Headstock finish issue

[Guth]

My AJRI headstock looks the same way.

 

The guitar looks just fine from a distance.

 

 

But a closer look at the headstock reveals: UGLINESS

 

[Aster1]

My AJRI headstock looks the same way.

 

The guitar looks just fine from a distance.

 

 

But a closer look at the headstock reveals: UGLINESS

 

 

Guth,

 

Sorry to see you're having that problem too. Beautiful Guitar BTW!!! Just noticed that tripod. That is one heck of a Heavy Duty tripod pardner!!! Looks like it would hold a studio HDTV camera. That big rig would hold that electronic widget you have mounted on it pretty stable I'd reckon.

 

Paul, I knew you were just kidding!! It's just sometimes the hackles get up easy and I never think that is all that bad what is said. Cranky sometimes, but on the scale of 1-10 amount to about a 2 or 3 for nasty IMHO. Too much is made of it sometimes with "can't we all just get along?" I really think we do get along and maybe just blow off some steam from time to time.

 

I don't have a Martin, have tried and just not for me at least right now. Nothing is forever. I do MUCH prefer a Gibson to a Taylor or Martin and not one little disrespect to either as both are great guitar. Neither one of them is perfect either however as I could easily get into looking them over and tearing them apart. NOTHING is a perfect piece even though I'd like it that way as I do enjoy as close to perfection in all items that I play with, guitars, Harley's, electronics etc. Any of it.

 

 

Aster

[onewilyfool]

LOL....really, coming from a guy who has previously referred to me as a "TROLL" many times in the past, Hogeye your self righteousness knows no ends, and your offence at my personal attqcks seems quite hollow. Thanks Guth, for posting yet ANOTHER headstock problem which clearly shows the differential shrinkage and cracking at the logo. My two Bozemans have the same problem . AGAIN, I'm not contradicting you Hogeye, that PART of the problem is humidity. But that is not the ONLY problem, as you seem to imply. Wonderful, I agree with you, however you completely ignore that the rough work of the headstock logo and method of construction is part of the problem. Again, Gibson can do no wrong in your eyes, and every problem is the end user's fault. Your buddy, Guitar strummer, who really doesn't participate on the forum, just coming out of the woodwork for home coming and to attack anyone who says anything bad about Gibson, has also called me a Gibson basher, no the BIGGEST Gibson basher....lol... I would say 99.5% of my comments and sharings about Gibson are positive, Sunbursts, nobody better, sound, great, aesthetics and tradition, wonderful, customer service (especially Jeremy) fantastic, New guitars, best ever, yet I am the biggest basher??? Again, the "group of four" chooses to attack any dissent. I mean, really, humidity or not, look at the original poster's pic of his headstock!!!!! Someone at Gibson should be embarrassed at that pic and the 20 other pics of the same problem we've seen on this forum, and want to do better. To suggest that there are ways which Gibson's can be improved, is NOT bashing.To suggest that quality control could be improved is not being a troll. I measured one spot on my AJ headstock, and there is 1/16" of fill between the wood and the MOP!!! Defend that workmanship all you want, Gibson can do better. Rar has stated that they are now using CNC for the headstocks, hopefully the tolerances will tighten up, and we will see less of this problem humidity or not. Hogeye, and I'm being sincere here, I do appreciate when you bring valuable information to the table about the history of Gibson, and inside details of the inner workings of Bozeman, thanks. And, Guitarstrummer, thanks for your sincere apology, by the way, and for my part, if I implied that you are a fan boy, or an apologist for Gibson's shortcomings, I'm sorry too.

[guitarstrummer]

You're right OWFool. You know more about guitar design and building than all of the people who are now or have ever worked at Gibson. They should immediately change the way they are doing things just to acknowledge the greatness of your ideas. LOL

 

Bottom line, if you like their products, buy them, play them, and enjoy them. If not, buy something else and then complain to them about all of their shortcomings, in the world according to OWFool.

 

And you're also right, I haven't participated much on this forum lately. There are also many others who don't. Gee, I wonder, why?

[rar]

Rar has stated that they are now using CNC for the headstocks, hopefully the tolerances will tighten up, and we will see less of this problem humidity or not.

Just to be clear -- which I wasn't before -- I didn't mean to imply that Gibson wasn't using CNC in 1995. I had no idea whether they were or weren't until Hogeye posted that they were. What I meant was that the process they're currently is the same as Martin's. They have using eliminated the use of a significant amount of filler between the inlay and the wood. Drop the inlay n place, and there's a barely perceptible "crack" around the edge. So, to whatever extent the filler was contributing to the problem -- I have no idea whether it was or not -- it is definitely not contributing anything now. (Not that the reason for the change had anything to do with this differential shrinkage stuff. Perfect fit and no filler is obviously better, and is a sufficient explanation for the change.)

 

I think that's about as weak as I can get it while still saying something, so I'll stop right there. :)

 

-- Bob R

[onewilyfool]

Just to be clear -- which I wasn't before -- I didn't mean to imply that Gibson wasn't using CNC in 1995. I had no idea whether they were or weren't until Hogeye posted that they were. What I meant was that the process they're currently is the same as Martin's. They have using eliminated the use of a significant amount of filler between the inlay and the wood. Drop the inlay n place, and there's a barely perceptible "crack" around the edge. So, to whatever extent the filler was contributing to the problem -- I have no idea whether it was or not -- it is definitely not contributing anything now. (Not that the reason for the change had anything to do with this differential shrinkage stuff. Perfect fit and no filler is obviously better, and is a sufficient explanation for the change.)

 

I think that's about as weak as I can get it while still saying something, so I'll stop right there. :)

 

-- Bob R

And Thanks again Rar...this is all I was advocating for. Looks like all of the people who are now or have ever worked at Gibson, well, we kind of came to the same conclusion on the improvement to the headstocks. Interesting, and I don't actually know anything about guitar design or building....lol...seriously, I hope that this will reduce the occurance of pics like the ones OP posted at the beginning of thread. Thanks for the clarification again, Rar, I also greatly appreciate your knowledge and sharing on the Forum, even though we've disagreed in the past. Hopefully, perfect fit and no filler for the headstock is something we all can agree on!!!!

[fortyearspickn]

And Thanks again Rar...this is all I was advocating for. Looks like all of the people who are now or have ever worked at Gibson, well, we kind of came to the same conclusion on the improvement to the headstocks. Interesting, and I don't actually know anything about guitar design or building....lol...seriously, I hope that this will reduce the occurance of pics like the ones OP posted at the beginning of thread. Thanks for the clarification again, Rar, I also greatly appreciate your knowledge and sharing on the Forum, even though we've disagreed in the past. Hopefully, perfect fit and no filler for the headstock is something we all can agree on!!!!

 

 

OWF, not to deflect, but when did you legally change your name from OLD Wiley Fool to ONE Wiley Fool? With your new persona, can we look forward to fewer double entendres? My inner 13 year old gets a kick out of them, but somehow the rest of me wonders if your insights comparing Jumbos to Mid-sized isn't as insightful as your comments on this thread .

[Guth]

Sorry to see you're having that problem too. Beautiful Guitar BTW!!! Just noticed that tripod. That is one heck of a Heavy Duty tripod pardner!!! Looks like it would hold a studio HDTV camera. That big rig would hold that electronic widget you have mounted on it pretty stable I'd reckon.

 

I originally posted the photo of my headstock to better illustrate an issue that that could be seen on many new Gibson acoustics hanging on the wall at my local 5-star dealer just a couple of years back. It was hard to explain in words, so the picture did a much better job. The regular cast of characters picked it apart that the photo was too close up, the guitar had been abused, etc., etc.. The main reason for my posting of the photo was to provide an example of what I was having a hard time trying to describe in words. I can live with this on my guitar as I bought it this way. But I found it inexcusable that new Gibsons were being sold with blemishes like this. I've come to conclude that a few members here are so personally tied to Gibson the company, or Gibson employees (or both) that pointing out anything negative about Gibson acoustics is about the same as saying something in poor taste about their mothers. It doesn't seem to matter that I've purchased 6 guitars made by the folks in Bozeman (and still own three of them), all I have to do is raise a criticism or concern about their products and it's as if I've started in with the "your mom is so ugly that..." business. For all I know their mothers work at Gibson?? Sh!t happens, and based on my experiences its happened a fair amount more at Gibson than it has with other American builders. I'm not happy about it, but it doesn't keep me from enjoying my Gibsons. I'm open to the thought that, and remain hopeful that, Gibson is able to improve their building techniques to the point where these things don't happen so often. I've not stepped foot inside of my 5-star dealer in over a year now as I remain more than happy playing the guitars that I currently own. So be sure to note that my previously noted criticisms apply to my past experiences, not current ones.

 

As far as the tripod goes, that's a remnant from an era when I was still using film cameras. It has absolutely no problem supporting my digital recorder — which I use to record the music I make with my Gibson guitars that, regardless of my many criticisms, I remain so fond of.

[onewilyfool]

OWF, not to deflect, but when did you legally change your name from OLD Wiley Fool to ONE Wiley Fool? With your new persona, can we look forward to fewer double entendres? My inner 13 year old gets a kick out of them, but somehow the rest of me wonders if your insights comparing Jumbos to Mid-sized isn't as insightful as your comments on this thread .

You know, brother, since you seem to negatively comment on just about everything I do on this forum, from starting too many threads, to making jokes, making puns......well let's just say, to about anything I post, I actually thought your screen name was 'FORTYEARS*****IN'" and just noticed that it is actually something different. I don't really know you, I haven't exchanged emails with you, IM's, or ever even replied to any of your posts on the forum before today. I really don't know what I did to tick you off. Maybe you are just an ornery old Texan trying to stir it up??? But that being said, if I have done anything directly to offend you, please forgive me, it wasn't my intention. I come on this forum to enjoy myself, share my love of guitars and Gibson's with other like minded folks, and occasionally make a few puns and jokes. All pretty innocuous light hearted stuff. If THIS offends you, well I'm still going to continue to be myself, and hope you can at least tolerate me without having to directly attack what I do or write so often. Best you go your way, and I go mine. Let's just accept that in this case you and I don't have any connection. I've met a lot of wonderful folks through this forum, both electronically and in person, and I'm just going to continue to be myself and see what transpires.

[onewilyfool]

Well said Guth!

[JuanCarlosVejar]

Hey OWF and 40 years , let's not forget to be friends . I think all of us enjoy ourselves here on the forum .

I came here in 2011 knowing just a little bit about gibsons and know I can say without a doubt I have learned something form everyone .

 

 

to post something about the topic ... I have had my gibson Sj 200 TV for 3 or 4 years now and I have tried to take very good care of it ... that being said there are a few splits on 2 of the crowns in the fingerboard and a small line on the "i" in "Gibson" on the headstock ... but I've played that thing hundreds of hours already and I think those small nicks make it look really nice ... so I think it's all in the care you give the instrument . I think even the highest quality Martin or Santa Cruz would also get damage if you didn't care for it .

 

I think the people in Bozeman are doing great things and I will continue to buy their guitars as long as I can

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

JC

[guitarstrummer]

Well said, fortyearspickn!

[guitarstrummer]

That is not two cents worth. That's $20.00 worth. I don't have any reason to fight on this forum. I live in Bozeman and have many close friends that work for Gibson and so when a person has a problem with a guitar and posts here I just go to the plant and ask what the solution is. It usually works out for the best. Thank you for your post. Thank you for being the voice of reason here. I wish I was a better person and could aviod conflicts as it really serves no purpose. I will be better I promise.

 

I will say this. Your assement of Taylor is spot on. Bob is a frequent visitor to Bozeman as his grandfather lives about 10 minutes from the Gibson plant. One of his big regrets is that he can't shoot nitro because he has his plant in California and the restrictions by the State and the EPA are to restrictive. Gibsons unique location and there commitment to history are different than Bob Taylors.Most folks don't know this but Gibson actually cut Taylor's shell in Bozeman for several years. Bob Taylor helped Gibson secure their first Fadal CNC machine. Small world.

 

I wish you could come to one of the "Homecomings". You would find a lot of wonderful folks that attend. They are not Gibson apologists nor do they have any agenda. They just like to get together and play their guitars and learn about the Gibson experience. Most have other guitars and bring them to share as well.

 

I would like to go to the gathering in Northern California as well but haven't quite worked out the schedule. I am trying to put it together for this year but nothing is definite as yet.

 

Well said, Hogeye.