RenegadeMaster Posted February 4, 2009 Author Share Posted February 4, 2009 Yeah I was pursueing that, that is what I would like preferably, an Elitist but I think they are very hard to find and I havn't got the patience :- the only thing with the Agiles, poor pick ups right? Wouldn't be hard to buy some new ones like but what do people think http://www.guitarjapan.com/edwards/spec/e-lp-90ltc.html that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralphtown Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 I,d take a nice strole down Denmark St,London,try all the LPs you can get your grubby paws on. You,ll find that there are better guitars than Epi LPs and Epi LPs that look the same as the one you just tried but feel and sound better. With £500 in your sky rocket,you should get yourself a craking deal with cash. RALPH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobinTheHood Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Well then I guess the only real Les paul was the first one off the production line. Stick with Epi or Gibby. You won't be sorry. Squabbling over semantics is the opposite of helpful. Renegade, I have four Korean made Epis, and they are of very good quality and build. I cant say much for the electronics and PUPs because almost any Epi you buy, you will find these things to be subpar...unless you go for the top models. Personally, I wouldnt touch a Chinese Epi with a ten foot pole. Not yet, anyway. Maybe in a few years if they get their s**t together. But if I was going to buy a Chinese EPi (or any guitar for that matter) I would try it out before purchasing if possible. Buying guitars online is a crapshoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
custer Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Yes, in fact I have played an Agile DUDE, thats exactally why I recomend Epi or Gibby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KYSohn Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 the only thing with the Agiles' date=' poor pick ups right?[/quote'] Well, this is Epi forum... But since Agile was brought up and since OP is inquiring, I'd like to add my $.02... (I do currently own Agile AL3000 and had AL2000 before, so I can speak from my experience) The stock PUPs on AL3000 (Alnico V) are more than just usable. They are little more on bright side. But very much usable and are much better than the stock PUPs on Epi standard. You can read what others are saying about its PUPs http://reviews.harmony-central.com/reviews/Guitar/product/Agile/AL3000/10/1 The bottom line is that the Agile AL3000 is a MUCH MORE of a guitar than Epi Standard and at least equal to Epi Custom. If you take a look at the spec for AL3000, you have to say they are impressive. http://www.rondomusic.com/alspec.html Only thing I found lacking is the real thick maple cap. And OP mentioned that there must be a reason they were that cheap. Well, the reason they are that cheap is because there isn't much overhead cost on these guitars. Agile is a house brand of Rondo Music. He (the owner) has the guitars produced by a factory in Korea by his spec and receives the shipments. Then he puts those in a warehouse and sells directly to end users like you and I. So no additional costs coming from distribution, dealer incentives, advertising/marketing, endorsement fees, etc.---- Basically, the price on AL3000 is the price without all the bubbles that usually come with a "name brand" guitars. Not sure if Rondo can ship a guitar to UK. But you certainly can email them and ask I think Agile 3000 is worth considering... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KYSohn Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Yes' date=' in fact I have played an Agile DUDE, thats exactally why I recomend Epi or Gibby.[/quote']I don't mean to be disrespectful, but did you own one before or did you simply have a chance to play one briefly at a store? If you did own one, did you have a problem with it? If so, did you try to contact Rondo for a return/exchange? One thing about Rondo Music is that they are really great at customer service. So if you owned an Agile with defects, then Rondo surely would've exchanged it for you. If you had a chance to play one at a store, then it must've been a used one because there is only one retailer with brand-new Agiles - Rondo Music in either Maine or Vermont??? So there's a chance that the previous owner totally abused it. Or s/he had a problem with it and simply sold/traded it instead of contacting Rondo Music... The reason I'm asking is because it is not as common to hear about problems with Agiles. Of course, every manufacturer is bound to produce a dog or two time to time. But I think Agile has better overall QC than Epi, based on what I hear and what I personally experienced. So your comment on Agile kind of surprised me... That's all... BTW, I hereby do state that I do NOT work for Rondo, nor getting any $$ for saying nice things about Agile!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memphs1978 Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 I don't mean to be disrespectful' date=' but did you own one before or did you simply have a chance to play one briefly at a store? If you did own one, did you have a problem with it? If so, did you try to contact Rondo for a return/exchange? One thing about Rondo Music is that they are really great at customer service. So if you owned an Agile with defects, then Rondo surely would've exchanged it for you. If you had a chance to play one at a store, then it must've been a used one because there is only one retailer with brand-new Agiles - Rondo Music in either Maine or Vermont??? So there's a chance that the previous owner totally abused it. Or s/he had a problem with it and simply sold/traded it instead of contacting Rondo Music... The reason I'm asking is because it is not as common to hear about problems with Agiles. Of course, every manufacturer is bound to produce a dog or two time to time. But I think Agile has better overall QC than Epi, based on what I hear and what I personally experienced. So your comment on Agile kind of surprised me... That's all... BTW, I hereby do state that I do NOT work for Rondo, nor getting any $$ for saying nice things about Agile!!! [/quote'] good post dont worry about getting any crap from me.. the man asked for advice i gave it to him... and ive only had my agile for about 5 days now but it is by far one of the nicest guitars i own and truth be told i cant wait to buy a new one from them... it really bothers me when people are soo blind and closeted off to the fact that there are MUCH nicer and better guitars for less money then Epiphone's ( witch i love but.. ) when you get down to dollars and cents how much sence does it make to spend $3oo-4oo more on a sub par guitar just to get a name.. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JefferySmith Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 As some of you are probably aware I am still in the process of purchasing a Les Paul Custom Ebony guitarNow' date=' I have to ask for your honesty here, and hope I can get a truly unbiased response, the question I have is, is Epiphone the way to go? Are they any alternatives? (Such as maybe Tokai) that are maybe better? Discuss :D[/quote'] When I recommended the Agile, I didn't realize that you were in the UK. Agile may not be in your neck of the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JefferySmith Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Not snobbish at all. He stated he wanted a Les Paul and the fact of the matter is only Epi and Gibby make Les Paul. Everything else is a copy. I have to admit that I think of "Les Paul" as the style and not the name on the truss rod cover. We make the same gaff when talking about SG models (I don't think the Epiphone SG models are SGs either, but even Epiphone has them under the "SG" name when you look for them on their web site). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KYSohn Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 I just checked Rondo Music's site, and it seems they can/do send a guitar to UK. "We do on occasion ship to Western Europe: Customers ordering outside the US & Canada are also responsible for paying their own customs duty / VAT, which will be added to your bill on all export sales and is due upon receipt of order. Customs duty and brokerage charges (for orders outside the US) are not refundable for any reason. Orders shipped outside of the US and Canada are not refundable. " (from http://www.rondomusic.com/returns.html) BUT, "Orders shipped outside of the US and Canada are not refundable." So I guess there is a risk involved in... Something to think about... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
custer Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 The Agile I played is owned by a close friend of mine and I have played it quite a few times. Sorry, not trying to dis anybody or cause a problem, but I'm just not impressed with that guitar. Granted it might be a bad one but I have to comment on what I have played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KYSohn Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 good post dont worry about getting any crap from me.. the man asked for advice i gave it to him... and ive only had my agile for about 5 days now but it is by far one of the nicest guitars i own and truth be told i cant wait to buy a new one from them... it really bothers me when people are soo blind and closeted off to the fact that there are MUCH nicer and better guitars for less money then Epiphone's ( witch i love but.. ) when you get down to dollars and cents how much sence does it make to spend $3oo-4oo more on a sub par guitar just to get a name.. I know I won't get any crap from you because I know you can recognize a good value like Agiles when you see one!!! BTW, if you like your AL2000, then wait 'till you get a hold of an AL3000!!! It is even better value and a guitar than AL2000!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KYSohn Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 The Agile I played is owned by a close friend of mine and I have played it quite a few times. Sorry' date=' not trying to dis anybody or cause a problem, but I'm just not impressed with that guitar. Granted it might be a bad one but I have to comment on what I have played.[/quote']Well, it sounds fair. Seems that you've had much more than just a brief playing time with an Agile. So if you didn't like what saw/heard/felt from your first-hand experience of playing that Agile, then I have to say that you do have a valid reason for recommending an Epi over an Agile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memphs1978 Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 I know I won't get any crap from you because I know you can recognize a good value like Agiles when you see one!!! BTW' date=' if you like your AL2000, then wait 'till you get a hold of an AL3000!!! It is even better value and a guitar than AL2000!!! [/quote'] im looking at the AL2900 thats one sexy guitar!!! ( do they make them in other colors or is black it? ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brad1 Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Everyone is entitled to there opinion and that is the purpose of this discussion' date=' I appreciate the inputyou have given on the Agile guitars and I am considering it, could people please not be biased just because this is an Epiphone forum, [b']if you think an Epiphone is best, state your reasons why [/b] First, the country of China manufactures some great guitars, and some not so great. Same thing can be said of Japan, Korea, the US and every other country in the world. Depends on the company, factory, year and many other factors. As to why some believe Epi's are best - that is a personal opinion, there is no "Best". It's a subjective thing. We each have our own reasons for why something is "Best". I like Epi guitars because I think they, on the whole, are a well made guitar, at a decent price; it's that simple. They're a great value. But they are not the only ones. So look around and try some out. Simply asking others to tell you what the "Best" is doesn't really cut it. Play some yourself and see what YOU think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyberpunk409 Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Epiphone and Gibson are not the "only" 2 officially authorised Les Paul makers... there was also ORVILLE and ORVILLE BY GIBSON (ObG). The right ObG is pretty much on par with a gibby - nitro finish, solid flamed top, fret edge binding, etc. But they're not cheap!! I'm a BIG fan of Edwards LP copies. They're affordable and have all the features of an elitist but MORE. - 1 piece african mahogany back - 1 piece mahogany neck (not 3 like epis - headstock + neck + heal) - Seymour DUncan p'ups stock - Long neck tenon - 17 degree headstock angle - Gibson shaped headstock - 1.5cm thick maple cap (with flamed veneer) - Gotoh (MIJ) hardware - etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
generation zero Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Yeah, the Edwards copies look like a decent guitar from the pics. I wouldn't mind giving one a go... shame they're not easy to find in a Guitar Center, LOL... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antwhi2001 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 If you do some research into Japanese LP production in the late 70s/ 80s you'll find that several brands were producing Les Paul style guitars which were much closer to Gibson specs than current Epis. Non-Japanese Epi LPs are no more than average copies; authorised, yes, but copies which don't even attempt to match the same spec (wood, frets, hardware, electrics, lacquer, even structure - neck joint, headstock angle, proper maple cap...all compromised on an Epi.). Check out Edwards, Burny, Greco, Tokai guitars from that period. http://www.japanguitars.co.uk/index.htm They come up on UK E-Bay pretty regularly at prices £400-£500 and what you get is much closer to a "real" LP than any Chinese or Korean Epi. I've played a Greco and a Tokai and they were very classy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 REALLY the only " les paul " is made by gibson... the epi is a copy.. just like ron said.. When you are owned by the company that holds the "Les Paul" trademark, you have the legal right to apply the name to other products that you make. Other manufacturers do not own the right to use the Les Paul name. Whether there is a functional difference doesn't matter. Only Fender can make a Squire "Stratocaster" and "Telecaster". Only Epiphone can make the Les Paul in another line. It's a stamp of approval, not a stamp that indicates it's a Gibson Les Paul. The point is that a name can be used. That doesn't indicate whether it's a copy, which it is, but that the name is owned by and that use is approved by Gibson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyGibson Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 When I was looking for a Les Paul, I went through the whole gambit of looking at all the different manufacturers out there. Ebay had many knock offs at cheap and not so cheap prices, many seconds and B-socks, and pleny of used LP's. All the on-line sellers seemed to carry the same brands at the same prices. I also looked at Agile's and was really tempted to get one. All the reviews were very positive. No one said one thing negative about them. That automatically makes me suspiscious. (Which by the way is why I like this forum - there is a very diverse set of opinions). I ultimately bought an Epi Standard - Cherry Burst. I also now have a '56 Goldtop. I bought the Epi's because they are made well and a good value. They're also shaped like a Les Paul. The specs. on an Agile look good. I've never played one. All the pictures look good too. However, they are not shaped like a real Les Paul. The Epi vs Gibby can be debated forever. To me it's like a Chevy vs. Cadilac. You can buy a Tahoe. Or you can buy an Escalade. It's all in what you want to pay or can afford. Personally, I see more value in the Tahoe. But the Escalade is a lot prettier. I think I got off point. Buy whatever makes you feel good and is right for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antwhi2001 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Dave, I suppose my point was that if you base it on taking the Gibson Les Paul as the original, there are many Asian copies which are much more authentic to that in structure and materials than current Epis, which are different in so many regards. They are closer copies than the Epis, which are engineered to be lower cost in all regards, and only superficially like a Gibson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
custer Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Not trying to offend ANYONE, but, maybe the post should read Les Paul Style. As far as I see it, if you want a Les Paul there are only two choices, Epi and Gibson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeMaster Posted February 5, 2009 Author Share Posted February 5, 2009 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320337075480&fromMakeTrack=true What do people think of this And what does the part about the fret 60-70% mean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JefferySmith Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 The Orvilles are very popular on the Les Paul forum. They are sort of like Elitists, i.e., Japanese-made guitars under the Gibson aegis. If Orvilles were sold in the USA today, they would seriously eat into Epiphone's profits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeMaster Posted February 5, 2009 Author Share Posted February 5, 2009 I know about Orville generally, I have heard Orville by Gibson is even better, just thinking of what people think Should I trust this seller? Seems like a really really good deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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