acewarslave Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 had a bloke say that im not doing my gibson justice by using my crappy marshall vs100..amp. never had a valve drivin amp so i cant really say if its true or not..your thoughts would be handy.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxman Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 I heard all the things you are hearing - tube amps are where it's at, you will not believe the difference, only the pros use tube amps amateurs use solid state.... So after 15 years of playing a solid state amp, I finally bought myself a "proper" amp -- a tube amp. Now here is the honesty that you don't get from others.....solid sate vs. tube -- it is not that much of a difference. The break up on a tube amp is better - not as brittle. But, hey, I happen to like that brittle, sharp overdrive sound. And yes, there is a warmth to the clean sound of a tube amp while the solid state sounds 'artificial.' But, hell, I must have had the greatest solid state amp ever made (a Fender Princeton) because when I brought home my new tube amp, it was hard to see big differences. Plus my tube amp weighs a ton, it has to warm up before it reaches the sound it is supposed to be at, I have to take it in to change tubes... Solid states are no headaches at all - just take it out of the box, find a spot for it, and for the next fifteen years just play your guitar through it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burstbucker1281734065 Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 Valvestates are OK, I wouldn't call them "crappie". They can't hold up to an all valve amp in an A/B type comparison though. Even the better ones like the Marshall Mode 4 sound harsh compared to a JCM 800/900/DSL/JVM... or the Fenders and Voxes of the amp world. A lot of the choice boils down to available cash and how you choose to spend it. I got my Gibson first and then sold my Valvestate to get a DSL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alanhindle Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 I would say it depends on what type of music you want to play. My old Peavey Backstage 50 SS sounds superb with my Gibson SG on cleaner settings for that bit of twanginess; but my Peavey Royal 8 Valve King, at a 'just breaking up' gain/volume setting, is just pure sweetness. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acewarslave Posted December 15, 2008 Author Share Posted December 15, 2008 thakx for your replies ive got a smaller amp its a peavey express 112 but for me the marshall runs rings around it the marshall has a real nice growl to it...but one thing that matters the price of tube marshalls in australia i can buy another gibson 2nd hand ...for the price.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Lister Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 had a bloke say that im not doing my gibson justice by using my crappy marshall vs100..amp. never had a valve drivin amp so i cant really say if its true or not..your thoughts would be handy.. A couple of salient points on valve vs ss: 1. Tone is in the ears of the beholder. If you like what you're hearing' date=' forget what any other bloke says. 2. Maintenance is not a big deal..., on either! If however your ss breaks down -- happy hunting for anyone willing to repair it for less than what its worth. Besides if you handle valve amps with care (proper warm ups, etc.) they can outlast ss. Having said that, everyone knows that you are likely to want/need to change valves on occasion, so if you're an owner, then take the 5 minutes to learn how to change those little light bulbs and move on with your life. Some valves in some amps provide several years of great tone. I wasted 8 yrs. playing ss amps. They don't cut it for me..., period. And the way I see it, any extra $$ I may have to spend to keep my valve amps sounding terrific is just one of those areas in life where I deserve the luxury. Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby..., I'm going to play on:-" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxman Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 Having said that' date=' everyone knows that you are likely to want/need to change valves on occasion, so if you're an owner, then take the 5 minutes to learn how to change those little light bulbs and move on with your life. [/quote'] Sounds fine on paper, but in reality it sure isn't that easy. I have a tube amp that requires the entire resoldering of the speaker connections and the entire removal of the chasis, just to change those little light bulbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Norm Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 Sounds fine on paper' date=' but in reality it sure isn't that easy. I have a tube amp that requires the entire resoldering of the speaker connections and the entire removal of the chasis, just to change those little light bulbs.[/quote'] What kind of amp is this complicated to change tubes ????? In my Fender Blues Jr, it would take less than 5 minutes to change all 5 tubes.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxman Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 What kind of amp is this complicated to change tubes ????? ... It's the new VOX AC30s. To put new tubes in you have to remove the entire chasis. To remove the entire chasis you have to unsolder the speaker connections. You then take out spent tubes, put new ones in. Then re-install the entire chasis and then re-solder the speaker connections. It is insanity that I am not looking forward to doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Lister Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 I have a tube amp that requires the entire resoldering of the speaker connections and the entire removal of the chasis' date=' just to change those little light bulbs.[/quote']Mountain or molehill? Yours (more hands-in time than most) can still be done in 1-2 hours max. Soldering is a breeze on speaker wires. So, say 2 hours at $40 hr and a $10 solder pencil = $90 + valves$ --- over a 5 yr. life.... = pocket change. The valve amp up-keep monster is a myth -- perpetuated by GC type salespeople to sell loads of SS amps -- and why -- because they know that if they can sell the SS first, then that buyer will very likely return in a relatively short time to buy a valve amp so overall sales are doubled. Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby..., I'm going to play on:-" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricochet Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 only the pros use tube amps amateurs use solid state.... Carefull...I've heard guys play on SS... And they had tone out the YinYang... BB King, Ty Tabor, Dimebag are hardly amateurs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxman Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 Carefull...I've heard guys play on SS... And they had tone out the YinYang... BB King' date=' Ty Tabor, Dimebag are hardly amateurs.[/quote'] Wow, ddn't know that about those guys. Different players with very different styles....pretty cool to learn of the differences that can come from a solid state amp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
generation zero Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 It's the new VOX AC30s. To put new tubes in you have to remove the entire chasis. To remove the entire chasis you have to unsolder the speaker connections. You then take out spent tubes' date=' put new ones in. Then re-install the entire chasis and then re-solder the speaker connections. It is insanity that I am not looking forward to doing.[/quote'] Maybe you should have asked a few more questions before buying a new vox ac30 then, LOL! Seriously though, that's just ridiculous. That's like car companies redesigning cars to the point where you have to drop the engine to change the headlights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieChaplin Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 Coolest rock/blues tone I've ever heard was a 59 Les Paul though a Trainwreck amp (tubes), for that school of tone there is NO peer. If you've never heard or had the chance to play a Wreck you've missed a revelation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wastra Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 There are literally a million places to read what the experts say are the differences between valve and SS amps. In the end, the analog nature of thet valve amp produces tones that have naturally inconsistant frequencies that our analog ears pick up at an almost subconscious level. But modelling amps get better and better every year...most won't ever know the difference...especially considering most of hte music we hear is digitally recorded anyway. But for me ,the advantage to the valve amp is not the end sound, but the "response" they provide to my playing. They just react differently than SS amps do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxman Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 Maybe you should have asked a few more questions before buying a new vox ac30 then' date=' LOL! Seriously though, that's just ridiculous. [/quote'] Nah, I knew some of that was coming before I bought. I just dread the time when the tubes have to be replaced. You are right -- the design is flawed and should be corrected. Annoying stuff like that is out there on quality products. Changing guitar strings is a piece of cake (even on 12-strings), but on a 12 string Rickenbacker......man, no one can believe it until they do it. Like the VOX AC30, the design is not conducive to easy maintenence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
generation zero Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 Yeah, to address the original question, tube (or valve) amps vs. solid state is like Gibson vs. Epiphone... The general consensus is that tube amps are "better", but it's a very subjective discussion, and there are merits to both sides, with cost playing a major factor. Plenty of people love their high end solid state gear, plenty love their tubes... And there is a group that makes do with solid state until they can afford a tube amp. It really depends on what you need and want out of your rig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookelputz Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 Maybe you should have asked a few more questions before buying a new vox ac30 then' date=' LOL! Seriously though, that's just ridiculous. That's like car companies redesigning cars to the point where you have to drop the engine to change the headlights. [/quote'] You had to pull the engine to change the clutch in a MG Midget in the late 60s and early 70s. Its nothing new. That's space requirements. Engineers were told design a box of this size and put these things in it. You either make the box bigger or leave out a few things or put them in however you can. Exactly the same engineering challenges in both cases, except that Vox could easily have made the box 2 cubic MM larger and had enough room to engineer it properly. Size is one of the very biggest reasons a car design makes it or not, and engineers who cannot perfom to spec do not design cars for very long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eor Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 in a word, yes. in two, hell yes. but really, its all about your requirements and how you use the amp. if you play at home, at decent home volumes and don't gig or record too much, then your amp is probably enough. if you are happy with the sound, then it is enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrjones200x Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 My valve junior isnt as versatile as my vox ad-30vt ss amp but has a much warmer fuller sound. Try one in the local music shop. Try the valve junior you will be inpressed. Hard to explain till you try. I wont buy another ss amp. Its good for home and messing about but the valve junior is untouchable for sound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stan 58 Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 IMHO valve amps are over rated. If you use any Type of fuzz box in front of it, and if you play at home you almost have to,whats the point? You have to run them wide open to get the "magic. And in my neck of the woods you get a visit from the cops if you try that. Stan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrjones200x Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Never tried a really good ss amp just my vox ad30vt but valve junior is good for home use at full volume. Thats where it sounds great. Just my opinion. Plus ive only had 3 amps in total. GA10 ss yamaha practice amp. Very very crappy sounding Vox AD30VT, Good sounding with lots of options to tweak Valve junior version 3, Very very nice sound but one trick pony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrighty3693 Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Im currently playing a marshall VS100 and its the best amp ive been able to play ignore what people say its personal preference a marshall vs100 has a large array of sounds and the greatest clean channel i can find Personal Preferance Not proffessional opinion Wrighty 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
generation zero Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 You had to pull the engine to change the clutch in a MG Midget in the late 60s and early 70s. Its nothing new. That's space requirements. Engineers were told design a box of this size and put these things in it. You either make the box bigger or leave out a few things or put them in however you can. Exactly the same engineering challenges in both cases' date=' except that Vox could easily have made the box 2 cubic MM larger and had enough room to engineer it properly. Size is one of the very biggest reasons a car design makes it or not, and engineers who cannot perfom to spec do not design cars for very long. [/quote'] Yeah, I get that, I was just using the engine thing to make a point. I don't have the Vox amp, nor am I familiar with the design, but comon sense would tell me that if the speaker leads MUST be taken loose to remove the chassis to replace the tubes, perhaps a modular quick-release fitting would have been a smarter engineering choice than a straight hard-wired soldered connection. I'm just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicester35 Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 I totally agree with the horses for courses argument, which seems to run through this thread. For years I had a Laney VC50 Class A valve amp. Made right here in England (over in the West Midlands, I believe.) Good points: Great tone. Had a bright switch. Killer reverb, really superb... Beautiful vintage looks. Deafeningly loud - I did decent sized pub gigs no problem without being mic'ed up... Bad points: Chronically unreliable - (built in England, just like Rovers and Triumph TR7s). Heavy as lead. If I ever succumb to a hernia in later life, I know it will have been caused by carting that damned amp up and down flights of stairs in pubs / clubs / and rehearsal rooms. Deafeningly loud - the tone didn't start to become good until around setting 5 or 6 on the master volume. At that point my neighbours would have been on the blower to the coppers within seconds (so absolutely no use for home studio use). So I sold it quite recently, with a few regrets...(but not that many). These days I do the odd small gig with a few friends, and I'm working on a project with another friend...just some blues/jazz instrumentals which we'll stick up on a Myspace page one day soon. So I don't need a big amp. I'm using a Vox AD30VT at the moment, which is fine. Only drawback is the reverb (it's rubbish), so I bought a Holy Grail pedal. I am thinking about buying a Blues Jr however, or maybe a Peavey Windsor Studio. The Vox has a good tone, but not an outstanding tone. In all probability, I'll go for the Blues Jr... Like racehorses, big valve amps are finicky, temperamental, volatile, and are only useful for the specific purpose for which they were designed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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