Gauges live experiences (After show feeling + video)

[awel]

Tonight I have a show with my Classic Rock band, and in order to protect a bit my fingers I will try a set of Ernie Ball Coated in 009-046 on my modified Vintage HotRod 62 Strat, so I will pass from 010-046 to 009-046! Hope not to break strings, because I am let say an energic kinda guitar player Already tried it home and I like it but never dare live.

I guess that if Billy Gibbons is able to play with 008 on a Gibson, I will manage to play 009 on a Fender.

 

For sure I will play my Black Beauty as well but this one still in 010-046, if I like it on the Strat perhaps I will try it on the Les Paul but for tonight in case of problems I need a well known tool :)

[capmaster]

My very concern would be the setup in this case. It is impossible to make a guitar work nicely with a different string gauge within one day. For a Strat I would estimate seven to ten days until neck relief and intonation adjustments will reach steady states.

 

In general, I think that adapting to different string gauges is mostly a mindset thing. I think I wouldn't try that just before a gig. Furthermore, I think for an energetic player a leap to a heavier gauge is easier manageable than to a lighter one. Honestly, I think you will rather have to deal with sharp intonation than with breaking a string.

 

Just my two cents.

[awel]

My very concern would be the setup in this case. It is impossible to make a guitar work nicely with a different string gauge within one day. For a Strat I would estimate seven to ten days until neck relief and intonation adjustments will reach steady states.

 

In general, I think that adapting to different string gauges is mostly a mindset thing. I think I wouldn't try that just before a gig. Furthermore, I think for an energetic player a leap to a heavier gauge is easier manageable than to a lighter one. Honestly, I think you will rather have to deal with sharp intonation than with breaking a string.

 

Just my two cents.

 

Thanks for you comment, but the guitar was stringed 2 weeks ago with 009-046, and I have checked the setup yesterday and as surprising as it seems the setup was good, no trussrod adjustement needed, and the intonation was almost good, just a light set up needed.

 

So from this perspective, I am OK. Now like you said my fear is that with adrenalin of a show my leads will be a bit out of tune (sharp)

 

But let see ... like I said it is an experience and if things goes wrong, I will directly swith to the Black Beauty.

[capmaster]

From reading your post I thought you would go from .010s to .009s right now. After two weeks, there shouldn't be a serious problem.

 

Remember that intonation adjustment also depends on neck curvature, and neck relief will definitely decrease with time. If the truss rod adjustment was fine before, it will call for a slight correction in the near future.

[awel]

The point is now I have to play 2 hours in a row and as the 'lead' guitar, on the Strat, leads like the one in Comfortably Numb, or the verse of Layla where I play the gimmick that support the singing, becomes a bit painfull, so I am looking for some solutions.

[awel]

From reading your post I thought you would go from .010s to .009s right now. After two weeks, there shouldn't be a serious problem.

 

Remember that intonation adjustment also depends on neck curvature, and neck relief will definitely decrease with time. If the truss rod adjustment was fine before, it will call for a slight correction in the near future.

 

Thank you for your advices Capmaster, you seem to have really good knowledge in setup.

Are you some kind of 'pro' of the setup?

 

Next year, I will follow some luthery trainning that will includes whole setup lessons, wood works, refretting ... Can't wait to start :)

[pippy]

Best wishes for the gig, Awel.

 

I'll be interested to hear how you get on with the lighter strings.

Am I correct in thinking that the longer scale of the Strat make the .009s feel a little bit more like the .010s on the Custom in any event?...........

 

Cap; Can you shed some light on this?

 

P.

[capmaster]

From my point of view, string gauge is just one of many factors. Relaxed and easy playing is what saves me the energy for some powerful gimmicks.

 

Perhaps you may wonder about this, but I play easiest on .012"-.054" since they are easiest to control, dynamic as well as intonation. My very reason for playing .011"-.050" on hardtails is the sound of the plain G3rd, and for .010"-.046" on vibrato guitars are vibrato action and bending. I don't have any problems with severely bending .012s including the wound G3rd, but I love the wound G3rd's tone just on my only ES guitar.

 

Anyway, good luck for tonight, trying is the only way to find out.

[capmaster]

...

Am I correct in thinking that the longer scale of the Strat make the .009s feel a little bit more like the .010s on the Custom in any event?...........

 

Cap; Can you shed some light on this?

 

P.

I'll try it in short:

 

Basically, string tension depends on square of scale and on square of string diameter.

Comparing 25.5" to 24.75" leads to a factor of 1.0615 or 106.15% tension at a given gauge.

Comparing .009" to .010" results in 0.81 or 81% tension at a given scale.

At about the same string set balance, a Strat with .009s will have scarcely 86% the string tension of a Les Paul with .010s.

 

I hope this is of help.

[pippy]

Not wishing to stray too far from the topic but I agree about the better control of dynamics with heavier strings.

I play .011 / .048s on the Lesters and love them that way. Never tried .012s though...

 

Just to pick up on soemthing Awel mentioned in the OP;

I believe the Rev. B.F.G only has the .008s on his slide guitars. On the rest he plays .007s.....................

 

P.

[capmaster]

...

I believe the Rev. B.F.G only has the .008s on his slide guitars. On the rest he plays .007s.....................

 

P.

Yes, I've heard that in a rig rundown, too.

 

By the way, the index finger force for fretting barre .008s at the 1st fret is higher than for .012s at the second fret. The other three fingers are a different story but rarely the problem. In most cases, thumb fatigue will set the limits, at least for me.

[Marshall Paul]

Tonight I have a show with my Classic Rock band, and in order to protect a bit my fingers I will try a set of Ernie Ball Coated in 009-046 on my modified Vintage HotRod 62 Strat, so I will pass from 010-046 to 009-046! Hope not to break strings, because I am let say an energic kinda guitar player Already tried it home and I like it but never dare live.

I guess that if Billy Gibbons is able to play with 008 on a Gibson, I will manage to play 009 on a Fender.

 

For sure I will play my Black Beauty as well but this one still in 010-046, if I like it on the Strat perhaps I will try it on the Les Paul but for tonight in case of problems I need a well known tool :)

 

Don't sweat it, your going to do just fine. The drop down your advocating is negligible, very mild. In fact, as you proceed from top E down to bottom E you will probably not notice it at all because the aspect ratio is decreasing as you do so. Barr tension is even less. I've been using 8-38's all my life on everything from the LP's, the strat's and the V's and never had any problems. As for going at them hard, if you can break a 10, then you can break a 9 just as easily, so it's not worth the worry. Just go out, play like you do normally, and have fun.

Best of luck with the set.

[awel]

Don't sweat it, your going to do just fine. The drop down your advocating is negligible, very mild. In fact, as you proceed from top E down to bottom E you will probably not notice it at all because the aspect ratio is decreasing as you do so. Barr tension is even less. I've been using 8-38's all my life on everything from the LP's, the strat's and the V's and never had any problems. As for going at them hard, if you can break a 10, then you can break a 9 just as easily, so it's not worth the worry. Just go out, play like you do normally, and have fun.

Best of luck with the set.

 

Thanks Marshall Paul,

The thing is ... last time I broke a string was around 5 or 6 years ago, whatever guitar I am playing I am not a 'serial string killer' (talking guitar of course )

 

But from what I know I shouldn't break anything ... normally ... ;)

[Marshall Paul]

Thanks Marshall Paul,

The thing is ... last time I broke a string was around 5 or 6 years ago, whatever guitar I am playing I am not a 'serial string killer' (talking guitar of course )

 

But from what I know I shouldn't break anything ... normally ... ;)

 

See, I told ya!

[awel]

So I've had my show and played live with these 009-046... feeling was quite good, feels like home :)

 

I will for sure keep this for my Fender for my Gibson not sure yet

 

Here is a sample from the show with the Fender in 009-046

 

[Rabs]

So I've had my show and played live with these 009-046... feeling was quite good, feels like home :)

 

I will for sure keep this for my Fender for my Gibson not sure yet

 

Here is a sample from the show with the Fender in 009-046

 

Nice solos dude...

 

One of my favourite songs EVER!

[awel]

Nice solos dude...

 

One of my favourite songs EVER!

 

Thanks Rabs, glad you appreciate

[capmaster]

Glad you're fine with the string gauge, nice performance, nice sound, too - with one exception: Everything is clearly audible, nothing is too loud, but your mate also playing guitar simply gets lost. :(

 

Is it just that specific song or a problem in general? Besides his Fender Stratocaster, a bandmate of mine tried playing a PRS for about three years and finally gave it up fifteen years ago. This guitar was either too loud or didn't cut through. One day we asked him why he only played his Strat since a long time, and he told us he had silently sold his useless PRS.

[awel]

Glad you're fine with the string gauge, nice performance, nice sound, too - with one exception: Everything is clearly audible, nothing is too loud, but your mate also playing guitar simply gets lost. :(

 

Is it just that specific song or a problem in general? Besides his Fender Stratocaster, a bandmate of mine tried playing a PRS for about three years and finally gave it up fifteen years ago. This guitar was either too loud or didn't cut through. One day we asked him why he only played his Strat since a long time, and he told us he had silently sold his useless PRS.

 

Thanks Capmaster :)

It is just in some songs, but it is my opinion as well that PRS sounds very well but compare with a Gibson or a Fender, it didn't cut through the mix.

[Cougar]

Solos are out there, man! Whew! Haha...

[PingPongBob]

I rarely comment on performances, but that was very well done awel!!!

I really enjoyed it. Nice playing!!!

[capmaster]

Thanks Capmaster :)

It is just in some songs, but it is my opinion as well that PRS sounds very well but compare with a Gibson or a Fender, it didn't cut through the mix.

The upside clearly is that your nice solos translate very well, note for note.

[Marshall Paul]

Love the solo's mate, well done. Looked like you were having a ball!

Just for your own information, this is Dave Gilmour's basic pedal setup, his basic chain. He rarely deviates from this.

 

1. Compressor (Boss will do the trick)(evens out the signal, adds depth and more sustain)

2. Overdrive (Fulltone OCD, no substitute for quality!)

3. Deja Vibe (Fulltone again)(if you can't afford, an MXR Phase 90 will do)(simulates a 'Leslie Cabinet')

4. Flanger (he uses an Electro-Harmonix Electric Mistress/Flanger, but an MXR Flanger will do)

5. 2X Delay Pedal (Ideally a TC Electronics Nova-Delay and then a Boss DD7, but a Boss DD2 or 3 followed by a Boss DD7 will do it)

 

He also had his strats modified a particular way too. Normal strats can't have all three pups on at the same time, but Daves (and all three of mine) do. And he for the most part leaves all three on regardless of what song he's playing. Daves unique sound is basically the bell ring tones of his solos' (all three pups on with about half tone) and the swirly, etherical effect in his riffs (pedals 3,4 and 5).

If you want to modify your strat so you can sound the same it's really quite easy.

I had the CTS250K Volume pot removed and replaced with a DiMarzio250k Pull/Push pot, and wired to the neck pup. When pulled up it activates the neck pup. Combined with the selector in position 2 (Bridge/Middle) and, Bingo, all three on. Same as Dave. Combined with the chain and pretty soon you'll be out Daveing Dave!

Best of luck mate.

[milod]

Sheesh...

 

To take us back from messing with gear to the initial string question...

 

All but two of my electrics wear 9-42. The exceptions are the old Guild "SG-type" with 8-38 and a Gretsch "jazz" model with a floating pup that I'm using for string experimentation.

 

The question also is rather valid for acoustic and acoustic-electric players - and I consider the two as different as "electric" and "acoustic."

 

IMHO any strings can be played well. Attempting to reproduce a perceived "sound" from another player may cause problems with vastly different strings, especially in our era of various electronic enhancements we're induced to purchase.

 

But I'm convinced that a somewhat different playing technique is required for different gauges of string - and as Cap noted, there are even differences on longer or shorter scale guitars. (Fretboard radius also brings technique differences, but that's another story.)

 

Generally I'd say that with appropriate adjustments of technique, a guitar with lighter strings can bring "tone" considered in the province of heavier strings, but without the degree of volume. That means electric and AE guitars can have incredible dynamics with lighter strings, but the "electric" needs a bit of emphasis. Acoustic... even there, depending on how one might "perform out," can have similar results if desired.

 

Left hand technique is a bit different, and yes there is a requirement for greater precision in fretting the 8s than the 9s. OTOH, I've never found it a problem. My 8s do well even with fast strumming of a flatpick - but without the "dig" of the pick one would likely use on an acoustic.

 

m

[Marshall Paul]

Unfortunately, sometimes it's the gear that makes the difference, the unique sound and texture. Some-one like Dave knows this and goes with it. His pedal boards cost tens of thousands of dollars, made by a very switched on man by the name of Pete Cornish.

More Dave gear stats:

 

Neck -

One-piece maple, reissue C-shaped, .790" to .870" taper.

Length: 25.5".

Fretboard: Maple, 7.25" radius.

Frets: 21, 6130SS vintage jumbo.

Nut: 1.6875".

 

Pups -

Bridge: Seymour Duncan SSL-5

Neck: Fender Custom Hand-Wound Fat'50

 

Dave uses GHS Boomer series strings -

He uses gauges 10, 12, 16, 28, 38, 48 on his Strat

and gauges 10.5, 13, 17, 30, 40, 50 on his Les Paul.

 

And, Clapton uses -

Fender Super 250R, Nickel Plated Steel

Gauges: 10, 13, 17, 26, 36, 46.

 

Ah, the life of a toy monster..