boles Posted April 4, 2010 Share Posted April 4, 2010 I've been a lurker for a long while here and I enjoy reading all the great messages. Today, I need some advice on how to lower the action on my Custom Les Paul 57 RI 3PU VOS. I have a 2008 Standard that plays great using a straight default factory setup. I didn't have to touch anything. Every string rings and sounds perfect. String height is exceptional. I've had both Les Pauls for about eight months. My 57 Custom arrived from the factory with a string height that feels like my fingers are stepping in and out of tar. I have to raise my fingers so high off the fretboard to hit the next string that I feel like my fingers are running the high hurdles. For a guitar that cost almost twice as much as my 2008 Standard, I am completely disappointed. The action on my 57 Custom is so high, in fact, that when I bend the high E string, my fingers slide UNDER the other strings! My hands and fingers are of average size. I did some reading here and there and I lowered the bridge on my 57 and did a setup. The strings are about half as high now as they were, but they're still about twice as high as the default factory setup on my 2008 Standard. If I lower the bridge any more -- it is almost decked now -- the strings fret out right after the half step on any bend. Is there any way I can lower the action on my Custom 57 even more without taking it in to a pro -- or am I about as low as this guitar will allow me to go? Are the 2008 Standard and 57 Custom such different beasts that you really can't duplicate the setup on one to another? I thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigKahune Posted April 4, 2010 Share Posted April 4, 2010 Have you checked your relief? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boles Posted April 4, 2010 Author Share Posted April 4, 2010 Have you checked your relief? Yes, but by eye only. Both the 2008 Standard and 57 Custom look the same to me. Both necks seems to be straight and share the same relief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwness Posted April 4, 2010 Share Posted April 4, 2010 Welcome to the forum. I think the best would be to take it in for setup. Have them do a complete setup leveling and a crowning the frets. I can't believe Gibson QC has got so lacks. I'd be disappointed too if I'd paid that much on a guitar and it came like that. It should play just like the standard. CW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boles Posted April 4, 2010 Author Share Posted April 4, 2010 Welcome to the forum. I think the best would be to take it in for setup.Have them do a complete setup leveling and a crowning the frets. I can't believe Gibson QC has got so lacks. I'd be disappointed too if I'd paid that much on a guitar and it came like that. It should play just like the standard. CW Yes, I think you're right. The 57 was one of the first electric guitars I purchased after taking a 20 year break from acoustic guitars so I've been living with this non-playable action in a quiet rage. Perhaps I can use the 57 Custom as a slide guitar until I get the time to take it in and pay to have it properly set up for fingers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigKahune Posted April 4, 2010 Share Posted April 4, 2010 Yep. I agree with cwness. After your resonable adjustments, the relief looks okay, but you're getting fret outs, it sounds like you've got some uneven frets. You should have a pro setup to sort the issues out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boles Posted April 4, 2010 Author Share Posted April 4, 2010 Yep. I agree with cwness. After your resonable adjustments' date=' the relief looks okay, but you're getting fret outs, it sounds like you've got some uneven frets. You should have a pro setup to sort the issues out. [/quote'] Okay, thanks. The funny/sad/disgusting part of it all is that I bought the 2008 Standard and fell in love with it so much -- after two telecasters and four strats -- that I bought the 57 Custom a week later thinking, "The 57 has to be twice as good as the 2008 for twice the money, right?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riffster Posted April 4, 2010 Share Posted April 4, 2010 It may be the nut slots being too high, I am sure that a normal setup by a good tech will get the guitar exactly how you want it. I am not sure why anyboby would suggest a fret crown and leveling of a new guitar that they have never seen. It is impossible for factories to set guitars up perfectly, but no doubt they could do a more consistent job. Gibson cuts the nuts to accomodate .09 gauge strings because they do not know what you will use. If you are using .10's then an adjustment of the of the nut is needed to get the guitar right. I set my own guitars but I am not as good as a tech, I just had 2 of my guitars set by a Gibson tech and he did a good job, better than me. He charges low prices so I am going back for a 3rd guitar setup. In the end spending $50 on an initial setup is well worth it IMO. Just use a good tech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boles Posted April 4, 2010 Author Share Posted April 4, 2010 It may be the nut slots being too high' date=' I am sure that a normal setup by a good tech will get the guitar exactly how you want it. I am not sure why anyboby would suggest a fret crown and leveling of a new guitar that they have never seen. It is impossible for factories to set guitars up perfectly, but no doubt they could do a more consistent job. Gibson cuts the nuts to accomodate .09 gauge strings because they do not know what you will use. If you are using .10's then an adjustment of the of the nut is needed to get the guitar right. I set my own guitars but I am not as good as a tech, I just had 2 of my guitars set by a Gibson tech and he did a good job, better than me. He charges low prices so I am going back for a 3rd guitar setup. In the end spending $50 on an initial setup is well worth it IMO. Just use a good tech.[/quote'] I was using 10s on both Les Pauls and recently dropped to 9s. Good to know Gibson sets the nut for 9s. 9s did make each guitar play even better and I didn't have to change anything in the setup on either guitar. The fretting out beyond a half-step bend on the Custom 57 was frustrating because the action was almost perfect -- but it was fretting out at 3 and 5 and 7 and 9 and 15 and 18 for all strings -- so I'm inclined to think it's more a nut job that needs addressing and not a bad fret or two. Pushing the bridge up just a bit from that almost perfection will give me a full step bend, but the action feels so much higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwness Posted April 4, 2010 Share Posted April 4, 2010 I am not sure why anyboby would suggest a fret crown and leveling of a new guitar that they have never seen. Stiff did you read what he has checked and done already. I guess not and if you don't think some new Gibson need fret leveling you your plain wrong. I have EVERY guitar I own frets leveled if you don't know why I won't explain it. CW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riffster Posted April 4, 2010 Share Posted April 4, 2010 Stiff did you read what he has checked and done already. I guess not and if you don't think some new Gibson needfret leveling you your plain wrong. I have EVERY guitar I own frets leveled if you don't know why I won't explain it. CW Don't fuc*ing patronize me... Did you read anything about checking the nut before my initial response? My advice was to look at the nut since he does not seem to mention it, if the nut is too high and you lower the bridge you'll get string buzz inevitably. Whether you get your guitar frets leveled or not is not something I give a fu*k about, so please don't explain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yaff Posted April 5, 2010 Share Posted April 5, 2010 Okay' date=' thanks. The funny/sad/disgusting part of it all is that I bought the 2008 Standard and fell in love with it so much -- after two telecasters and four strats -- that I bought the 57 Custom a week later thinking, "The 57 has to be twice as good as the 2008 for twice the money, right?"[/quote'] In my opinion, you are paying "twice" as much, to get a "custom" made, non standard guitar. At it`s not the main production model, it takes additional time to make and they are only going to do this if they can make a significant profit. Arguably. then skills of the guys in the Custom Shop could be better than the main factory, but I think the state of mind of the individual on the day etc, also has a big impact on the end result. We all have off days, when we are in a rush or just not at out best. I suppose that's why we much try before we buy. I would also say, when you are talking about high quality products, the cost increase is not equal to improved quality. For example, adding a Pained red line on one of the Ferrari cars cost £5,000. It only cost maybe £100 to add, but people will pay the additional cost to be exclusive. There was a component on my mountain bike that weights 250 grams and cost£40. I replaced it with an almost identical part, that weighed 190 grams, paying almost £80 for the pleasure! The point is, just because you pay twice as much, you don't get twice the product. I think your 08 Standard could be equal to your 57 Custom, dependent on what you are looking for. Hope this makes sense and sorry if a I have drifted off the point a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowdown Posted April 5, 2010 Share Posted April 5, 2010 Boles,welcome mate... sounds very much to me like a combination of 1. a bad nut (Gibson are rife with with it) 2. bridge height adjustment & 3. neck relief...but my money's on the nut... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capntucker Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 Truss rod adjustment!!! Hey.......don't be afraid of doing that yourself. Go watch some good you tube videos on setup. I do all my adjustments now and for others. Its very simple but time consuming. Just take your time and never turn truss rod but a quarter of a turn each time and if feels very tight, then take to pro. I've bought 2 LPs and 2 SGJs in the last 8 months. You feather touch my strings and no buzz and intonation right on. Don't pay someone to do a simple job. Just watch about 20 different videos from pros. on you Tube...you'll be fine. Yes......Gibsons final inspection SUCKS!!!!!! 3 out of my NEW Gibsons was pretty good. The best was the cheaper SGJ! Smoked my $2700 LP until "I" adjusted myself. That's why you get truss rod tool with new Gibsons. They know you can learn how to adjust yourself!!! Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjsinla Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 Stiff did you read what he has checked and done already. I guess not and if you don't think some new Gibson need fret leveling you your plain wrong. I have EVERY guitar I own frets leveled if you don't know why I won't explain it. CW Wow. That seems pretty extreme for new guitars I would call that a warranty issue. The guy who started this thread needs to have his 57 checked out by an authorized Gibson repair shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Farnsbarns Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 Fretting out on bends at the 18th fret can not be sorted, or even effected by the nut or the truss rod. It can only be the bridge height or fret levels. Even if the nut and relief need attention they will never effect this part of the issue. If you have the bridge very low then you could sort the choking by raising the bridge. The amount by which you say the strings are too high is not going to be a nut problem (unless it's so low that the high action is required to stop open strings buzzing?) Check the relief, i suspect youll need to pull it way back and raise the bridge, if you still have choking you need a fret level. Also, your nut was cut for 10s, as all LP nuts are from the factory. Gibson fit 10s so they're hardly likely to cut for 9s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 When looking at the OP date saying 04 April 2010, I hope the problem was effectively addressed and solved in the meantime... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimi Mac Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Some people have a knack & an eye for setup... I do not. My tech guy can look at a neck and tell me where it's high or low etc. I just don't see it. He hands it back to me when he's done and it's like a totally different guitar... I change my own strings, and I can set my own intonation, and I even play with pickup pole piece heights with a decibel meter to make consistent volumes across all the strings, but I just cannot see neck/truss-rod adjustment the way many can... A man's got to know his limitations... (in my best Dirty Harry impersonation voice) I've been very lucky to have a tech guy buddy that simply loves tweaking guitars and he's exceptional at it... I get professional setups and he doesn't charge me a thing... I take care of him and am always sending him gift-cards and egift cards online to Sweetwater, Musician's Friend, or GC to keep him happy! He's a miracle worker... He was even able to get "Johnny Reb" (an extremely cantankerous necked Vintage brand VS6 {SG style} axe I own that has a slim neck so bitterly sensitive to temperature and environmental factors that it has to be chased constantly to be playable) in perfect playing action for short periods of time before I relegated it to my slide axe... Find a guy you trust, or ask around by word of mouth and find someone with some good local feedback who will set it up and to an action & neck adjustment job on it for you. We also have a Luthier's Coop nearby that makes it handy/convenient for such things around my parts too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Posted February 20, 2014 Share Posted February 20, 2014 I've been a lurker for a long while here and I enjoy reading all the great messages. Today, I need some advice on how to lower the action on my Custom Les Paul 57 RI 3PU VOS. I have a 2008 Standard that plays great using a straight default factory setup. I didn't have to touch anything. Every string rings and sounds perfect. String height is exceptional. I've had both Les Pauls for about eight months. My 57 Custom arrived from the factory with a string height that feels like my fingers are stepping in and out of tar. I have to raise my fingers so high off the fretboard to hit the next string that I feel like my fingers are running the high hurdles. For a guitar that cost almost twice as much as my 2008 Standard, I am completely disappointed. The action on my 57 Custom is so high, in fact, that when I bend the high E string, my fingers slide UNDER the other strings! My hands and fingers are of average size. I did some reading here and there and I lowered the bridge on my 57 and did a setup. The strings are about half as high now as they were, but they're still about twice as high as the default factory setup on my 2008 Standard. If I lower the bridge any more -- it is almost decked now -- the strings fret out right after the half step on any bend. Is there any way I can lower the action on my Custom 57 even more without taking it in to a pro -- or am I about as low as this guitar will allow me to go? Are the 2008 Standard and 57 Custom such different beasts that you really can't duplicate the setup on one to another? I thank you. without major mods, try lowering the taipiece and topwrapping strings, then adjusting the action to get as low as you can without buzzing. I have a theory that with wear and play, the fairly high frets on my lp will naturally wear down and therefore I'll be able to get lower action on the guitar. hmmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle mud Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Farnsbarns is absolutely right. The nut means nothing after the first fret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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