What am I missing?

[tweed2]

I will admit that unlike several regulars here, I am not up on some of the subtle differences in Epiphone guitars over the years. I ran across this browsing thru eBay , this morning. Obviously, it being a natural guitar caught my eye. And the words "early" and "rare". The weathered-looking natural finish does give it older look, but the USED stamp started casting doubts, along with the modern looking tuners. Can't be that old. Anybody have a guess on what year Broadway this is? And when did the USED stamps start?

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Very-Early-Rare-Gibson-Epiphone-Natural-Blond-Jumbo-Hollow-Body-Electric-Guitar-/261338962094?pt=Guitar&hash=item3cd90418ae#ht_2423wt_1383

[rct]

USED is the same as 2, for most manufacturers, and I doubt Epiphone is any different. It's a second, it was sold at least to the dealer level, and returned for some factory defect. To sell it again they stamp it as 2 or USED.

 

rct

[rct]

the "USED" stamp usually looks way different than the one on this guitar !

 

Oh! Well nevermind then!

 

rct

[Lord Summerisle]

It's an interesting piece all the way around, really.

 

A trapeze tailpiece rather than a frequensator. Also, to my eyes, I'd guess the colour is non-original - but it seems pleasant enough. Either way, it doesn't strike me as Epiphone "NA" - and it looks to be a slightly flat or satin finish. Sanded, stained and slightly polished - or just a patina of age?

 

Surely the "NA 174200" label is basically meaningless - it's a modern Epi, it wasn't made in the early 1960s. And, of course, there is no serial number stamped into the headstock.

 

The "rare" comment by the seller is hyperbole. Looking at the rest of his site, all of his guitars are "rare" or "early."

 

That said, I don't think guitars like this jump up and down screaming, "fake." That would actually be far from my mind, probably, if I chose to buy it. To my mind, it looks like an Asian Epiphone that's gone on a bit of a journey - clearly a 2nd that's had some modification earlier in its life. To that extent, one could regard it as a guitar that started life as an Epiphone, and has then evolved, (perhaps uniquely)?

 

It might be a very nice guitar, but it's one of those guitars I'd want to play in person before buying, rather than purchasing online. It is an oddity, and the only way, I think, to decide what one is willing to pay for a guitar like that is to value it on its own terms as an instrument, rather than thinking about fair market value of comparable guitars.

[charlie brown]

Seems to be a Korean made Broadway. With possibly a tailpice switch,

from frequensator, to trapeze. Lot's of folks did (and still do) do

this, on these and even the Riviera models, of the same time period.

As long as it's done properly, it shouldn't make any real drastic

difference in playbility, or "tone."

 

The "used" stamp, generally means it was what we used to call a "second"

due to some cosmetic "flaw," which is often times impossible, or nearly

so, to detect. Sometimes, it was stamped that way, as well, to designate

a "refurb" guitar. They CAN be every bit as good as the non-used versions,

but I'd take a bit of extra caution, especially if you cannot play it, inspect

it prior to the transaction. But then, I don't buy ANY guitars, without

playing them, and inspecting them, "in the flesh!" Used, or otherwise.

That's just Me!

 

Good Luck!

 

CB

[Parabar]

The "used" stamp, generally means it was what we used to call a "second"

due to some cosmetic "flaw," which is often times impossible, or nearly

so, to detect. Sometimes, it was stamped that way, as well, to designate

a "refurb" guitar. They CAN be every bit as good as the non-used versions,

but I'd take a bit of extra caution, especially if you cannot play it, inspect

it prior to the transaction. But then, I don't buy ANY guitars, without

playing them, and inspecting them, "in the flesh!" Used, or otherwise.

That's just Me!

 

Good Luck!

 

CB

 

Actually, there is a big difference between "Used" and "2nd." A Second is one that has a cosmetic flaw of some sort that is judged not to be serious, and is shipped to the retailer as a new guitar with functional warranty, but at a reduced price. The "USED" stamp indicates a guitar that has been returned by the dealer (for whatever reason --- even if not a defect) and is then stamped "USED" so that dealers may not re-sell them as new guitars, and any warranty is voided. These guitars often have other features changed by the factory (tailpieces, knobs, pickguards, etc.) before returning to the dealer, to further distinguish them from new models.

 

The one in this case looks to be a Korean reissue (the Japanese ones had a slightly different body shape and a bracket end to the fingerboard) --- the f-holes look like Peerless, so I'd guess it's from the mid to late 90's.

[charlie brown]

 

The "used" stamp, generally means it was what we used to call a "second"

due to some cosmetic "flaw," which is often times impossible, or nearly

so, to detect. Sometimes, it was stamped that way, as well, to designate

a "refurb" guitar. They CAN be every bit as good as the non-used versions,

but I'd take a bit of extra caution, especially if you cannot play it, inspect

it prior to the transaction. But then, I don't buy ANY guitars, without

playing them, and inspecting them, "in the flesh!" Used, or otherwise.

That's just Me!

 

Good Luck!

 

CB

 

 

 

Actually, there is a big difference between "Used" and "2nd." A Second is one that has a cosmetic flaw of some sort that is judged not to be serious, and is shipped to the retailer as a new guitar with functional warranty, but at a reduced price. The "USED" stamp indicates a guitar that has been returned by the dealer (for whatever reason --- even if not a defect) and is then stamped "USED" so that dealers may not re-sell them as new guitars, and any warranty is voided. These guitars often have other features changed by the factory (tailpieces, knobs, pickguards, etc.) before returning to the dealer, to further distinguish them from new models.

 

The one in this case looks to be a Korean reissue (the Japanese ones had a slightly different body shape and a bracket end to the fingerboard) --- the f-holes look like Peerless, so I'd guess it's from the mid to late 90's.

 

Understood, Parabar...it's just that some dealers don't stamp 2 or 2nd anymore...they use "used"

for both. The factories stamped 2 or 2nd, for years...but, a lot of them are actually destroying

2nds nowadays, apparently. A lot of the "used" ones, as you say ARE returned, or "refurbished,"

as mentioned earlier, and sold (a lot) on E-bay. So, without knowing this particular guitar's

history, I was merely speculating, what it "could" be.

 

Anyway, all good points!

 

CB

[bobouz]

I have a wine red 2004 Peerless Casino which I purchased new with warranty, and it's a factory second ("2nd" stamped on the back of the peghead). Other then one very small finish flaw on the side, it's spot on perfect. It was sold for $100 off the going street price, which is probably a good portion of what the dealer saved on his cost. A win-win all around.

[tweed2]

Absolutely, a big thumbs up on Epi 2NDs. My Zephyr Blues Deluxe is one and I saved about $175 off of the going price for a finish imperfection, smaller than the head of a pencil eraser.

[crust]

Do "you guys" think it might be a "mirc" guitar ?

http://www.mircweb.com/