Lars68 Posted March 15, 2016 Share Posted March 15, 2016 I bought my first ever acoustic 12-string a while back (the outrageously different Gretsch White Falcon http://www.gretschguitars.com/products/acoustics/rancher-falcon/g5022cwfe-12-rancher-falcon-jumbo-12-string-cutaway-electric-rosewood-fingerboard-white/ ) I love the full, powerful, and jangly sound of this guitar, but when I record it, the result sounds like crap. The recorded tone does not sound acoustic or close to the real thing at all. It sounds more like the dreaded piezo amped sound most acoustic lovers, including me, hate. I record with with usual approach with mic on the table in front of me, while singing and playing simultaneously. Any ideas as to how I can improve the recorded sound of this guitar? Here is a recording with the 12-string of a song I have posted a few times in different incarnations recently. https://soundcloud.com/lars1968/va-r-stad-12-str-ngad-gitarr Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Run Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 These links might help... http://www.artsulger.com/2007/01/home-recording-12-string.html http://www.soundonso...ecacgtr0801.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avery Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 Not to answer your question, Lars, because I don't know enough to answer it,but I liked hearing your song on a 12 string. Might be my favorite version. I always like watching videos of Gordon Lightfoot play a 12 string: really gives an "oomph" to his strumming songs. That's a pretty bold-looking Gretsch you got there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissouriPicker Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 Lars, I actually think your guitar sounds pretty good. In fact, after hearing it I called a friend who is wanting to sell a 12-string. He's bringing it to my gig tomorrow afternoon. We'll see.....lol.......I do like the fullness of a 12-string's sound. I hope to hear more of your guitar.......And I definitely appreciate the links supplied by Run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 16, 2016 Author Share Posted March 16, 2016 Yes, the Gretsch 12-string is something else, not an average looking guitar. I would never pick a guitar with these cosmetics if it was to be my one and only guitar, but as a wild and crazy departure from the traditional Martins and Gibsons it works perfectly. I appreciate the links. Very helpful. I will try to see if I can record more of a room sound by moving the mic further back. This means I might have to sing louder, which is a good thing too. Maybe I was a little hard on my own recording when I said it sounded like crap. My frustration has more to do with the fact that I can't get a recorded sound that is close to the real thing. I guess the recording is ok in its own right, but the guitar sounds so much better in real life. MP, having a 12-string to play once in a while is a blast and I hope you can get one too. Please keep us updated. I especially find that the 12-string helps me sound better than I really am. I mostly play simple strumming songs, and it makes the sound fuller and bigger with no extra effort. Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Run Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 This musician from my country fell in love with the 12 strings the fist time he tried one and he was the leader of a very popular band called "Harmonium" in Quebec. Here's one of their most popular hit. (As you can hear the sparkling sound of the Guild 12 strings.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 16, 2016 Author Share Posted March 16, 2016 This musician from my country fell in love with the 12 strings the fist time he tried one and he was the leader of a very popular band called "Harmonium" in Quebec. Here's one of their most popular hit. (As you can hear the sparkling sound of the Guild 12 strings.) That is a lovely recorded 12-string tone. Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 To my ears there's nothing really wrong with the sound of your 12-string guitar. I think it's mainly a matter of taste. Positioning a mic on a table calls for positioning it right at the edge on your side to avoid adverse reflections. Did you try putting a mic on a stand and different positions? Could it be you're overly analytical and overcritical when listening to performances or recordings of yourself? My self-awareness tells me that it can be helpful, but as well be a serious obstacle, the destructivity within perfectionism so to say. I'm going through that since many years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 16, 2016 Author Share Posted March 16, 2016 To my ears there's nothing really wrong with the sound of your 12-string guitar. I think it's mainly a matter to taste. Positioning a mic on a table calls for positioning it right at the edge on your side to avoid adverse reflections. Did you try putting a mic on a stand and different positions? Could it be you're overly analytical and overcritical when listening to performances or recordings of yourself? My self-awareness tells me that it can be helpful, but as well be a serious obstacle, the destructivity within perfectionism so to say. I'm going through that since many years... Thanks for your input. I agree after listening some more to the recording that it does sound ok. I was just frustrated because my other guitars sound like reasonably good representations of themselves when recorded the same way, but the 12-string does not. I don't have a mic stand. It is just an iPad and an extrnal little tripod mic (Apogee mic) so fine tuning position is a little hard. I will experiment with placement some more and also try recording facing a corner of the room. You are definetely correct about my over analytical personality when it comes to my own songs. I pretty much agree with Townes Van Zandt who said "I don't think you can ever do you best. Doing your best is a process of trying to do your best." When I write a song, I have a mental image of what I want it to sound like, I keep trying until I get as close as possible within my abilities to achieve that image. This recording won' be my last... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 ... I pretty much agree with Townes Van Zandt who said "I don't think you can ever do you best. Doing your best is a process of trying to do your best." When I write a song, I have a mental image of what I want it to sound like, I keep trying until I get as close as possible within my abilities to achieve that image. ... I couldn't have said it about myself any better! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissouriPicker Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 Thanks for "feeding the fever, Lars. Got me a year old Martin DX1-something-or-other 12-string. Got a spruce top (I guess) and HPL back and sides. The setup is impressive. Extremely easy to play at any fret. Surprised me for a 12ver. To be honest, if I'd hadn't had it in my hands I'd likely never have picked it up in a music store. I shy away from guitars with names that are like an internet password with all those numbers and upper/lower case letters. Martin has gotten bad at that stuff. Anyway, my friend sold it cheap, so I couldn't say "No." Guess I could have, but you know how that goes. I like the ring of the guitar, but chances are I'm going to take the low E and the A octave strings off. Maybe even the D octave. I'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 It occurs to me, the obvious: An acoustic ALWAYS sounds different from the playing position than it does in front. And then of corse, for most, how far away out front. What are you comparing it's sound to? There are two ways to go with this: You can position the mic in the most common and "realistic" place, and use the recording to JUDGE your own sound, and make adjustments (which makes one a better player, or performer, rather). Or, you can use what limited recording equipment you have to create the best recording you can. With one mic, it's kinda hard, but then again simple. If you can monitor with headphones, try pointing the guitar or yourself different directions, even listening to yourself while you record. If you can monitor levels, you could use that to place the mic in different positions or heights to make a balance. EASY with just two sources to record. Another fun deal, if you have a live rig, you can record THAT, and at the same time, record acoustically and blend the two. Anyway, if it's fun, have fun experimenting. And I thought the recording sounded better than most IPOD/Soundcloud stuff to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 16, 2016 Author Share Posted March 16, 2016 Thanks for "feeding the fever, Lars. Got me a year old Martin DX1-something-or-other 12-string. Got a spruce top (I guess) and HPL back and sides. The setup is impressive. Extremely easy to play at any fret. Surprised me for a 12ver. To be honest, if I'd hadn't had it in my hands I'd likely never have picked it up in a music store. I shy away from guitars with names that are like an internet password with all those numbers and upper/lower case letters. Martin has gotten bad at that stuff. Anyway, my friend sold it cheap, so I couldn't say "No." Guess I could have, but you know how that goes. I like the ring of the guitar, but chances are I'm going to take the low E and the A octave strings off. Maybe even the D octave. I'll see. Wonderful! I'm sure you will enjoy it. You are a much better player than I am, so you can surely use it for more than basic strumming. I have never given a thought to removing some of the octave strings. I can see how that would be beneficial at times, especially the low E. Please post pictures and a soundclip or two. Recording tips are welcome too! Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 ... An acoustic ALWAYS sounds different from the playing position than it does in front. And then of course, for most, how far away out front. What are you comparing it's sound to? ... +++1 on this. ^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafy31 Posted March 16, 2016 Share Posted March 16, 2016 For those who enjoy 12 strings and whose ears can handle french i like this video pretty much. Long story short Michel Gentils, great french guitarist explains how he uses sometimes only 1 of the 2 couple of strings, at a time. After 6:30 you can hear the incredible sound he gets from his beauty. Gets interesting with the rythms after 13:30... first in drop D then back to E. Wonder what is this guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L5Larry Posted March 17, 2016 Share Posted March 17, 2016 ... An acoustic ALWAYS sounds different from the playing position than it does in front. As Capmaster has also pointed out, THIS IS THE POINT! What a mic put out front of an acoustic guitar picks up... IS ... what the guitar sounds like, not what comes up and back toward the player. PS: I thought the sound on the recording was fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnt Posted March 18, 2016 Share Posted March 18, 2016 I love my 12 strings But wouldn't want to inflict my singing or playing on the world by recording [biggrin] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars68 Posted March 18, 2016 Author Share Posted March 18, 2016 I love my 12 strings But wouldn't want to inflict my singing or playing on the world by recording [biggrin] Beautiful guitars! Lars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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