Gibson Goldtop purchase advice

[jsgarry]

Hello everyone, I'm just about to buy a used Goldtop 2002 Classic used les paul, but I need some feedback on spoting a fake one.

[shaved_ape]

What do you mean fake? Fake goldtop or fake gibson?

 

To spot an authentic 2002 goldtop I don't know what to tell you.

 

To spot an authentic Gibson, if it has the fret edge binding, it's authentic, with rare and sometimes non-realistic expectations. A few companies in the late 70's and early 80's did this.

 

Also, ask if you can have the serial number to run by Gibson.

 

The serial number also contains the year. I know the first number indicates what decade, 8=80, 9=90 so on, I think it is the 4th to last number that will tell decade/what.

 

if it is a 2002 it should read like 0xxx2xxxx

[jsgarry]

What do you mean fake? Fake goldtop or fake gibson?

 

To spot an authentic 2002 goldtop I don't know what to tell you.

 

To spot an authentic Gibson, if it has the fret edge binding, it's authentic, with rare and sometimes non-realistic expectations. A few companies in the late 70's and early 80's did this.

 

Also, ask if you can have the serial number to run by Gibson.

 

look, this is the back of the neck. Is it normal to have the serial number printed like this? I guess this neck was painted for repairing issues.

[jsgarry]

look, this is the back of the neck. Is it normal to have the serial number printed like this? I guess this neck was painted for repairing issues.

 

Are the goldtops all painted in gold? or is it just the top as named? Cause this one seems to be all gold...

[shaved_ape]

That looks a little iffy/sketchy to me. If the SN# is printed on a sticker like that it's not a gibson. Some custom shops will say CS____xxxx with spaces and such. But i have never seen a printed sticker one.

 

Even if it was repaired or re-painted it should still have the MADE IN USA engraved on the back.

 

Someone else will step in here and tell you what to do. I would steer clear especially if you are about to spend over $1000.

[jsgarry]

That's why I need some expert advice, the seller told me that all the 60's reissues are supposed to be like that. I'm also worried about having the whole body painted in gold...

[shaved_ape]

That's why I need some expert advice, the seller told me that all the 60's reissues are supposed to be like that. I'm also worried about having the whole body painted in gold...

 

I think the 60's reissues have a wood grain back. Someone will tell you if I am wrong, but I think gold tops started as conversions where you would send in your gibson figure tops and they would just paint the tops gold, not the whole bodies. I don't recall ever seeing one completely painted gold unless it was a LP custom.

 

That serial number doesn't look right.

 

I say don't do it, but someone else will probably give you some different information.

 

Granted this isn't an image of a LP but this is Gibson's fret edge binding. It is a difficult process and the only company doing anything similar is Dean.

 

Fret edge binding is where the binding on the fretboard has a nub that runs into the frets. I don't know of any company that did this in 2002 as the last I have heard of a company doing it was around '84 or so.

 

But if it does not have this then it is not real, the only reason it would not have it is if it has been refretted, most people will have it taken off during a re-fret, so if you don't see it, ask the guy if it was re-fretted, if he says "no" then its a fake, that serial number is sort of a dead giveaway though because even on a LP classic it would have the standard serial number stamped in with a "made in usa" on it.

 

[jsgarry]

I think the 60's reissues have a wood grain back. Someone will tell you if I am wrong, but I think gold tops started as conversions where you would send in your gibson figure tops and they would just paint the tops gold, not the whole bodies. I don't recall ever seeing one completely painted gold unless it was a LP custom.

 

That serial number doesn't look right.

 

I say don't do it, but someone else will probably give you some different information.

 

Thank you very much, I will be expecting some more feedback on this topic.

[starfoxhound]

Good pics would be good to determine if it is a fake. Also check serial number (not the number itself but how it is stamped), logo, hardware, etc.

[NeoConMan]

Also, ask if you can have the serial number to run by Gibson.

Good advice.

But after that, you got seriously off track . . .

 

 

 

 

The serial number also contains the year.

I know the first number indicates what decade, 8=80, 9=90 so on, I think it is the 4th to last number that will tell decade/what.

Can't use the "fourth to the last" because Gibson added a digit in 2006.

First and fifth digit do indeed give the year using the normal protocol of the last thirty years.

Problem is, Gibson strayed often from that protocol and the Classic is one line that was different.

They came with an ink-stained number on the headstock, but not like what jsgarry's pic shows.

I don't like the way it looks in the pic, for several reasons.

 

if it is a 2002 it should read like 0xxx2xxxx

Again, not on a Classic.

 

 

 

it should still have the MADE IN USA engraved on the back

Nope.

Many years of production did not have that pressed into the headstock.

[damian]

There is a forum member named R9, and he seems to be one of the esteemed threaders who WILL KNOW.......I trust someone who can PM him will, and then you will know....I can say that fake Gibbies are frowned upon here.....Be careful with sellers, and know that you can trust the guys here.......

[NeoConMan]

That's why I need some expert advice, the seller told me that all the 60's reissues are supposed to be like that.

I'm also worried about having the whole body painted in gold...

Run away.

Fast.

[shaved_ape]

Good advice.

But after that, you got seriously off track . . .

 

 

 

 

 

Can't use the "fourth to the last" because Gibson added a digit in 2006.

First and fifth digit do indeed give the year using the normal protocol of the last thirty years.

Problem is, Gibson strayed often from that protocol and the Classic is one line that was different.

They came with an ink-stained number on the headstock, but not like what jsgarry's pic shows.

I don't like the way it looks in the pic, for several reasons.

 

 

Again, not on a Classic.

 

 

 

 

Nope.

Many years of production did not have that pressed into the headstock.

 

I have never owned or really looked at the back of a Classic, so thanks for setting ME straight.

 

And I never noticed it on my "V"

 

Gracias.

[NeoConMan]

Noticed what on yer V?

[shaved_ape]

Noticed what on yer V?

 

My V was a 2006,

 

The guitars I noticed it on were my 2000 SG and my 87 LP Custom.

 

I always thought after 78 they just used the 8 number system.

[NeoConMan]

Does your V have eight or nine digits?

It was a mid-year change, I don't know the specifics.

 

I first saw it when I bought my 2006 SG 61.

Thought it was a special run (since the guitar was one of 48 made) but it went to the whole USA line.

 

The only constant with Gibson serial numbers is that there is no constant.

Lotsa oddities out there.

[shaved_ape]

Does your V have eight or nine digits?

It was a mid-year change, I don't know the specifics.

 

I first saw it when I bought my 2006 SG 61.

Thought it was a special run (since the guitar was one of 48 made) but it went to the whole USA line.

 

The only constant with Gibson serial numbers is that there is no constant.

Lotsa oddities out there.

 

I bought it in February so that is probably why I didn't notice it, it probably wasn't there.

 

It had been there for a while so it probably arrived at GC in late 05.

 

Thats weird, so for the Classics, they sort of did a Custom Shop thing where the ink or paint it under the laquer or something?

[NeoConMan]

Yeah, for nearly twenty years.

That, and the puke-green inlays on the fretboard.

 

If you see one in person and can compare it to other Les Pauls, they look greenish.

Sometimes sickeningly so . . .

 

My 2000 Classic ain't too bad.

[pippy]

Oops!

[pippy]

Hi and welcome.

 

First off some clarification;

 

The Classic model didn't have the "Made in USA" stamp.

In 1992 the inlays were not green-tinged; these arrived later.

 

The Classic range had serial numbers x-xxx (1989), x-xxxx (1990-1999) or xx-xxxx (2000-2008).

 

The serial number on the instrument pictured would therefore date from 1992, not 2002.

 

There are some signs which would seem back this timeframe up (although it's impossible to be 100% certain from those snaps);

Firstly, the non-green inlays (although it's true some of the later guitars had whiter inlays).

It's difficult to be sure but the silkscreen on the front of the peghead appears to be the right length for 'Les Paul MODEL' rather than 'Les Paul CLASSIC'. In '92 it would have been the former.

The 'Classic' script on the TRC is quite finely stamped. By 1995 this had thickened-up somewhat.

It appears that the '1960' script has been re-touched off the p/g. Why?

 

What do you know of the instrument? Have you seen it in person or just in pictures? Do you know the seller? Who says it's from 2002 and why? Has the guitar been re-finished?

 

There are some original '52 - '57 GTs which were finished in an all-gold colour scheme.

As you suggest; It may be that someone has had this instrument re-finished - perhaps beacause of a peg-head repair.

 

The front shot is of a genuine Gibson Classic - albeit with a Seymour-Duncan in the bridge and a TP-1 tailpiece. The rear shot needs further clarification.

 

I'd ask to see more snaps if I were you. I'd especially like to see a good snap of the front of the peghead, a general 3/4 shot and one of the binding in the cutaway.

 

Caveat Emptor...

 

P.

[craigh]

She could be refinished. Usually it's the maple top that's gold & the mahogany back is not painted. I like the TP-6 on her.

 

Craig

[pippy]

She could be refinished. Usually it's the maple top that's gold & the mahogany back is not painted. I like the TP-6 on her.

Craig

 

I agree totally.

 

Furthermore if it has been re-finished it could easily have had the (1992) serial number applied in that fashion.

 

I'd require clarification if I was the prospective buyer.

 

P.

[jsgarry]

Hi and welcome.

 

First off some clarification;

 

The Classic model didn't have the "Made in USA" stamp.

In 1992 the inlays were not green-tinged; these arrived later.

 

The Classic range had serial numbers x-xxx (1989), x-xxxx (1990-1999) or xx-xxxx (2000-2008).

 

The serial number on the instrument pictured would therefore date from 1992, not 2002.

 

There are some signs which would seem back this timeframe up (although it's impossible to be 100% certain from those snaps);

Firstly, the non-green inlays (although it's true some of the later guitars had whiter inlays).

It's difficult to be sure but the silkscreen on the front of the peghead appears to be the right length for 'Les Paul MODEL' rather than 'Les Paul CLASSIC'. In '92 it would have been the former.

The 'Classic' script on the TRC is quite finely stamped. By 1995 this had thickened-up somewhat.

It appears that the '1960' script has been re-touched off the p/g. Why?

 

What do you know of the instrument? Have you seen it in person or just in pictures? Do you know the seller? Who says it's from 2002 and why? Has the guitar been re-finished?

 

There are some original '52 - '57 GTs which were finished in an all-gold colour scheme.

As you suggest; It may be that someone has had this instrument re-finished - perhaps beacause of a peg-head repair.

 

The front shot is of a genuine Gibson Classic - albeit with a Seymour-Duncan in the bridge and a TP-1 tailpiece. The rear shot needs further clarification.

 

I'd ask to see more snaps if I were you. I'd especially like to see a good snap of the front of the peghead, a general 3/4 shot and one of the binding in the cutaway.

 

Caveat Emptor...

 

P.

 

Here is one more picture of the goldtop, now Im not sure if the seller knows the real year the guitar was made.

[pippy]

Oops.

 

Did I type TP-1?

 

I meant to say TP-6.

 

Oh Yes I Did!!!

 

LOL!

 

Apologies for any confusion!

 

P.

[pippy]

jsgarry;

 

I've PM'd you.

 

P.