Played a bunch of the new Epiphone Archtops today

[flatbaroque]

Firstly they do look great.Real vintage vibe.

I didn't expect to be bowled over by their acoustic sound.....And I wasn't.For anyone whose ear is used to Gibson / Martin flattop tone - these do sound a bit thin, softly voiced and one dimensional.I played five I think from smallest body to largest.

I guess they are really made to be played plugged in.I didn't try that.

Unplugged I guess they are ok for a bit of lounge room playing..but I wouldn't be parting

with a major amount of simoleons to get one.

Not sure if Dave Rawlings plays his little vintage thing unplugged.He could make these new ones sound good I'm sure.

[milod]

I haven't done more than read about them, but here's a point or two to think about....

 

I have played Mother Maybelle's old Gibson archtop and a batch of others back in the '60s.

 

Those instruments were designed as rhythm instruments for mostly unamplified bands.

 

They tended heavy on the middle in order to have any effect on the band's rhythm section.

 

Maybelle used one I think because it actually could be heard on the old recording and live radio equipment, but nobody would claim it matched a high-end flattop. She didn't particularly care, it was the music as a whole.

 

That last, I think, is the important factor. Each instrument we use has to "fit" us as players, and our style and musical purpose.

 

To that, we can adjust our style to the guitar, or two an extent, the guitar choice to our style

 

As a fingerpicker, I'll state that these instruments don't really interest me, but I've happily used small/medium body AE flattops and ES175-size archtops for almost everything I've played in public from jazz to cowboy to classical to stuff like Kottke does (albeit without his skills).

 

m

[Dave F]

My limited experience with f-hole arch tops has taught me to not judge the sound by playing one. You're better off listening from across the room.

[flatbaroque]

Good points Milod and Dave.

I was purely judging on how I heard them compared to my J-45.Different beast I know.

[milod]

I think we're kinda all agreed...

 

Frankly the photos look great, but I'm not particularly interested, not just because I've gotta get my left hand back in gear from that stroke - typing is good enough for work now, but every time I touch a guitar I get sad 'cuz I know it'll take a lotta work to get even close to what the left could do and, as long as I'm working even a shortened schedule, it ain't likely.

 

I prefer the smaller body AND here's the clincher, the shorter scale. These are all long scale.

 

I could see this working especially well acoustic (bigger bodies) with wind instruments, bass and drums, as a rhythm instrument. If drowned out a bit in a given sort of venue and/or group, use it AE. For single string work in a group, probably best play it amplified and a gentler hand on the flatpick.

 

Then again, I have a hunch the purchaser who loves the look and feel of this guitar will have to play it a while and mess with string gauge and playing style to get the most from the instrument and him/herself in whatever it's purposed.

 

That said, if it plays overall as well as it looks... super.

 

m

[BluesKing777]

I am not seeing photos...?

 

 

But you know, there are archtops for archtopping and archtops for show and acoustic archtops and electric archtops and all points between.

 

Early Gibsons were solid woods, mainly maple and my 35 Black Special is joyous! When the jazzers put pickups on them, they screamed like the witch next door on her trampoline, high pitched feedback...so they made the electrics with laminated tops that didn't vibrate and cause the pickup to feed, but the tone is the strings and pickup really.

 

 

But if you want a solid wood archtop to fiddle, FB, they are everywhere if you look, eg an L50. Flattoppers get scared when playing them.

 

 

BluesKing777.

[flatbaroque]

I am not seeing photos...?

 

 

But you know, there are archtops for archtopping and archtops for show and acoustic archtops and electric archtops and all points between.

 

Early Gibsons were solid woods, mainly maple and my 35 Black Special is joyous! When the jazzers put pickups on them, they screamed like the witch next door on her trampoline, high pitched feedback...so they made the electrics with laminated tops that didn't vibrate and cause the pickup to feed, but the tone is the strings and pickup really.

 

 

But if you want a solid wood archtop to fiddle, FB, they are everywhere if you look, eg an L50. Flattoppers get scared when playing them.

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

Thanks BK.Not in the market for an archtop.But when confronted by such a bunch of good looking guitars had to give them a strum.

It was at Allans in Alexandria.Close to home.

Also played a Walnut SJ-100 which was nice.

And one of the best looking bursts ever on a Progressive? J-45.That had an adjustable bridge.Didn't play it ...but what a burst color.A subtle warm brown with a hint of roan/redness.

Oh as for purchases...a ukulele gig bag

[blindboygrunt]

A ukulele gig bag ?

There's a company that will make ya a millionaire eh ?

 

I liked the look of those guitars myself when they were on a video here

Think it was one of JUan Carlos links

 

Like you say though , they're for plugging in aren't they

[MR GIBS]

I have tried 4 of those last week and I agree with the opinions above. Think they all are great guitars for the price, but not my instruments. They sound really great plugged in, I tell you!

[vacamartin]

When the jazzers put pickups on them, they screamed like the witch next door on her trampoline

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

 

Best line I've heard in a while B)

[kelly campbell]

I have tried them out but have not warmed up to one as of yet. I like the look but not the feel and tone. They are not terrible just not for me.

[QuestionMark]

Had my Epiphone Masterbilt Olympic (in honeyburst) almost two months now. Great guitar. Have Martin SP 80/20 Bronze Mediums 13's on it. It's made to be played acoustic or electric and works great either way. Great for melodic fingerpicking. My initial review of it and a soundclip of me playing it (and its sweet spot for playing it) is elsewhere on this acoustic forum from about a month and a half ago or so.

The guitar is super charismatic too...during/after my gigs people love to ask me about it. (Usually something that only happens when I play my vintage Gibsons.). The neck is fine. Got used to it after about ten minutes of my first trying it out. Very comfortable.

 

Just my two cents.

 

QM aka Jazzman Jeff

[BluesKing777]

I recorded a snippet of my 1935 Gibson archtop for you yesterday, but had to go out - here it is, complete with the Gibson growl!

 

https://soundcloud.com/bk7-3/behavin7

 

 

 

Been away for ages loading photo from PhotoB - waited for all their ads to come up and then gt a message that my page is not available.....and then it came up! No idea.

Don't mean to hijack the thread, but I am trying to say that there are good deals on discarded old archtops - people buy them and don't give them enough of a chance, my opinion, and then flog them off cheap. Their loss, your gain if you want to try a decent all solid wood vintage Gibson!

 

(don't expect to play that long sustaining chord without a different approach! But for guitar styles that 'keep moving around' - excellent!)

 

 

Photo of my angel in the short clip above:

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

[milod]

Blues ....

 

NICE!!!!

 

How'd you record it, too?

 

m

[BluesKing777]

Blues ....

 

NICE!!!!

 

How'd you record it, too?

 

m

 

 

I put the mic in front of it and pressed record!

 

Neumann KM184 mic, > mixer > iMac. (I may have o'd the mix a bit in spots because the archies can be really, really loud out front.....)

 

 

BluesKing777.

[BluesKing777]

I mean to say no more but can't help it - look at these babes from an expensive guitar shop...

 

For $1750 you can have this beautiful 1936 Gibson L50:

 

https://cartervintage.com/collections/acoustic-archtop/products/gibson-l-50-1936?variant=25889030211

 

 

 

or for $1250!!!!!! - this 1944 Gibson L50:

 

https://cartervintage.com/collections/acoustic-archtop/products/gibson-l-50-1944?variant=31472311683

 

 

Even if you don't play it, think how cool your next photo shoot could look...or how good it will look on the wall of your front room.....!

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

[QuestionMark]

Regarding archtops, besides the reissued Olympic, I have in my collection a 1936 Epiphone Zenith, a 1933 KayKraft, a late 50's Silvertone, and an acoustic -electric 1965 Gibson 125TC...all archtops.

 

The new reissue fits right in, is economical to purchase, and stands on its own acoustic or electric.

 

QM aka Jazzman Jeff

Ps. Gonna go locate my review and sound clip from a month an a half ago and give it a bump up. Another listen to its sound. It's acoustic in the clip.

[Dave F]

I am not seeing photos...?

 

 

But you know, there are archtops for archtopping and archtops for show and acoustic archtops and electric archtops and all points between.

 

Early Gibsons were solid woods, mainly maple and my 35 Black Special is joyous! When the jazzers put pickups on them, they screamed like the witch next door on her trampoline, high pitched feedback...so they made the electrics with laminated tops that didn't vibrate and cause the pickup to feed, but the tone is the strings and pickup really.

 

 

But if you want a solid wood archtop to fiddle, FB, they are everywhere if you look, eg an L50. Flattoppers get scared when playing them.

 

 

BluesKing777.

I recently acquired an L5 acoustic that came with electric strings. I'm finally starting to experiment with different strings. I just put some Masterbuilt 13's on it. What's been your preference?

[Mojorule]

Tried two examples of the biggest model with F holes a few weeks ago. Didn't do much for me either, and like you, I knew not to expect a flat-top sound. Still expected a bit more oomph and middle than I got. Like you Flatters, didn't have a chance to try them plugged in. Another bloke was listening from across the room and he wasn't impressed either. From his comments, it wasn't just my playing he was turned off by.

 

Tried one of the round-holed ones about a week later. Liked that one slightly more, and it did have more in the mids, as per the blurb, but it still didn't really do it. Not the easiest items to play, and not encouraging me to bring out my old jazz chops beyond very basic comping. Quite high tension and action on all of them to my mind.

[QuestionMark]

Keeping high tension on an archtop' s strings and top helps the archtop sound (the sound bouncing off the top.). About 2 weeks ago I put 13s on the Olympic (it came with 12s). Helped it along. Regarding the action, the adjustable bridge allows one easily to lower the fret action although the string height over the body will definitely be higher than on a flat-top. But, that adjustable floating bridge is really comfortable to rest one's right hand on as well as dampen some notes when desired.

 

QM aka Jazzman Jeff

[QuestionMark]

I recorded a snippet of my 1935 Gibson archtop for you yesterday, but had to go out - here it is, complete with the Gibson growl!

 

https://soundcloud.com/bk7-3/behavin7

 

 

 

Been away for ages loading photo from PhotoB - waited for all their ads to come up and then gt a message that my page is not available.....and then it came up! No idea.

Don't mean to hijack the thread, but I am trying to say that there are good deals on discarded old archtops - people buy them and don't give them enough of a chance, my opinion, and then flog them off cheap. Their loss, your gain if you want to try a decent all solid wood vintage Gibson!

 

(don't expect to play that long sustaining chord without a different approach! But for guitar styles that 'keep moving around' - excellent!)

 

 

Photo of my angel in the short clip above:

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

Sounds good. Nice playing and nice sound on that archtop! Plus, its a beaut!

 

QM aka Jazzman Jeff

[BluesKing777]

I recently acquired an L5 acoustic that came with electric strings. I'm finally starting to experiment with different strings. I just put some Masterbuilt 13's on it. What's been your preference?

 

 

Hmmm, you're not going to like my reply.

 

 

I had MBs on it to try and took them off. I have tried a few standard types of 12s, D'Ad, MB, Elixir PB, Elixir 80/20... whatever spare ones I have in my box!

 

 

And currently, I have Elixir Poly 12s! Which I like only on this guitar, no others. Work that out! The others can get way too bright. And the Elixir Polys still sound new on the occasional and rare times I play the beast! Have to be in an old blues mood....

 

 

BluesKing777.

[BluesKing777]

Sounds good. Nice playing and nice sound on that archtop! Plus, its a beaut!

 

QM aka Jazzman Jeff

 

 

 

Thanks!

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

[milod]

Okay, here's one so you can laugh at a grouchy old man...

 

I used a 1950s Harmony for several years as a saloon band guitar. Very short scale as a tad over 24"

 

Here are specs and pix of other examples than mine:

 

http://harmony.demont.net/guitars/H65/189.htm

 

When I saw this page, I added several years ago: "If I'm not mistaken, my Harmony is this model. I got it in a swap in the mid 1970s. I used it for rock and country on regular weekend gigs. It's still in pretty decent shape although it needs a good cleanup. A very nice sounding guitar, really. Mine has had some mods such as Grover pegs, a Gibson-style adjustable bridge and I have no idea what tailpiece originally was on it. A bit of loss of inlays of the headstock but as has been said, it has held up incredibly well for a guitar more than a half century old."

 

... This guitar has a neck like a baseball bat, as was kinda typical of its original era, but frankly with the shorter scale it remained quite playable and got me into that general size and style guitar that, with a thinner neck, I still prefer.

 

But as for sound amped? AOK.

 

In fact, yes, it's laminate like "the big names" of the era, but I had no feedback problems at loud small saloon gigs.

 

Frankly, if I lived in an area where there were reliable luthiers, it'd be worth it to me to have the neck pared to a more modern thickness and mostly cleaning it up from its age and the lousy Grover additions.

 

It was obviously meant to be an electric, though. Another variation had two pups but, as with the ES175, I'm not at all sure it makes any difference depending on what you're playing.

 

I'm mentioning this not so much because it's so similar to the new Epis, but rather to emphasize that one never quite knows what instrument might just plain "work" for you at various times in your playing.

 

Nowadays if my left hand worked better, I'd almost guarantee folks would see me "out" with a 175, one or two pup. And that's for almost any and every style of music one might imagine, albeit without the "dirty" pedals added that I've not cared to use in over 50 years of pickin' electrics. And I'll also admit that I did quite a bit of "jazz" picking on my Guild S100c that's pretty much an SG clone, but sounds great at almost anything. And that's with 8-38 strings fingerpicked or light flatpicking.

 

Y'know, sometimes you just don't know what might be discovered depending on what music you're playing, how you're playing it in technical terms, and with what strings.

 

Bottom line is that I'm rather pleased I did a lot of experimenting in the '70s and then in the first decade of the 2000s. It showed that a lot of "conventional wisdom" on all sorts of guitar issues, types and strings simply didn't "work" for me.

 

m

[rustystrings]

I still miss my early 30s Gibson L-4 with the round soundhole and the shocking, whomping low end. The hard V-neck took some getting used to, it was riddled with patched holes, the finish had been scraped off the back - but oh, that guitar had something special to it. It managed to project like a good archtop should, but had a wider range than the f-hole variants, or so it seemed to me. There was more low end, better balance, you could finger pick it and get a good old-time sound, you could play jazz chords and be respectable, and if you asked it nicely it could take you into Django country. That combo of the short scale and the archtop with a round soundhole just worked.