Rollie LeBay Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 I just wasted some time over at gbase by searching the acoustic guitar category for the word "vintage". Of 239 returns on the search, about 52 of them were actually old. Far fewer than these were anything other than old junk. That's 22% of the "vintage" returns that were actually even old. And that leaves us with 187 returns, or 78% of the results, that used the word "vintage" but were not actually old. To paraphrase Waylon Jennings, don't you think this "vintage" bit's done got out of hand? Are there any "non-vintage" guitars left on Earth? Or has everything been painted orange with aging toner and equipped with open gear tuners? And BTW, does anyone know what a guitar painted with aging toner looks like when it gets to be 50 years old? What if they turn that avocado color that appliances and bathroom fixtures were in the late 60s and early 70s? What then? I'm sick of the word "vintage". I'm rebelling. Most "vintage" guitars aren't even old, and the ones that are have been driven to absurd prices by collectors who don't even play them. Aging toner should be banned immediately! I have an Epiphone Masterbilt DR-500P that's a great guitar, but it has a dark orange top with pale blond sides and back! If they had left off the toner and gone with natural spruce color, it would be beautiful, but now it looks like the results of a malicious practical joke! It's a shame, because the tone and playability are terrific! I want something modern, with no aging toner, smooth, sealed tuners, and no mention of the word "vintage" in the name! Uncle Buck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jefleppard Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 i agree. nice rant, too btw. it actually has good meter and it reminded me, slightly, of the huey lewis song 'i want a new drug'. back to topic...maybe the word "vintaged" would be more appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Agree with you on the aging toner bit, Unc. I dislike its use -- would rather let a guitar acquire its own aging, vibe, or (that oh-so-overused-word) "mojo" honestly. On the custom orders I've put through to the folks in Bozeman, I have specifically asked them to please NOT use the vintaged toner. I don't have a picture of it handy, but my (relatively early) Sheryl Crow model is so toned-up with the stuff, it looks like a pumpkin that someone left at a tanning salon too long. Talk about 'soaking up the sun'! Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewilyfool Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Buck along with these faithful tags to ebay items with similar misrepresentation as "vintage": 1. My loss is your gain 2. Damage on guitar adds to "mojo" 3. This is one of the best guitars I have ever played 4. The "list" price on this guitar is $xxx, you can save $yyy dollars!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksdaddy Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 This is what aging toner looks like after 27 years. One of the sexiest guitars I own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rscott4079 Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 Ha! You guys who rag on vintage guitars don't fool me - you say "want something modern" with "no mention of the word "vintage" in the name" - but you hang out at Gbase looking up vintage gear. Uh huh, and I bet you read Playboy for the articles too.... Oh, I believe you when you say you love your new guitars. But I know what happens after you've set your pure, shiny, unblemished musical lady in her stand for the night. You lay your head down on your pillow, and you secretly dream of a girl whose "been around" a little bit. One with a little "experience". As your dear, virginal, 6-stringed love sleeps nearby, you dream of one that's been with rough characters in seedy places, and has seen things that "nice" guitars aren't supposed to see. Oh you naughty boy. Naughty, naughty boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rollie LeBay Posted June 2, 2008 Author Share Posted June 2, 2008 Ha! You guys who rag on vintage guitars don't fool me - you say "want something modern" with "no mention of the word "vintage" in the name" - but you hang out at Gbase looking up vintage gear. Uh huh' date=' and I bet you read Playboy for the articles too.... Oh, I believe you when you say you love your new guitars. But I know what happens after you've set your pure, shiny, unblemished musical lady in her stand for the night. You lay your head down on your pillow, and you secretly dream of a girl whose "been around" a little bit. One with a little "experience". As your dear, virginal, 6-stringed love sleeps nearby, you dream of one that's been with rough characters in seedy places, and has seen things that "nice" guitars aren't supposed to see. Oh you naughty boy. Naughty, naughty boy.[/quote'] ROFLMAO! All right, cut that out! You almost made me pass a whole glass of lemonade through my nose! Uncle Buck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballcorner Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 I have a Martin HD-28V that has all the disgusting vintage appointments you can imagine - aging toner, butterbean open gear heads, herringbone and the blocky points on the corners of the headstock. I hate all of it, BUT the guitar is the most incredible sounding instrument I have ever owned for pure tone and volume. My ears have more interest in music than my eyes. If the guitar turns green with purple polka dots in 27 years but sounds even better than it does today, you can add pink pom poms on the headstock and I will still smile while I play it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewilyfool Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 Hey Ballcorner...... Your post reminded me of a joke..... Why do Mormon women stop having kids at 30? Because 31 kids would just be too much!!! 32 guitars???? I thought you swore in another post that you were going to stop at 30!!! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballcorner Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 32 guitars???? I can explain!!!! I worked in a "vintage" store and the owner didn't mind taking in current model guitars but he wouldn't sell them in the store. So, I basically became a dealer out of my home by buying the guitars he took in for their trade value (if I wanted the piece, of course) and doing some repairs etc. and re-selling them. I took the money I made from this venture and started buying aged stock out of the store. Maybe he would have a 50s Martin that nobody would throw the cash on, so I would get it at a reduced price with the intention of re-selling it down the road. The Canadian dollar began to grow in value, and over a period of several years my "collection" lowered in value by about 33% - because my original plan was to eventually sell things on eBay for US dollars that were $1.60 Canadian and it was the exchange that created profits for me, rather than value increases. So, I am basically left holding the bag with instruments that wouldn't sell for much more than I paid for them (some exceptions) so it makes more sense to use them with my recording gear to help friends make good demos and that sort of thing. To make sure the guitars get played I have a weekly jam session that is very popular. Admission is an acceptable pack of strings, for which the person gets to play a bunch of cool guitars, use quality mics (Audio Technica), and perhaps do some off the floor recording on the cheap. (I can often sell D'Addario strings at the door for $5 if someone shows up empty handed, and I have let many in without a 'ticket'). Now, if I sell the guitars it starts to lower the interest in my jam sessions (I have grown to really enjoy the guitars and the people) and I wouldn't really generate enough money to change anything in my life except perhaps to own a fancy car instead of my wonderfully humble new Toyota Yaris. So, where the guitars are being played and appreciated and impeccably kept in a climate controlled house (not just one room) with great acoustics - and where the collection is assembled and available to recording artists (I rent out to the right people) it has basically become a nice thing in my life - a happy accident, if you will. We get people to the jams ranging from 11 years old to 81. We play all kinds of music. We all learn and we all teach each other. We have enough fun that drinking or smoking aren't necessary, though I have seen a set of bloodshot eyes here and there, and everyone looks forward to coming on Friday nights. To quit all that now, and perhaps raise around $100,000, is not going to let me quit my day job. So, here I sit with everyone else paying for the strings to keep the collection fresh, playable and enjoyable and we are all having a good time. I own six guitars I consider mine - not part of the collection but are included in the 32. They are my '05 AJ, '77 Hummingbird, '02 Martin OM-21, '06 Martin HD-28V, '03 Art and Lutherie Cedar AMI ($230) and a 2007 Chinese made Thinline Vintage Telecaster ($269). Oddly enough, all of these guitars have been bought from my regular weekly paycheques -- earned working as a case maker - with the more expensive guitars purchased through payment plans. Every cent that I have put into recording gear, guitars, books, lessons and strings is the result of savings from giving up cigarettes in 2001, which in my region are now $11 per pack. When people say they wish they could own my guitars, I always wonder what they could part with in their lives to free up that $125 a month that gets you the guitar of your dreams. What I never realized I was buying was an incredible social musical experience that grows and gains in value every week. So, let's say I own 6 guitars and my community supports the other 26. This is where the Mormon children analogy seems to work so well. Ten years ago, I owned one guitar - a 1974 Yamaki Deluxe - and after I put a new nut and saddle on this cedar topped wonder along with a set of proper tuners (Grovers) I thought it was all that and a bag of chips and I played it every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballcorner Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 Oh, I almost forgot. Hey Uncle Buck - are there really articles in Playboy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rscott4079 Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 1935 Gibson Trojan - 1957 Gibson J-200 - 1977 Gibson Hummingbird - 2005 Gibson Advanced Jumbo - and 28 non-Gibson guitars. There's a lady on our street like that. Only she has cats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballcorner Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 There's a lady on our street like that. Only she has cats. LOL - thanks for that one!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honky Dog Posted September 13, 2008 Share Posted September 13, 2008 Did Gibson ever "tone down" the aging toner on the Sheryl Crow. I saw one in a store and it was a really intense yellow that I didn't particularly care for. I like the look of ksdaddy's guitar and the color of Hiatt's SJ-200 on the cover of Acoustic Guitar. But that yellow on the Sheryl, well it was a just a bit too much for me. I have seen some on-line pictures recently where the Sheryl model looks pretty nice, but of course, online pictures can be deceiving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thermionik Posted September 14, 2008 Share Posted September 14, 2008 Don't know if you have them Stateside - but we are blighted in the UK by a brand called 'Vintage'. Hacked me off the other day when a guy who knows I like guitars called and said he had ''a vintage Les Paul in very good condition'' from a house clearance. I got in the car and drove straight over, only to find a rather poor, run of the mill LP copy from China or somewhere east of the tea-plantations with the legend Vintage in Gibson-like script accross the headstock. Oh boy, was I down in the dumps. Almost as bad as the company they called 'Harmony est: 1892' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted September 14, 2008 Share Posted September 14, 2008 Acoustics have their "vintage" models and electrics their "relics." I remember when the word vintage was use only when discussing wines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrorod Posted September 14, 2008 Share Posted September 14, 2008 Don't sweat the VINTAGE hype! YOU know whats vintage and what ain't. Zero in on what you want and skip the rest. I think its funny as hell about all the 'vintage re-issues'.....I don,t care one I-ota about a vintage re-issue. Either its OLD or it AIN'T! If it ain't...its new or used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewilyfool Posted September 15, 2008 Share Posted September 15, 2008 It's like "VINTAGE clothing stores", those used to be called "good will", the more things change the more things seem to stay the same.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modoc_333 Posted September 15, 2008 Share Posted September 15, 2008 the funny thing is that the word now has the opposite meaning. these days, if it really is a "vintage guitar" in that good way that we think of them, then the seller will simply tell you the year and model.... the word "vintage" rarely appears in the ad. if a seller actually uses the word "vintage" then you can be pretty sure that's he's just trying to overcharge while unloading some junk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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