Mojo Tele Quest

[Mojorule]

So. I have an SJ which makes me feel warm inside. I don't think I'll find a better-sounding acoustic, just a more consistent environment with the degree of humidity that it likes. I also have a Howard Robert Fusion which is one of the most playable electrics I've ever touched. It's also pretty wide-ranging tonally. So two Gibson keepers there.

 

However, the Howard has high output humbuckers. They sound great through my old Fender Pro, but that needs fixing because it impersonates a washing machine. Nice touch responsive borderline clean/broken-up guitar tone in the mix, but the dominant sound is Whirlpool. No gig at present, so in no hurry to spend money and time having a 70W amp fixed when I have a fully functioning VHT Special 6 which suits home playing. The thing is, though, it is really hard to dial in a nicely defined sound from the Howard through the VHT. The amp is Fender-ish, and it has reasonable treble, but with one tone knob it is hard to balance, and it gives good bass too. With the Howard cranked at all it gives too-good bass. So I'm thinking that single coils are the thing here. I also want a second electric guitar that I can take out in all weather without worrying about the nitro checking, that is sturdy and can handle knocks, and that I can play without worrying as the kids and two new kittens run around. That can do warm and jazzy and cutting treble like the Howard, but through the VHT rather than the Fender. Clearly I want a Tele. And besides, every guitarist worthy of the name should have one, right?

 

Thing is, I have no serious disposable income at present. I've watched outgoings over the past year and I know I won't be able to save serious money for this item. I can sell my unloved Epiphone Casino, but while a retailer might mark it up because it is Peerless-built, I don't think I'll get a lot for it. So my options are limited. US and Mexican Fenders are out - even second hand ones are too expensive. A Squier Classic Vibe '50s would be just great, but new they've gone over £400 and that is too much too. I am not despondent, though. I reckon a decent Tele can be had for little money - for me the essence of the Tele is not in the name on the headstock, but in the spec. More so than for any other guitar model, I think.

 

So I've narrowed down to a trio of sub-£300 instruments.

 

1. My link

 

2. My link

 

3. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/iFusion-Tributer-TV61B-Ash-Body-Sonic-Blue-Maple-Neck-Alnico-V-Pickups-/172210064184

 

I've tried a Revelation RTE54. I can probably find a Vintage V52 to try locally if I look hard enough. I can't try the iFusion, because it's only available from the one online outlet, and I don't live close enough to the seller to go round and try. Returns policy is OK, though, and they make a big thing out of fret-dressing and set-up.

 

The Revelation sounded good: a bit ice-picky, but through the VHT it might just cut through nicely. Steel saddles, while most of the really nice-sounding Teles I've played had brass. Which is a way of saying that it didn't sound as good as a Squier CV or Fender American Special. Felt good, had good playability, and was well enough set up, though.

 

The other guitars do come with brass saddles in the form of compensated Wilkinson jobs.

 

My questions to you are:

 

- do you think that it is worth spending £50 more to have compensated brass Wilkinson saddles?

- do you think that alnico 5 single coils are likely to push the bass and low mids too hard for me to get the definition I am hoping for?

- do you think that any of the instruments listed has any obvious winning qualities?

- do you think that any of them has any obvious weaknesses?

- if you had £300 which would you go for?

 

Thanks.

[OldCowboy]

Given that this is the acoustic forum, you might do better to post this on one of the more electric-oriented ones.

[Dave F]

There's been a few real good Tele strings in the Gibson Lounge. There's a lot of Tele fans (including me) over there.

[Buc McMaster]

Went thru a Tele phase back in the day.......Fender, ESP and home brews........very iconic instrument design. Of the three you linked, the iFusion is obviously a more traditional Tele and, all other things being equal, would make it my choice. No one three-saddle bridge is going to be any more compensated than another, brass or steel. I preferred the all-thread saddles of the original design, but they're all functional.........perhaps slightly tonally different, but such nuances are often lost in the amplification. An ash body is often considered superior to alder (the V52 link) but that's a personal thing, ash being harder and thereby a bit brighter, generally speaking. Pickup height can make a big difference in Tele tone so experiment with that for cut and attack.

 

Online buying is a crap shoot but a good return policy is comforting............don't settle for less than a good one! If you make any angle adjustments don't over-tighten the neck bolts. G'luck!

[BluesKing777]

Trying to make sense of the thing here, Moje. You have a $3000 plus Fusion but want to buy a £300 Tele copy junker because your Fender amp needs a repair?

 

I would be sinking that money into the amp repair or, test of commitment, selling the Fusion and buying a full blooded Tele with specs to suit.

 

That's my piece.

 

 

On a similar subject, which is the recent Tele with the big V neck and wide nut? I saw something recently about it, not sure where, may have been a magazine. Could have been a Custom Relic or the like. That would almost interest me, the skinny old Tele I own too narrow for much fingerpicking! (72 Custom with Seth Lover humbucker that I bought in about 73).

 

 

BluesKing777.

[EuroAussie]

Id love to help but Im useless with electrics. I have a '95 Les Paul that Mrs EA bought me some 8 years ago as a bday present - my first ever Gibson. Play it once a year.

[mountainpicker]

I'm with BluesKing777 in the confusion department. First off I'd like to see a picture of your Howard Roberts as I think they are one of the most beautiful electric guitars ever made and while Telecasters are versatile guitars Howard Roberts himself was capable of pulling all kinds of sounds out of his signature instrument. I'd spend the money you're looking at dropping into a Tele clone on either a new amp or getting your old one back in gigging condition. But GAS manifests in mysterious and convoluted ways.

[Mojorule]

Given that this is the acoustic forum, you might do better to post this on one of the more electric-oriented ones.

 

Yes, but as I said in the Troll-la-la thread, I really value the advice from people on the Acoustic section. I'm not sure I'd have got Buc's input on the electric sections...

 

Went thru a Tele phase back in the day.......Fender, ESP and home brews........very iconic instrument design. Of the three you linked, the iFusion is obviously a more traditional Tele and, all other things being equal, would make it my choice. No one three-saddle bridge is going to be any more compensated than another, brass or steel. I preferred the all-thread saddles of the original design, but they're all functional.........perhaps slightly tonally different, but such nuances are often lost in the amplification. An ash body is often considered superior to alder (the V52 link) but that's a personal thing, ash being harder and thereby a bit brighter, generally speaking. Pickup height can make a big difference in Tele tone so experiment with that for cut and attack.

 

Online buying is a crap shoot but a good return policy is comforting............don't settle for less than a good one! If you make any angle adjustments don't over-tighten the neck bolts. G'luck!

 

 

Many thanks for your input, Buc. Must confess that the iFusion is the one which I keep going back to. Bone nuts and heel-adjust truss rods in this day and age: seems they have some care for tradition or at least detail. Mind you, it's clearly not the case that Custom Teles with one-piece maple necks/boards were the norm in 1961, so I think there's a bit of baloney going on too.

 

Those brass Trevor Wilkinson saddles are squared off and angled, so that each barrel has two different edges, the idea being that you can differentiate the contact point within each pair of strings, as well as between them. Do you reckon that this is an irrelevance in practice? I have to say most of the Teles I've tried have decent-enough intonation, and so far they've all had straightforward barrel saddles, or else a modern 6-saddle non-ashtray bridge.

 

Useful advice on not over-tightening the neck bolts. Sounds as though you might have learned from experience there.

 

Trying to make sense of the thing here, Moje. You have a $3000 plus Fusion but want to buy a £300 Tele copy junker because your Fender amp needs a repair?

 

I would be sinking that money into the amp repair or, test of commitment, selling the Fusion and buying a full blooded Tele with specs to suit.

 

That's my piece.

 

 

On a similar subject, which is the recent Tele with the big V neck and wide nut? I saw something recently about it, not sure where, may have been a magazine. Could have been a Custom Relic or the like. That would almost interest me, the skinny old Tele I own too narrow for much fingerpicking! (72 Custom with Seth Lover humbucker that I bought in about 73).

BluesKing777.

 

Well you both have a point BK and MP. I've rationalized along those lines for a while now, but I've still not managed to get the amp fixed, and I think ultimately Tele GAS has got the better of me. I was looking to buy one before the HRF came my way, so it's been a number of years now. Gibson slope GAS took precedence for a while, and the playability of the HRF has also always alleviated it a bit. But not completely. And there are a number of other factors too.

 

Even with the master volume low, the Fender is loud. The VHT can be loud too, but it can be turned down. So I really think of the Fender as a gigging amp. I don't want to sell it, because I want to return to gigging at some point, and will regret not having the Fender at that stage. But my current job is unpredictable in terms of timings, and my kids also lead quite hectic lives which require my taxi driving, so I'm finding it hard to commit to a band at present. If I get the Fender fixed now, it still won't get used a lot in the short term. So while it would never be money wasted, it would be investment in a future project which might be some time away.

 

Just as I'm not ready to sell the Fender, I'm definitely not ready to test commitment to full-blooded Tele worship by selling the HRF. I know I would regret selling it. Firstly, like Ozmeister's Les Paul, it was a gift, though in my case from a very generous relative. So although it is mine, I feel more like its curator than its owner. Secondly, I wanted a good Gibson semi for even longer than I've wanted a Tele. And it is a great Gibson semi. And thirdly, it just has the best neck I've ever played. I play it a fair amount at present, just almost always unplugged. So in the long run, I see myself gigging with the HRF and the Fender.

 

In the short term, though, I want to practise plugged in more, using something that will work with my practice amp. The VHT is also very good in its genre, just not a great match for the Fusion. To be honest, though, I don't think many Class A valve practice amps would be a better match for the Fusion. So my sense is that a Tele fits the bill in that it hopefully won't push the bass end of the VHT so hard. A cheap Tele fits because I can leave it round the house without worrying too much - it would be to hand just to plug in and play, whereas I would never be comfortable leaving the Fusion out of its case like that with our kids and kittens running round. And when I do get back to gigging, I also think that a Tele would be a good spare guitar for venues where I'd fear for the Gibson. To my ears, Teles cover a lot of the ground that semis cover, despite having their own unique sound. And yes, I've just wanted a Tele for a long time.

 

Not sure I see the point in spending big bucks on a full-blooded Fender Tele, though, even if I had the money (or sold the HRF). For a start the specs that I like ('50s-style bridge, through-body stringing and pickups, traditional non-contoured slab body, modern flatter neck radius) are not available on the Standard or Deluxe series models. A lot of Custom Shop jobs do have that sort of spec, but they're more expensive than the HRF - and probably double what I'd get for the HRF in part-exchange. I'm sure they're fabulous instruments, but the entire principle behind the Tele was that it should be plank with a neck screwed onto it, a mass-produced thing which just works well because it's well designed. What can you possibly do to a plank + bolt-on neck to make it worth £2000? Get Carl Faberge to paint it maybe. At that price point, I feel like more craftsmanship and care has gone into my HRF.

 

True my preferred specs are available on the American Special series, but that now costs almost as much as the Standard series. And for about a third of the price, I can get something which has similar spec and similar quality hardware from a less famous maker. Personally, I'm not too fussed about the difference between alder, ash and pine, but if somebody is offering an ash-bodied Tele for 75% of the price of a pine-bodied Chinese Squier or 40% of the price of an alder-bodied US Fender, I'm quite tempted to give it a go. How much effort do any of these makers really put into wood selection for Teles? And even if they do, how much difference does it really make?

['Scales]

Hey man, apologies if its already been covered above, but why not just go for the Squier Classic Vibe on the 0% finance if cash is a bit tight now, and when some money comes along then just pay it off?

[Buc McMaster]

Those brass Trevor Wilkinson saddles........ Do you reckon that this is an irrelevance in practice?

 

Useful advice on not over-tightening the neck bolts. Sounds as though you might have learned from experience there.

 

How much effort do any of these makers really put into wood selection for Teles? And even if they do, how much difference does it really make?

 

Pretty much a non-factor on the saddles. After all one saddle is compensating two strings, taking fine tuning out of the equation. But hey, it's a Telecaster......it is what it is, ya know?

 

Neck bolts? Yeah, I had to toothpick a hole or two many years back.

 

Fender and some of the high-end knockoffs are selective when the finish will be natural or translucent, and those are usually ash. I personally don't think ash, poplar, pine or alder makes much difference in tone at all, at least not to the point of being audible to the player when amplified. Each wood has character.......Harrison's rosewood, for example. And I do think it makes a difference in how a particular Tele might feel. I've had some alder body Telecasters that, played acoustically, felt almost alive with resonance. Had a Fender '52 butterscotch reissue (ash) that sounded nearly dead acoustically but really cut when amplified.

 

 

[BluesKing777]

Well, nothing for it but a Tele then, Mojo!

 

 

It would be nice to save a few coins and get a nice one though. You might be lucky, but I don't think you would be happy with a cheapie. Maybe aim a bit higher for a Mexican made Tele.

 

 

Off on a tangent, as memories of Tele buying flow past the nodes, I had a horrible little amp called a Coronet or something when I first bought my Tele Custom and when I used it in a band it became obvious that it wouldn't cut it. So the big gig at the yacht club got the hire amp from the place I bought the Tele. Which also sucked.

 

So as soon as I had enough cash, I bought the dream Fender amp, except it was the larger, heavier 180 watt Super something. And as you are talking about, it needed to be LOUD to get a decent Tele tone.....like ear peeling blistering filthy loud! That fixed the drummer, but it was not much for home practice as you say.

 

I lugged that thing around for a few years and I joined a band of Marshalls, I mean the guitar and bass liked loud, loud Marshalls ..... and unbelievably, the Fender wasn't cutting it as it went to super bass or something at that volume and using a distortion box to get that rock sound mucked up the band mix because all you could hear was ME. Well I like it. But everyone waved their arms at me all the time so a strange swap deal with me getting an old Marshall SuperLead and off went the Fender. And the Tele sounded HUGE but again, no good for practice and awful to lug that amp and cabinet around.

 

Luckily for my hearing, the band fell apart just as the cone in my speaker blew straight out past me at a gig, and that speaker cab was a coffee table for many years BECAUSE:

 

- I bought the Mesa Boogie 22 Calibre 22 Watt amp, a hot rodded Fender Princeton style little amp, and I still have it. Great amp - great for mic'd sounds in blues bands, great for practice at home, great, great, great. And no boxes - Tele in Open E, grab the slide and hit the loud button, wow. Tone tone tone. (Holding my slide collection and a few straps currently.)

 

Tele was going to get sold, but the Better Half said I should keep it because of it has all my old band history, or something. So I did!

 

 

 

BluesKing777.