I have nickel wound 10's on there at the moment. And I'm liking them just fine. Now I'll have to do a complete setup with all the new stuff on there. Thanks for the advice, everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.