Best amp for playing the blues.

[Dave]

Still stuck on my Vox Ad50VT 2-12. The AC30 model is killer with my P90 Goldtop.

 

Anyone tried the Peavy Windsor Half Stack 4-12? I just saw it in the M123 catalog. Price was around $679. 3 12ax7's and 4 EL34's in a single channel amp with an effects loop and 3 band EQ. It looks inviting.

[rafaelh]

Didn't have time to post this yesterday, but being at work now I got all the time in the world..he,he.

 

Anyhow swung by our local GC yesterday afternoon and spent quite a bit a time in what they call the Vault, quiet room, with a used Deluxe, and old old Fender Concert (...poor thing was so old a knob popped off at the voulume I had it on, GREAT sounding though.) and a Epi Valve Jr head with it's matching cab all 3 side by side.

 

BTW...been like a candy store lately in their Vault.....bunch of other pretty good tube amps.

 

Anyhow I still don't know which I liked the best of the 3 I tried yesterday. The Deluxe probably....although I'm sure the Concert after a good overhaul might have given the Deluxe a run for its money.

 

However....and I've been using Fender tube amps for a long time so maybe that's what I really preffer or just gotten use to, LOL...STILL not really sure which, BUT...if this Epi would have had a way to EQ it better, maybe even some verb...not really necessary though, and a bit of more power, not much just enough to get a bit more clean headroom, I do belive I would have taken that one home right then.

 

This little sucker is one great sounding amp. I remember trying the combo when they first came out and it not doing much for me. Don't know what's changed, but I do love the way it sounds like now.

 

Maybe the Epi Sr I keep hearing you folks speak of will have the features I mentioned above....hope so. I do hope if it do it won't change to much of the way the head performs now....just a bit more headroom and on board EQing.

 

Anyhow I tried a USA Standard Strat, Gibson SG...haven't a clue what it was, some blue thing from hell. I can't keep up with the different SG models they keep popping up with. Sounded and felt gret though...as naturaly all SGs do . Also a Washburn HB35 and a Epi Sheraton through these 3 amps....only bad sounds was from my playing.

 

Not that it means anyhting, but that epi Valve Jr really impresed me yesterday. IMO the problem I see with it is that the way it is now is not very versatile. Then again for the reason it was made for it might be? Don't know....just think Epi do have something really good in the works with this amp.

[Teobeck]

I been playing Chicago style blues 52 years, and was weaned on 3 Kings, Mike Bloomfield, etc. and been playing Epiphone semi hollows the whole time (now with 57 classic pups), as well as Gibson ES-345. Played Twin Reverbs in 60s after they came out as amp of choice. After aging, wanted lighter rig. Learned that Blues Jr. and Pro Jr. with EL84 tubes too bright for me (as are all EL84 amps), and tried everything. Found that Blackface/Silverface/Reissue Princeton Reverb also with onboard trem (6V6 tubes, $800) is great choice in small venues, as is new 15W Super Champ XD (also 15W, 6V6 tubes, $299). Both 10" speakers. I have tried all 10" speakers, Weber, Celestion, Emminence, etc. and found that Naylor 1040 10" is fullest, most musical, best mids, etc. Also found that Boss/Fender FDR-1 pedal would add reverb/trem to any tube amp for bluesier sound, and Boss/Fender Bassman pedal would soften EL84 tubes, and the 2 pedals can be used in tandem. When playing rhythm on neck/both pickups NOS 6V6 or 6L6 tubes make the sound blend better with other band members, tightens group sound. Twins have 6L6 tubes. I also had Ben Fargen make me a 30W single channel 30w 6L6 amp head with trem/reverb for larger venues w/out PA which would work with loud drummer, electric keys/Hammond, horn line. Fender Deluxe Reverb also good (lots of gain), I just prefer Princeton sound as it adds reverb/trem, which I consider a must, even tho' they stay on 3. A Boss blues pedal gives all the boost anyone would need for the 6V6 tubes. I also recommend Dr Z Airbrake attenuator on any of the above when you want to overdrive the power tubes at lower volumes and still keep clean sound. Real Chicago blues are played clean.

 

I just attended Blues Awards at Tunica, MS in May, and learned that most younger guys are playing blues figures to mostly rock 'n roll rhythms/beats, whereas older guys learned the blues rhythms mojo from earlier days. This comes from learning shuffles IMHO. Most youngers are great technicians, but lack the soul learned from Gospel and old Motown style R&B (think Otis Redding, Aretha, Gladys).

 

Anyone with a Sheraton II w/57 classics and a Fender Super Champ XD or a small 6V6 tube amp w/reverb/trem pedal can make an outstanding blues sound if they have the mojo feel and technique. Test always was "did it make you want to dance" and "could you "feel" the groove?".

[Teobeck]

FWIW I would add that "blues rock" ala Clapton, SRV, Gary Moore is great also, and now all guitars/amps/pups come into play. Listen to "Ridin' With The King" (BB and Clapton) and you will really distinguish the difference. I didn't want to come off as biased. I love both genres, and also have an EPI G400 Deluxe with 57 classic pups which I use for that. Oft times I sit in with groups that play that as well as rock 'n roll, and love it all. My main playing partner played for years with Danny Gatton (Strat and Tele) in DC area. I also grooved on Roy Buchanon's Tele in this area for years. Don't forget NOS tubes. NOS pre-amp tubes make a big difference, particularly the rectifier tube (the sag makes a big difference). Ampvendor.com has loads of real info on tube amps. I also have Heritage H-157 Les Paul that I never play, as EPI plays and sounds better. For same reasons I prefer my Sheri as the ES-345 has Varitone, and can only be used in large venues with Varitone bypassed, which is really loud.

[rafaelh]

My main playing partner played for years with Danny Gatton (Strat and Tele) in DC area.

 

Talking about Danny Gatton. I got to tell you, kind of funny I guess.

 

Anyhow I play with Danny's nephew....or one of them anyhow. Don't know how many he may have, if he even has more than one, and never asked. Truth be told never heard of Gatton till I met him. At any rate I'm always ragging him about some slick scammer swinging by his Aunt's house and talking her into selling Danny's gear.

 

Much later, after messing with him....hey, what are friends for. I always get a phone call from him calling me an SOB and telling me he just called his Aunt and saying that that will never happen.....NEVER FAILS. He falls for this EVERY TIME and does the same thing. LOL...in the mean time I'm just trying to get him to get Danny's gear down here so I can check it out....like I said what are friends for. Anyways he knows what I'm up to, but the thought still makes him nervous.

 

We just did a mid morning matinee kind of thing today...so I should be getting a phone call from him sometime tonight. He always falls for this

[Steven Lister]

Teobeck -- WELCOME to the forum! Truly is good to have your Chicago blues tone/gear and overall expertise and another "blues brother" on board.

 

The 'feel' is what my ears find lacking in most younger blues players. You really said it well.

I just attended Blues Awards at Tunica' date=' MS in May, and learned that most younger guys are playing blues figures to mostly rock 'n roll rhythms/beats, whereas [u']older guys learned the blues rhythms mojo from earlier days[/u]. This comes from learning shuffles IMHO. Most youngers are great technicians, but lack the soul learned from Gospel and old Motown style R&B (think Otis Redding, Aretha, Gladys).

 

...and Rafael -- as you observed earlier, the V3 VJrs. are greatly improved out-of-the-box --- but there is so much more tone just waiting around in there..., and simple/inexpensive tweaks bring it out. VJr. is the PLATFORM to build blues tone upon.

want clean headroom -- a 2 tubes upgrade, $25.

want reverb/EQ control -- pedals, -$50.

want better lows/mids -- 12" or 2x12" speaker upgrade, $70-150

want more brand XXX tone -- mods or modelers -- its all good.

 

Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby..., I'm going to play on:-"

[Teobeck]

Having tried most aftermarket speakers, i.e. Weber, Emminence, Jensen, Celestion, etc. I want to recommend Naylor speakers in Dallas. Their 10" and 12" speakers are outstanding for the blues sound (and everything else really). They cost a little more, but provide the one upgrade that will give you a real boost. When you like what you're hearing you play better. Joe Naylor of Reverend Guitars invented them, and sold the Company, and the current owner is faithful to the invention. They are awesome. Best 8" for VJr is Weber Vintage or Jensen Vintage (I have Jensen Vintage in 2 amps), and speaker mods are easy, instructions on Net. You can add reverb/trem with Boss/Fender FDR-1 pedal, which is a must for blues, and get both reverb/trem for same price as Holy Grail reverb only pedal. Sometimes on Ebay cheap.

 

I prefer Fender Super Champ 600 as my little amp because it has a fat 6V6 power tube, but VJr is great also. You can try using a 5751 or AT7 pre-amp tube to see if it will give more headroom, but I've never swapped pre-amp tube in a one pre-amp tube amp. If there are three pre-amp tubes the 5751 in position #1 will increase head room ala SRV. The VJr seems to have a SS rectifier, not tube rectified. For the same money one can buy Fender Super Champ XD and get two 6V6 big bottle tubes, 15W, 10" speaker plus DSP reverb, trem, 16 settings. I'm a total Epi guitar fan, but for amps I always like to compare and in this very light grab 'n go category Fender has what it takes for me.

 

If you love to play and have the incentive to practice incessantly you can make anything sound good, but if you get excited about your tone you will play and sound better. Guys who love single coil pickups will always be Fender guys for that clear, bright tone, and guys who love humbuckers will always love that somewhat darker, more powerful tone will always be Epi/Gibson guys. All tone is subjective. Even Fender lead players prefer a rhythm player with humbuckers, as it blends and makes a tighter sound, better background that single coils don't do as well. I'm talking blues, blues rock, R&B, and jazz here. Play a big barre 7th chord with a 7th added and go from G to F# on the turnover in a Bm song like "The Thrill Is Gone" with humbuckers and you will get shivers.

[layboomo]

I think what we are seeing here is that there alot of great choices....the low wattage Fenders seem to be the most popular......but as we all know, in the right hands even a SS rig can sound amazing ala BB!

[rafaelh]

Teobeck --

 

...and Rafael -- as you observed earlier' date=' the V3 VJrs. are greatly improved out-of-the-box --- [b']but there is so much more tone just waiting around in there[/b]..., and simple/inexpensive tweaks bring it out. VJr. is the PLATFORM to build blues tone upon.

want clean headroom -- a 2 tubes upgrade, $25.

want reverb/EQ control -- pedals, -$50.

want better lows/mids -- 12" or 2x12" speaker upgrade, $70-150

want more brand XXX tone -- mods or modelers -- its all good.

 

Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby..., I'm going to play on:-"

 

Yes sir agree and do know. While I was demoing(?spelling) the Epi was thinking I would just need one of my EQs and outboard reverbs, LOL... got tons of stuff around the house, but I'm choosing to wait and see what this Epi Sr I keep hearing some around here speak of is all about....other than what I've read here I know nothing else on it.

 

I really liked what I heard out of this Epi allot though, and as I said earlier just wished it had a tad more headroom. Rolling off my guitar just made me wish it had more power.

 

Swapping pre amp or output tubes never really did much for me in the past as far as getting an amp to sound where I was satisfied with the swap....then again it might with this amp, never owned a 5 watt tube amp before.

 

At any rate I think I'll hold off for the Sr....don't want to end up with another 100 or so dollar paper weight. Lord knows got enough of those.

 

Ditto layboomo...IMO a "GOOD" sounding amp, tube or SS, can't be held responsible or blamed for what comes out of it . Then again I don't really consider any one amp to be "a best" for playing "blues". Might be a different animal needed for something like metal, but blues ? Heck...you could run straight to the board and get a good blues sound IMO.

 

Raf

 

Incredible...now I can't logout

[JefferySmith]

I think what we are seeing here is that there alot of great choices....the low wattage Fenders seem to be the most popular......but as we all know' date=' in the right hands even a SS rig can sound amazing ala BB![/quote']

 

BB King says on his DVD that he has used "Fender Twin" amps for a long time. I assume that he means Fender Twin Reverb, but it could be any of the 2x12" combo amps. Like Eric Clapton, he turns the volume up to "10" and controls the volume from his guitar. That ought to growl.

[rafaelh]

 

BB King says on his DVD that he has used "Fender Twin" amps for a long time.

 

Just from reading about the man, but BB opts to rent his amps in each town where he plays. When his amp of choise is not available, a Gibson Lab Series L-5 solid state amp, he'll opt for a Fender Twin.

[charlie brown]

 

Just from reading about the man' date=' but BB opts to rent his amps in each town where he plays. When his amp of choise is not available, a Gibson Lab Series L-5 solid state amp, he'll opt for a Fender Twin.[/quote']

 

He must use a "Twin Reverb" a lot! LOL! Aren't the Lab Series L-5's a bit scarce, to count on

having them in the cities he plays? Unless there is a source in each town, that knows his needs,

and keeps one..."Just for BB?!"

 

CB

[JefferySmith]

 

Just from reading about the man' date=' but BB opts to rent his amps in each town where he plays. When his amp of choise is not available, a Gibson Lab Series L-5 solid state amp, he'll opt for a Fender Twin.[/quote']

 

He did say that he doesn't take amps to performances (nor do the guitarists in his band). He even mentioned that he doesn't know what amp is on the stage until he gets there!

[charlie brown]

 

He did say that he doesn't take amps to performances (nor do the guitarists in his band). He even mentioned that he doesn't know what amp is on the stage until he gets there!

 

Yet' date=' he still sounds [b']just like BB[/b]! That, tells you a lot! ;>)

 

CB

[rafaelh]

Bit scarce indeed...like I said just info from reading about the man....I like BB allot. For myself I've only seen one L-5 in person....and that was back when the world was still flat.

 

Years ago my Twin use to get rented out for various venues. Anyhow few times it got rented out to where BB was playing so I think L5s where pretty scarce, or darn near non-existing, back then...can only imagine now. Then again don't know for whom the amp was rented for or of it was even used....could have just sat in a corner all night for all I know.

 

I do wish he was the one that played through it this one particular time thougth. When I got it back it had markings on the face where they had the knobs set at. LOL....regardless whomever it may have been, they sure liked it loud.

[JefferySmith]

 

Yet' date=' he still sounds [b']just like BB[/b]! That, tells you a lot! ;>)

 

CB

 

That's what the other guy on the DVD said!

[JefferySmith]

This amp talk has jarred my memory. I didn't used to use a Fender Twin Reverb (2x12"). I used a Fender Super Reverb (I think that was the name) with 4x10" speakers. My lead guitarist used an amp that was virtually identical but it had no reverb. I'll be damned if I can remember the name of it. Somethink like a Fender Concertmaster or something.

[rafaelh]

This amp talk has jarred my memory. I didn't used to use a Fender Twin Reverb (2x12"). I used a Fender Super Reverb (I think that was the name) with 4x10" speakers. My lead guitarist used an amp that was virtually identical but it had no reverb. I'll be damned if I can remember the name of it. Somethink like a Fender Concertmaster or something.

 

Here's a picture of one...might jar your memory.

 

http://www.fargenamps.com/vintage-amps/1963-brownface-fender-concert-guitar-amp-02.jpg

 

I was just cheking one out the other day, but that one had reverb. Definitely one sweet sounding amp I think.

[JefferySmith]

 

Here's a picture of one...might jar your memory.

 

http://www.fargenamps.com/vintage-amps/1963-brownface-fender-concert-guitar-amp-02.jpg

 

I was just cheking one out the other day' date=' but that one had reverb. Definitely one sweet sounding amp I think.[/quote']

That's it! His was black, and they had just discontinued it (so he got a bit of a discount).

[rafaelh]

The one I was trying out the other day was also black, except this one had reverb. Only spent a few minutes with it so didn't really checked it out much other than playing through it...which BTW I thought it sounded great. It is verry rough looking, one of the knobs vibrated off while I was playing it. They're asking 770 for it, but not knowing much about them to begin with, or if anything might be wrong with it electronically. I'm thinking best to just look the other way.

[JefferySmith]

The one I was trying out the other day was also black' date=' except this one had reverb. Only spent a few minutes with it so didn't really checked it out much other than playing through it...which BTW I thought it sounded great. It is verry rough looking, one of the knobs vibrated off while I was playing it. They're asking 770 for it, but not knowing much about them to begin with, or if anything might be wrong with it electronically. I'm thinking best to just look the other way. [/quote']

 

I think it went for about $300 in the 60's, maning that it would be about $2200 nowadays.

[rafaelh]

 

I think it went for about $300 in the 60's' date=' maning that it would be about $2200 nowadays.[/quote']

 

Woe...maybe I'll give this one another look :- . At the very least to find out what year it is anyhow...O' man, why Jeffery why :)

[JefferySmith]

 

Woe...maybe I'll give this one another look :- . At the very least to find out what year it is anyhow...O' man' date=' why Jeffery why :) [/quote']

I don't know how well those kinds of electronics age (I don't even know where to buy a tube these days!).

[strangedogs]

been a Bluesman all my life (since the 60's)... played on $25 amps and $1000 amps. It ain't the amp boys - it's what's eatin' ya' up inside... Most of my HEROS were poor and used Pawn Shop equipment and cheap old amps. But they "PLAYED THEM".

[layboomo]

This amp talk has jarred my memory. I didn't used to use a Fender Twin Reverb (2x12"). I used a Fender Super Reverb (I think that was the name) with 4x10" speakers. My lead guitarist used an amp that was virtually identical but it had no reverb. I'll be damned if I can remember the name of it. Somethink like a Fender Concertmaster or something.

 

Now your talkin' blues amps ! Super reverbs are the balls! A good less expensive modern option is actually a peavey classic 50/410. I have 2 of em....great amps!