58dutchie Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 (edited) Hi there, I'm about to buy a new guitar. I'm torn between the Martin CEO7 and the Gibson historic LG2 1942 banner (new, not a vintage one). I love them both, that's the problem (no, cannot buy them both, haha). Both have adirondack tops (the LG2 a 'baked' one). Which one of the two is the 'better' guitar? I know they do sound different. The Martin sounds bigger, more open and has more sustain. The Gibson sounds boxier, but also warmer and woodier imho. Again, I like them both though I find them also apples and oranges. I guess I want the guitar that has the 'oldest' sound, that sounds most like an old record if you know what I mean...though the CEO7 might have the 'best' overall quality of sound of the three, I'm afraid it will sound too hi-fi where I'm looking for a more lo-fi kinda sound...are you still with me, haha? I need the guitar for 'small' songs how I like to call them. With some singing to go with it. Mostly fingerpicking and some strumming. Not Neil Young-like strumming. Think Tom Waits-like. Perhaps the Gibson L00 original is also an option. Here's the CEO7: https://youtu.be/WMbTIsqFJg8 Here's the LG2 1942 banner: https://youtu.be/kkNbG8Pl1ok And here's the LG2 in a Tom Waits song: https://youtu.be/w8ibmF1MNnA (That's kind of the sound I mean, can the CEO7 do that too?) Here's the L00 original: Please advice which one would be best for me? Thanks! Edited February 6, 2023 by 58dutchie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustystrings Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 LG-2 all the way - but don't overlook the '50s Original and the Nathaniel Rateliff LG-2 Western. As I understand it, the LG-2 was only built with red spruce for two years before Gibson switched over to Sitka, and Sitka was the norm until the assorted special issue versions came out in the last decade or so. The red spruce gives more headroom, allegedly, but often sounds a little harsh to my ears. Then again, I've been playing Sitka for decades, and my sense of a how a guitar should sound is based on the predominance of Sitka guitars I've heard. Re: Martin vs. Gibson - that archtop DNA with the solid mid-range is more in line with the cited Tom Waits influence. I've seen pix of him playing an old 0-15 Martin, but also archtops. More of a mid-range punch, I think, and that is what Gibsons excel at. And lots of people through the years have commented on how easy it is to sing with a Gibson - that has certainly been my experience. To my ears the L-00 is a blues box; the LG-2 has a smokier, jazzier quality. It really DOES have a lot of the J-45's "hold my beer" attitude when it comes to rolling through numerous genres, with some interesting differences. The LG-2 has a surprisingly loud voice and combines the slightly arched top and back with a deeper body to get a really projecting, penetrating tone, vs. the enveloping and enfolding presence of a J-45. Those two Gibsons overlap tonally, with the smaller guitar having a tighter, tauter bass and the tonal emphasis a little higher in the midrange, vs. the "whoomph!" of a J-45's low end. Not to say that the LG-2 doesn't still provide the "Gibson Thump," though - it's just a little tighter, maybe a little more archtop-like. The LG-2 still has the Gibson chordal, blending effect, just a little clearer than a J-45. Seriously consider running nickel or monel strings, too. My perception is that they yield a more transparent, less hyped sound than phosphor bronze, and it's closer to a pre-war/mid-century sound. I've run them on my '05 J-45 and my Farida LG-2 clone with great results. Thanks for including the clip featuring JoiL at W Sound - I always go to his demonstration videos because his playing style is so much closer to mine than most of the videos I see. Besides, his playing is always enjoyable! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted February 6, 2023 Share Posted February 6, 2023 (edited) To be honest I do not give a flip what the top wood is any more than I pay attention to how many grain lines I can count per square inch. Way too much goes into making sound come out of a guitar to single any one thing out. Oddly, other than the last guitar I ever bought I have not gone out looking for anything in particular over the past couple of decades. I just wait till I get that phone call shouting "hey, guess what I got sitting here in the shop." While my lackadaisical approach has certainly caused me to miss out on some stuff, the Fates have smiled down on me more than a few times. I generally avoid attempting to describe sound as I have found that akin to trying to nail jello to a wall. Of the three guitars mentioned though the neck which would seem to be the most attractive to me is that on the "42 LG2. It has a full medium carve similar to that on the 50s Original J45. Then again, if I recall properly this take on the LG2 also has a 1 11/16" nut. Not sure what is up with that. I am also not so sure I would classify the L00 Original as a "blues box". That may be the image Bozeman is shooting for but under the hood it sports the same Ren Ferguson designed scalloped X bracing carve that all Gibsons have. Now if you referred to a pre-1929 Gibson O size "H" or "A" braced guitar as lo-fi you might be right on the money. As to the CEO-7, I am not a Martin guy so do not have a clue what I would think. Better to sit this one out and let others chime in. Edited February 6, 2023 by zombywoof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickRN Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 Dutchie, let me help here https://www.facebook.com/1552067488/posts/pfbid0Ed85fCh3jcFJ7uZqgugUMjpzaRTCUbnqMuWScQE3Z6NtQbsq4gYGWSqqigQio71Ql/ RickRN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluesKing777 Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 (edited) Ha! This is the 3rd version of this thread I have seen...AGF, UMGF and now....GAF! The Gibson people will say Gibson LG2, the Martin people Martin CEO7 and the AGF.....err, not sure.... You dn’t say what guitar you play now. My opinion.....new Gibsons and Martins sound ‘wet’..., new! For 10-15 years. The best acoustic guitar of the last decade for the vintage sound, to me, is my Waterloo WL-14L (ladder braced). I have said many times on this very forum that it sounds older than my old guitars! BluesKing777. Edited February 7, 2023 by BluesKing777 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorrisrownSal Posted February 7, 2023 Share Posted February 7, 2023 I answered on the AGF. I have the 50s reissue, dry guitar. Good recording guitar. No overtones. Great to sing with. Comfy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
58dutchie Posted February 8, 2023 Author Share Posted February 8, 2023 Thanks so far for all the comments and advice. I think it will be a Gibson in the end, the two guitars I will choose from are the Gibson historic 1942 LG2 banner and a second hand (like new) Gibson custom shop 30's L00 with adirondack top. I cannot test the guitars side by side...and I'm still not convinced if the LG2 or an L00 will be best for me. I'm a bit concerned about the narrower nut width (1 11/16") of the LG2 but I will play that guitar one of these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RvrDxn Posted February 8, 2023 Share Posted February 8, 2023 One huge consideration not mentioned so far are the neck profiles. The LG-2 and CEO 7 necks are just about as different as you can get. I owned a CEO 7 and liked the sharp V neck, and found the tone quite “beautiful.” It really is a unique Martin. But. . . I actually found the tone to be too complex for my vocals. I felt as if I was always struggling against it when singing. Certainly could be an issue unique to me. And admittedly, I’m not the greatest vocalist. I play mostly singer songwriter stuff and for that, I’d go with the LG-2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
58dutchie Posted February 26, 2023 Author Share Posted February 26, 2023 Just to inform you all: in the end I bought a Gibson historic 1942 banner LG2! I played lots of guitars and the last two were the banner LG-2 and a Martin 00-28 (surprisingly). I absolutely loved the Martin, but you could notice the difference between the baked adirondack top of the LG2 and the sitka top of the 00-28. While the had more volume (and more sustain!), the LG2 had more power. You could really beat it up hard and it would stay transparant and not become muddy (that was what the 00-28 did). Furthermore, the LG2 had a 'sweeter' and crisper voice overall. A narrower spectrum, but it just had something magical. It had the 'mojo' the 00-28 lacked. And it had just the sound that I wanted: instant Tom Waits. 😉Thanks for all your kind help and advice! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 Congratulations! I'm Banner LG obsessed: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossimo Posted March 10, 2023 Share Posted March 10, 2023 All access, that is a beatiful composition that you played. Can I have thebTabs? Can't get it out of my head. I am receiving an lg-2 history banner on tuesday and looking forward to play your piece on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt Posted March 10, 2023 Share Posted March 10, 2023 5 hours ago, Mossimo said: All access, that is a beatiful composition that you played. Can I have thebTabs? Can't get it out of my head. I am receiving an lg-2 history banner on tuesday and looking forward to play your piece on it. I'm not sure if you're referring to me as "All Access." In any event, I don't have TABs for anything that I play. Please post us pics and videos of your LG-2! As I posted, I'm LG-obsessed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambler Posted March 11, 2023 Share Posted March 11, 2023 Dutchie, I think you made the right call and sure hope you enjoy your new box. Fwiw, I gave a friends CEO7 a trial run. It aint nothing like a Gibson. Very much in the Martin bag. Each note is very pure and alive with gorgeous overtones, except that they all want to sing at the same time. That works ok for strum or classical arpegios, but for trad-bleus-folk picking, it's hard to keep the bass or lead note from getting swamped in the melee. My 00018GE, which I will be departing from, does the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossimo Posted March 11, 2023 Share Posted March 11, 2023 22 hours ago, jt said: I'm not sure if you're referring to me as "All Access." In any event, I don't have TABs for anything that I play. Please post us pics and videos of your LG-2! As I posted, I'm LG-obsessed. My apologies jt for referring you as "All Access" but as a first time poster I didn't notice your name up on top. I will post the LG-2 when it arrives. In the mean time here are pics of my 2015 custom "Special Mahogany" Banner. All mahogany and Its sound is more like a Steinway Piano sound. I was able to download "The Water is Wide" tabs from Musicnotes arranged by Ed Gerhard. Cheers Mossimo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave F Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 I would have have went with the same guitar you chose. I’m sold on the aged tops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 13 hours ago, Mossimo said: My apologies jt for referring you as "All Access" but as a first time poster I didn't notice your name up on top. I will post the LG-2 when it arrives. In the mean time here are pics of my 2015 custom "Special Mahogany" Banner. All mahogany and Its sound is more like a Steinway Piano sound. I was able to download "The Water is Wide" tabs from Musicnotes arranged by Ed Gerhard. Cheers Mossimo No worries. I hadn't before notice that I have all access! 🙂 I suspect that Ed Gerhard's arrangement is quite different. I'll check it out. I love all-mahogany Banners! Here's my 1943 LG-1: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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