Guest Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Iconoclast....thanks for the info! I sure looks US-made' date=' and the serial number is punched-into the wood like the US-made models, but when I did the research, it seemed that some of these were made offshore, so that's what I was basing my opinion on, but I really didn't know. I found it in anacoustic shop in Central PA, circa 1977, but really had no information on it's origins. Just a really nice guitar, built like a tank, for an acoustic. The tailpiece doesn't appear to be original, although I've seen others with a similar tailpiece. It might have shipped with a more conventional Epiphone trapeze on it. And, I've seen some guys who have converted the bridges to top (bridge) loaders, but I've left it as I found it. Surely one I'll never sell.[/quote'] If it has the pressed in serial number then there's no doubt..It's a Kalamazoo-made Epiphone and I'd guess it was made between 1968-1970. I can't say I've seen a lot of sunburst ones...nice guitar and I wouldn't sell it either. ...and Al's your uncle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Icono....it's a set-neck, but when I got it, the tailpiece appears to have other filled holes around it, so I'm not sure about the originality of the tailpiece. The tailpiece says "Made in Germany" on it. I have seen others with the same tailpiece, as in the photo below. I suppose, at this point, I should consider this a collector guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Icono....it's a set-neck' date=' but when I got it, the tailpiece appears to have other filled holes around it, so I'm not sure about the originality of the tailpiece. The tailpiece says "Made in Germany" on it. I have seen others with the same tailpiece, as in the photo below. I suppose, at this point, I should consider this a collector guitar. [img']http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc200/pgazzara/67Epiphone12-String.jpg[/img] Starting in the late 60's/early 70's Gibson sourced a lot of machine heads and hardware from Schaller...hence the "Made In Germany"...it looks like others I've seen so it's likely original and yes, I'd consider it very much a 60's vintage instrument worthy of protection and preservation..."collector guitar" is too ambiguous a term... ...and Al's your uncle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Icono....any idea of it's value? Does it need to be insured? Until now, it's been in my guitar closet with a dozen or so (less interesting) guitars. (well maybe one or two other interesting oldies) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rainbowgirl22 Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 i dont think epis get a bad rap. The crowd cannot tell whether its a gibson or epi. hell' date=' the only people u would bash an epi would be some guitar snob in the crowd. you think the chicks in the crowd care? They dont know what a gibson or epi is! Always play what u like, not the name on the headstock.[/quote'] wow your mistaken. i can tell the difference between an epi and a gibby very well :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suicidehummer Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 It's hard for me to describe, but I think that Epis feel more blocky and lazer-cut, whereas Gibsons feel more natural and smooth. All I know is that when I go to Guitar Center, I don't want to stop playing the Gibsons! (Especially through Marshalls) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickblues1 Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 Well I think a lot has to do with conditioning. If you hear something repeated ofter enough you will believe it. As in Epi Bad - Gibby good. Stock pickup bad - 200.00 pickup good. Your all brainwashed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prospero Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 You can't win. There's always someone... Korean Epis are better than Chinese Epis... elitists are better than regular Epis... Gibsons are better than all Epis... Custom Shop Gibsons are better than regular Gibsons... Vintage Gibsons are better than Custom Shop Gibsons... '50s Gibsons are better than all other Vintage Gibsons... 59 is better than 58... April is better than May... if yours was made on a Tuesday it sucks. It never ends. There will invariably be someone who says that yours (no matter what it is) is crap, and his (more expensive one) is obviously better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JEPI Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 Well I think a lot has to do with conditioning. If you hear something repeated ofter enough you will believe it. As in Epi Bad - Gibby good. Stock pickup bad - 200.00 pickup good. Your all brainwashed. Nick - I think you're right. Before I joined this forum I thought my stock pups were good enough for me, and the more I read, a lot of folks here say the same thing. "If they sound good to you, don't change 'em". But now I'm really curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickblues1 Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 That's exactly what I mean. You have now been successfully conditioned (brainwashed). Welcome to the 1984 Forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hbucker Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 Just a couple of thoughts: 1. There is a difference between saying guitar A is a better quality product than guitar B. ...and... Guitar A is awesome and guitar B sucks! Unfortunately the latter is the technique most often used in these forums. It's wrong, inaccurate and juvenile. Even though guitar B may not be a better over all product than guitar A, it may be the better value for many. The Chevy vs. Lexus comparison seems appropriate here. 2. If you like your stock pickups then that's all that is important. But the most immediate and inexpensive way to change your guitar's tone is by changing the pickups. Changing out hardware is not about thumbing one's nose at the manufacturer or some loyal cult of users. It's about making the guitar your own. And I don't think there is anything wrong with it. What is wrong is people making you feel flawed for not wanting to tinker with your guitar. It's yours. Do what you want with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerxst1281733995 Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 If you like your stock pickups then that's all that is important. But the most immediate and inexpensive way to change your guitar's tone is by changing the pickups. Changing out hardware is not about thumbing one's nose at the manufacturer or some loyal cult of users. It's about making the guitar your own. And I don't think there is anything wrong with it. What is wrong is people making you feel flawed for not wanting to tinker with your guitar. It's yours. Do what you want with it. I agree... I have a Casino and (now) a Dot... I don't really want to change anything on the Casino... (Except' date=' maybe the bridge.. it's got the infamous buzz sometimes) And I [u']love[/u] the sound of the stock P-90's... Everyone says "Ya gotta get the KA P-90's for the Casino...", but I'm thrilled with the way it sounds as-is... I'm afraid to change anything! The Dot, on the other hand, definitely needs better pups... To my ears, anyway.. Some folks say the stock pups sound good in the Dot, but I'm not satisfied with them... The neck pup still sounds muddy, even lowered flush to the pickup ring and the bridge just sounds "OK"... Not really bad, but nothing great.. But if I thought they sounded good to me, I'd keep it stock... Just like the Casino... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad1 Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 Sounds like nobody's been washing your brain Lerxst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerxst1281733995 Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 Sounds like nobody's been washing your brain Lerxst. Actually' date=' it could [i']use[/i] a good washin' from time to time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad1 Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 Sometimes my mind is a little dirty too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noobzilla Posted February 28, 2008 Author Share Posted February 28, 2008 Yeah... But.... Every other weekend it is nice to take out the ole corvette convertible and take it out for a spin... Ive taken the corvette out of the garage for that spin twice in the last 3 months only to have the vette break down 2 blocks from the driveway... ON STAGE.... Im glad I had the epi backstage for a quick change.. When youre being paid , its embarassing as hell.. I always thought the Gibson was over rated, but I still paid 3x for em...and for what...a silly logo... Even the paint on my Epis is better... Gibsons always have that laquer finish to em, like some 100 year old house trim, outdated.. my Epis shine like a mirror. Id love to see more artists show the epi on stage... send gibson a message... so what if its made in china..korea..wherever... 1/3 the price for the same bang.. me love you long time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickblues1 Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 I see Cooper A/Bing the Gibby 335 and the Dot on UTube and the tone is close to my ears. Now I am not hearing them live so I know there is a bit more of a difference. But in a live gig only the players know. Lots of Pro musicians don't gig with the same guitar they record on. I have a really good sounding Dot. And I have had thoughts of getting high end PU replacements. But then I play it and I really like the tone of the stock pups, and that thought passes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayGLongBeach Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 Ive taken the corvette out of the garage for that spin twice in the last 3 months only to have the vette break down 2 blocks from the driveway... ON STAGE.... Alright bro, point taken... it is a shame when it has to happen on stage... and i'm right there with you about standing up for your EPI! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 I think the same comparisions can be made for a lot of import vs american made goods nowdays. Offshore manufacturing is getting better all the time. There was a time when Japanese mfg was considered "junk". Now it is preferred in most instances. Low voltage electrical wiring doesn't have to be that large. 18 gauge wire and even 22 gauge wire is sufficient. The runs are short and there's no current being carried to speak of, It's shielding that is important. Now, your 20 foot guitar cable can benefit from larger wire diameters because of long run losses. I think that Gibson is still using more expensive woods and higher paid technicians to make and assemble their guitars. That said, I would compare a Gibby LP to a Fender Strat. You can buy a USA Strat for almost half the price of the LP. They should be similar in price for similar finishes. A flametop should cost more, but you don't see much of that in a Fender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hbucker Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 I would compare a Gibby LP to a Fender Strat. You can buy a USA Strat for almost half the price of the LP. They should be similar in price for similar finishes. A flametop should cost more' date=' but you don't see much of that in a Fender.[/quote'] I actually disagree with this. The LP, with its set neck and laminated top, requires more hand work and attention to detail than a bolt neck. This in no way describes which I like better because both have their place IMO. But there's no question in my mind that with everything else being equal, the LP will cost more to manufacture. Now, 3+ times more to manufacture...? I don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tulsaslim Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 Over on the Gibson forum they're having a great time ridiculing some guy who contended that "Elitists are superior to production Gibsons in every way". I can't agree with that statement, of course, but was tempted to add that 'whereas that statement is pretty ridiculous it's also not correct to assume that elitists are significantly inferior to the production Gibbys'. I did, however, decide to just let it go since I didn't want to start a war I couldn't win, considering the environment. I do consider the elitists to be on a par with the production Gibbys (not 'superior in every way, however) but nobody who paid 2 1/2 times more for their Gibby than I paid for my elitists will ever accept that. Invariably somebody over there would contend that the 'African mahogany vs. Honduran mahogany' and the 'plastic' finishes on the elitists made it necessary for them to spend the $2500 for their Gib. And that's ok with me. If the African mahogany & nitro finish was worth $1500 to them, well, to each his own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RotcanX Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 But there's no question in my mind that with everything else being equal' date=' the LP will cost more to manufacture. Now, 3+ times more to manufacture...? I don't think so. [/quote'] Think harder. A Strat body can be cut and routed in about an hour. A Les Paul, with a book-matched maple top, binding takes a lot more than three times as long. Then you have a complicated finish with a different colour used on the back (which, being mahogany, requires additional prep because of the open grain) followed by the burst top, all keeping in mind that the neck has to be finished at the same time... then you have to scrape all that paint off the binding before applying clear coats... a lot more time-consuming than any Fender. The neck situation is even more pronounced... you have to bind the fingerboard and rout out the trapezoids plus apply a separate veneer and inlaid logo (not some cheep decal) to the headstock... and that fancy tenon takes a lot of effort to cut to shape and then fit properly to the body. I dunno where you're getting that 3X figure from anyway. A Les Paul Standard is what, about $2300 Cdn these days, while a decent American Strat is going to go for at least $1200. Now who is ripping off whom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RotcanX Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 Over on the Gibson forum they're having a great time ridiculing some guy who contended that "Elitists are superior to production Gibsons in every way" Yeah, that guy is off base. An Elitist is.. equivalent to a Gibson IMO. It's not the same, since there are differences in materials (African vs Honduran mahogany, poly vs lacquer finish, etc.). In some ways better (the finish is without any of the flaws one will usually find on a Gibson) in other ways worse (that veneered flametop is a bit of a disappointment)... but, with eyes closed, the differences become very small indeed. Superior in every way? No. But I do think you get performance on par with a Gibson and you get to save some money. Not 2 and 1/2 times... in fact the LP Standard Faded was exactly the same price for a while... but you do save close to a grand compared to an LP Standard. It would have been interesting to see GP do one of those "Fight Club" comparisons between an Elitist LP and Gibson Standard... as opposed to that ludicrous comparison between a regular Epi and a Gibson VOS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matiac Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 I don't need no stinkin Gibson. I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tulsaslim Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 Yeah, I was disappointed that they discontinued the elitist LP Standard (with the full maple cap) in favor of the LP Standard Plus (with the veneer). Fortunately I own two of the 'old' standards with the full cap. I, too, consider them to be pretty much equal to the production Gibbys. I base this conclusion largely on the fact that I own both & get to compare them on a daily basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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