NewBirdDude Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 Hey guys. I'm a regular on a couple of other guitar forums but its my first time posting here. I think I found a guitar that I'm really considering putting a modest offer on. The seller has the item listed as a Gibson hummingbird neck with an Epiphone humingbird body. Before you read on, It seems that there is a good possibility that its a fake but I may still be open to paying used Epiphone price for this guitar. From the pictures, the neck actually looks more like a songwriter neck. The picture of the back of the headstock is too blurry to identify a SN. If there is no SN, I'll have to assume it's fake. Although the inlays look like real pearl (they seem more reflective than pearloid). Next we get really strange. The body finish looks more like the current epiphone bodies but the sticker in the soundhole says gibson. Although the serial number on the sticker corresponds to an epiphone made in Quingdao. Has anyone ever seen an Epiphone body with a Gibson sticker or should we assume this is also fake? or possibly a real hummingbird body? I'm considering making a pretty modest offer in spite of all its strange short-commings; a little more in the price range of a used epiphone hummingbird. I've also placed this in the epiphone acoustic board; it seems like this guitar may bridge the gap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 Don't do it. Go for an Epiphone Bird, , , I played a Dove a few years ago - not bad at all. Just stay out of this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the other side Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 Welcome! I agree with Em7. I will say, that little bit of history makes a few chills and raises a few hairs! Definately an odd ribd. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave F Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 Agree , leave it alone. No one with any sense would put a Gibson neck on an EP in this situation. Would have been better to just sell the neck if legit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
62burst Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 That “W” on the pickguard looked familiar - recalling now, and re-finding the listing: "Guitar body was damaged so I had the local store switch the body…” Might just be a matter of word choice, but if you were to undertake a repair such as a body swap (neck swap), you’d probably be familiar with the term “luthier”. More likely a wannabe G owner on a budget who decided to make a Gibson Hummingbird out of an Epiphone, but had a change of heart. Or conscience. Probably cost more for the “Gibson” (if that’s what it is) neck than the Epi. Speaking of which: has anyone seen the SJ-200/L-5 CES “bird’s beak” at the end of the fretboard extension on a Hummingbird? There is some mention of this in the ’60’s, but that had block, not split parallelogram, inlays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBirdDude Posted February 13, 2017 Author Share Posted February 13, 2017 ...Probably cost more for the “Gibson” (if that’s what it is) neck than the Epi. Speaking of which: has anyone seen the SJ-200/L-5 CES “bird’s beak” at the end of the fretboard extension on a Hummingbird? There is some mention of this in the ’60’s, but that had block, not split parallelogram, inlays. That's kind of what was making me think it's a songwriter neck. Seems weird for a fake to have an extra flourish not present on the original. The songwriter has parallelograms and a "bird's beak". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 Has anybody checked of this is a long scale neck hooked on a short scale position bridge'n'body ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBirdDude Posted February 13, 2017 Author Share Posted February 13, 2017 Also is the lack of a serial number on the back of the headstock a concern, or did gibson leave it off some years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBirdDude Posted February 13, 2017 Author Share Posted February 13, 2017 Has anybody checked of this is a long scale neck hooked on a short scale position bridge'n'body ? if you're asking me, I'm really not sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
62burst Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 Oh. Yeah, E., and thanks for the info, NewBirdDude . . . Songwriter is long scale at 25.5". Songwriter is totally off of my radar, so 'didn't put the bird's beak to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBirdDude Posted February 13, 2017 Author Share Posted February 13, 2017 Yeah thats something I knew about the songwriter. Kind of turns the bird into a song-dove. Although, I was also worried that having a long scale length neck placed on a body designed for short scale length might make the scale length even longer than 25.5". any input on the missing SN? ok or red flag? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldCowboy Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 For me, that institutional sh!tcan in the photos' background puts it all into perspective💩 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
62burst Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 Yeah thats something I knew about the songwriter. Kind of turns the bird into a song-dove. Although, I was also worried that having a long scale length neck placed on a body designed for short scale length might make the scale length even longer than 25.5". any input on the missing SN? ok or red flag? Yes, putting a long scale neck on a short scale guitar would most likely throw the fret spacing off, unless the bridge/saddle was repositioned. *poof* For me, that institutional sh!tcan in the photos' background puts it all into perspective�� Is that photo taken in a restroom? At the bus station? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldCowboy Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 Or truckstop or interstate rest area? Yes, putting a long scale neck on a short scale guitar would most likely throw the fret spacing off, unless the bridge/saddle was repositioned. *poof* Is that photo taken in a restroom? At the bus station? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave F Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 Check out the heel on the neck behind the nut. Must be a custom one off Gibson design aimed at the Martins' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissouriPicker Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 Don't know anything about hybrid guitars like this appears to be, but I'm always suspicious when the seller can't take a good pic of a serial number. With the technology of the last dozen years, pretty easy to get clear pics. I'd avoid it and just get an Epi bird or Dove if that's where the interest is....Good luck with your hunt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mz-s Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 any input on the missing SN? ok or red flag? Is the lack of a serial number on the back of the neck really the only problem you have with this thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
62burst Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 Check out the heel on the neck behind the nut. Must be a custom one off Gibson design aimed at the Martins' The Hummingbirds did pick up the carved heel, or "volute" on the back of the neck during the Gibson dark days, around '69 through '81, but they also had the block inlays at that time. Just adds to the mystery: who's neck is it anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldCowboy Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 The Hummingbirds did pick up the carved heel, or "volute" on the back of the neck during the Gibson dark days, around '69 through '81, but they also had the block inlays at that time. Just adds to the mystery: who's neck is it anyway? As long as it's not mine, I'm going to stop worrying about it! It's the kind of thing that, if you're away from home without a guitar, might be worth picking up from a flea market or junk shop for $40. Then again, maybe not.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBirdDude Posted February 14, 2017 Author Share Posted February 14, 2017 Is the lack of a serial number on the back of the neck really the only problem you have with this thing? Yeah I just wrote the rest of the post to throw everyone off the scent of my true singular interest, in the headstock SN... Come on man. Don't make me sorry I asked for help. It was legitimate to ask because many members had replied yet not addressed it. I appreciate everyone else's help. For now I think my planned offer of 200 dollars will not be submitted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djw171 Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 My initial thought was the Gibson logo looks off. Reminds me of the logo on the Chinese Les Paul fakes. 1 minute on Google: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2016-new-arrivel-Hummingbird-acoustic-guitar-acoustic-electric-guitar/32643070262.html?spm=2114.01010208.3.1.Q8U7JP&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_1_10065_10000073_10068_10501_10000074_10503_10000032_119_10000030_10000026_10000023_10000069_10000068_10060_10062_10056_10055_10000062_10054_10000063_10059_10099_10000020_10000013_10103_10102_10000016_10096_10000056_10000059_10052_10053_10107_10050_10106_10051_10000097_10000094_10000053_10000007_10000050_10084_10083_10000100_10080_10000047_10082_10081_10110_10111_10112_10113_10114_10115_10000041_10000044_10078_10079_10000038_10073_10000035_10122_10123_10121_10124-10050_10503_10501,searchweb201603_7,afswitch_2,ppcSwitch_3,single_sort_2_default&btsid=8861cffb-5ee8-4413-b360-c315ae9f461e Check out the fingerboard..look familiar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBirdDude Posted February 14, 2017 Author Share Posted February 14, 2017 My initial thought was the Gibson logo looks off. Reminds me of the logo on the Chinese Les Paul fakes. 1 minute on Google: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/2016 Check out the fingerboard..look familiar? Very nice catch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mz-s Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 Yeah I just wrote the rest of the post to throw everyone off the scent of my true singular interest, in the headstock SN... Come on man. Don't make me sorry I asked for help. It was legitimate to ask because many members had replied yet not addressed it. I appreciate everyone else's help. For now I think my planned offer of 200 dollars will not be submitted. My point was no other aspect of the thing is legitimate, so the headstock SN makes no difference. A lot of fakes have a phony SN stamped on the back, but a lot of others don't. The appearance of a stamped SN is not proof of a legitimate or fake guitar. You have to look at everything to make a determination. The different back bracing pattern, the copy pickguard, the wrong neck, the knockoff tuners, they all add up to fake. It might be a good $200 guitar, but it is not nor has it ever been a Hummingbird (not even an Epiphone Hummingbird). It may still be worth $100. I wouldn't go $200 because you can easily get an Epiphone Hummingbird for that, which will have real Grover tuners and laminated, although higher quality woods. And a decent pickup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldCowboy Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 My point was no other aspect of the thing is legitimate, so the headstock SN makes no difference. A lot of fakes have a phony SN stamped on the back, but a lot of others don't. The appearance of a stamped SN is not proof of a legitimate or fake guitar. You have to look at everything to make a determination. The different back bracing pattern, the copy pickguard, the wrong neck, the knockoff tuners, they all add up to fake. It might be a good $200 guitar, but it is not nor has it ever been a Hummingbird (not even an Epiphone Hummingbird). It may still be worth $100. I wouldn't go $200 because you can easily get an Epiphone Hummingbird for that, which will have real Grover tuners and laminated, although higher quality woods. And a decent pickup. OK - I raise my estimate to $50😌 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the other side Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 That thing may wind up in a tree like the other birdhouse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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