Analog or Digital?

[Riptide]

Hey, I know the difference between analog and digital but I'm wondering how to tell the difference in pedals? Like what exactly is it in pedals that converts the signal to digital?

[damian]

......Analog pedals use batteries, and Digital pedals use plug thingee things...........

[Riptide]

......Analog pedals use batteries, and Digital pedals use plug thingee things...........

I'm sorry... what? I got lost on the "plug thingee things"

[damian]

I'm sorry... what? I got lost on the "plug thingee things"

 

....................... ............................ #-o ....

[damian]

Hey, I know the difference between analog and digital but I'm wondering how to tell the difference in pedals? Like what exactly is it in pedals that converts the signal to digital?

 

A/D and D/A converters..........I'm not sure what you mean by " telling the difference. "

 

There are many PEDAL HEADS here, I'm not sure why they haven't pitched in.....

 

They'd be better at explaining it Riptide......

[Guest Farnsbarns Wunterslausche]

An analogue pedal passes the signal through various non digital components such as capacitors, resistors, diodes valves, tapes etc.

 

A digital pedal digitizes the signal (converts it to digital data), passes it through a DSP (digital signal processor) which applies algorithms to it which add the effect and then convert it back to an analogue signal for output.

 

With pedals your best bet is research and read the box.

[damian]

Yes !!!!! And, there are many hybrid pedals these days as well.....

[charlie brown]

Very basically....

 

Analog...gutiar, direct to pedal mini-circuit, to amp. (Simplest form)

 

Digital...guitar, signal processed/converted to 1's and 0's (digital),

and programmed to whatever the pedal is supposed to do/sound like

(distortion, Reverb, Compression, etc.)...then sent to the amp.

They most all, analog or digital, use either batteries, and/or 9-volt transformers.

 

A lot of early "Digital" pedals were very "Sterile" sounding. So, most

preferred "Analog's" (usually) warmer, and more "realistic" (whatever that

means?), tone. Newer Digital pedals, and multi-effects processors, are a

LOT better, than they used to be. Still, a lot of player still prefer the

Analog pedals.

 

If you Google, "Analog vs Digital Guitar pedals," you'll get quite a few

sites, that will explain it, in more detail, if needed.

 

CB

[Riptide]

I guess I'm asking what to look for on like a schematic to see if a pedal converts the signal to digital. I'm going to use a pedal off of how it sounds so it's not like this is really going to make that much of a difference it was just something that I'm curious about.

[damian]

I guess I'm asking what to look for on like a schematic to see if a pedal converts the signal to digital. I'm going to use a pedal off of how it sounds so it's not like this is really going to make that much of a difference it was just something that I'm curious about.

 

There is tons of info out there on the web.......Tons....Simply dig into it.....

 

I do agree that UNDERSTANDING one's equipment is a very smart and vital aspect of creating music.............

[Guest Farnsbarns Wunterslausche]

I guess I'm asking what to look for on like a schematic to see if a pedal converts the signal to digital. I'm going to use a pedal off of how it sounds so it's not like this is really going to make that much of a difference it was just something that I'm curious about.

 

A processor of any sort. Probaly labeled DSP in some way. Often some kind of non volatile RAM for presets, often this will be EPROM/EEPROM so look out for that.

[ne14t?]

If its got a microprocessor then its going to be digital, so something like a Line6 POD is 100% digital, some other pedals that would share this aspect would be an MXR Fullbore Metal it uses a DSP processor, Digitech Whammy Pedal is digital. An analog pedal is going to be very basic, and will have capacitors, resistors and maybe some transitors nothing thats really going to process the signal just affect it. I have also noticed that digital pedals tend to be lighter then analog ones, I figure this is due to the lack of heavy components like capacitors and/or transformers not required in a digital unit. Which leads into the fact that some analog units are a lot more awkward then there digital counterparts one of the best examples of this is a rotary drum speaker, the old Leslie systems are bulky, expensive and all around a pain in the butt; however the nice little units made into pedals that model the rotary drum sound pretty darn good and well its a pedal you can hold in your hand, not a huge system to lug around. In the long run it really doesnt matter as all recording mediums turn your analog signal to digital unless you are recording onto Vinyl. I will say that after playing around with a Line6 POD for about a month is was the bee's knee's through my modeling amp, but through the tube amp which thrives on an analog signal it did not sound good at all, it robbed the amp of that natural tube warmth and made it sound like a modeling amp, this might have been because my tube amp doesnt have an effects loop so it was running through the preamp of my amp as well, were the POD is supposed to replace your amps preamp *shrug* just tossing that out there.

[chase1410]

If your talking about sound comparison...Digital technology is getting so sophisticated and advanced, it's getting to the point, where NO-ONE can tell the difference between a good digital pedal vs an analog pedal..Take the Strymon El Capistan or Brigadier for example...You can stick put it up with any analog delay, and you will not be able to tell witch one is digital or analog..(My guess it would be the other way around)..Alot of the digital pedals coming out today, have more processing power the an 1980's super computer..

[Riffster]

So...do the digital processors on pedals use digital sampling like CDs and MP3s do? and the sampling is getting better that less of the comparable analog signals are geting left out?

 

Is this one of those cases where digital can get as good as analog but no better?

[ne14t?]

So...do the digital processors on pedals use digital sampling like CDs and MP3s do? and the sampling is getting better that less of the comparable analog signals are geting left out?

 

Is this one of those cases where digital can get as good as analog but no better?

 

For the most part yes, digital will always have the power to surpass analog; however whether or not people accept it is a different story.

[damian]

So...do the digital processors on pedals use digital sampling like CDs and MP3s do? and the sampling is getting better that less of the comparable analog signals are geting left out?

 

Is this one of those cases where digital can get as good as analog but no better?

 

IMHO, digital is already at the point where it CAN be better.....Especially when a unit is a hybrid; part digital, part analog.......

 

 

Sampling rates can be really high these days.......

[Riptide]

Thanks for the replies. Just so you know I have googled this and looked into it... I'm one of those people that are just to lazy to search for something so they ask it on forums. Just as an example, does anyone know if most of boss pedals are digital or analog? Obviously their digital delays are digital, from what I gather their distortions are analog and their modulation ones are digital. (and anything with COSM on it is digital)

 

On a little bit of a side note, the analog delay on digital Boss pedals sounds vastly different from my Carbon Copy... I would say that there is almost comparable to the difference between Bosses digital and analog settings on their digital delays.

[Dub-T-123]

To tell if something is analog or digital, just look at the maker's description of it. They will be sure to tell you if it's analog kinda like how amp makers stress that their amp is a tube amp.

 

I would say that most current Boss pedals are digital but that's without really looking at their lineup... Just thinking of all their pedals, most of the ones I can think of are digital.

 

There are plenty of good digital pedals and plenty of bad analog pedals. Just decide with your ears don't let the hype from people on the internet sway you.

[Riptide]

To tell if something is analog or digital, just look at the maker's description of it. They will be sure to tell you if it's analog kinda like how amp makers stress that their amp is a tube amp.

 

I would say that most current Boss pedals are digital but that's without really looking at their lineup... Just thinking of all their pedals, most of the ones I can think of are digital.

 

There are plenty of good digital pedals and plenty of bad analog pedals. Just decide with your ears don't let the hype from people on the internet sway you.

As I said before wither a pedal is analog or digital makes no difference to me. I just wanted to learn how to tell the difference.

 

And does an OpAmp make a pedal digital? From what people have said here I assume that it doesn't.

[Dub-T-123]

No opamp does not make a pedal digital. An example of a classic opamp pedal (which is analog) would be a ProCo Rat.

 

It uses a chip but it's analog. Analog delays and modulation use chips as well but they don't convert your signal to 0s and 1s.

[rocketman]

Yep that's a great way to state it. Let's think about a simple analog device, the low-pass filter. It retains signals at lower frequencies but cuts off signals with higher frequencies. An equalizer is just a set of linear filters. A simple analog low-pass filter can be designed by an RC circuit, shown below.

 

 

This is strictly made up of "analog" devices and the signal is "continuous." Digital processors must first digitize the incoming signal. This is done by an analog-to-digital device. The most common is a first-order hold which holds the signal constant throughout the sampling interval. Now it's in digital form, i.e. 0's and 1's and you can manipulate the signal as you wish. For example, I can set up a virtual low-pass filter to mimic what the analog device does. You then convert the digital signal back to an analog one using a digital-to-analog converter.

 

If your sampling rate is fast enough (there is something called Nyquist's limit), then you really won't be able to tell the difference between the analog one and the digital one.

 

The "problem" for musicians, unlike engineers, is that they like the "unwanted" stuff like the sound of an overdriven tube. Modeling that digitally is not easy but modern ones are getting very close.

[Riffster]

Reminiscent to the Vinyl vs. CD comparison.

 

Analog full signal versus digital sampling... except a CD does not have more space to accomodate higher sampling, it was good enough that DVD Audio never took off though...micro chips though are so advanced that it is crazy the number of items they can put in them.

[ne14t?]

Yep that's a great way to state it. Let's think about a simple analog device, the low-pass filter. It retains signals at lower frequencies but cuts off signals with higher frequencies. A equalizer is just a set of linear filter. A simple analog low-pass filter can be designed by an RC circuit, shown below.

 

 

This is strictly made up of "analog" devices and the signal is "continuous." Digital processors must first digitize the incoming signal. This is done by a analog-to-digital device. The most common is a first-order hold which holds the signal constant throughout the sampling interval. Now it's in digital form, i.e. 0's and 1's and you cam manipulate the signal as you wish. That is I can set up a virtual low-pass filter to mimic what the analog device does. You then convert the digital signal back to an analog one using a digital-to-analog converter.

 

If your sampling interval is small enough (there is something called the Nyquist's limit), then you really won't be able to tell the difference between the analog one and the digital one.

 

The problem for musicians, unlike engineers, is that they like the "unwanted" stuff like the sound of an overdriven tube. Modeling that is not easy but modern ones are getting very close.

 

Great Contribution! Good Info in there for those that do not know. And as a previous user of a POD product I can say that the modeling stuff is jumping ahead in leaps and bounds, I dont know if its true or not but Line6 claims the POD is the industry standard for modeling and well it was pretty freaking awesome. When I selected a Plexi it sounded a lot like a Plexi and when i jumped to a Fender Tweed it really did sound like a tweed I was really in awe for that. A lot of people will knock the modeling equipment but I must say the intro to Slayers Raining Blood I recorded directly off my POD sounded closer to the KFK Tone then through my Marshall Haze half stack with the gain cranked. Would I rely on modeling equipment 100% of course not, but not because I dont trust it, just gotta play it safe. FWIW the user manual for that POD was like 147 pages in English only...soooooo much crap.

[rocketman]

Thanks! And I did it without putting up an equation (that ain't easy for us geeks!). I have a Line 6 Vetta II which is a POD on steroids. The boundary between analog and digital sound is getting smaller. I can still tell the difference (I love Fender amps). But I like to have multiple sounds at my disposal. Plus the amp comes with every effect out there, all in one unit.

[Dub-T-123]

Rocketman what is Nyquist's Limit?