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BluesKing777
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Crikey BK

You’re gonna have to change your handle to GK

Gadget king

 

 

 

Your grip of the blues kinda saves you though

 

 

 

Thanks BBG!

 

 

But it would have to be more like GFAG King (Gadgets For Acoustic Guitars) because anything new for acoustic guitars can be very urgent whereas other stuff is...stuff. I have the first wave of flatscreens, iPhone...2 maybe? But acoustika, that’s a ‘Needful Thing’ (see Steven King novel)....

 

 

BluesKing777.

Edited by BluesKing777
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While I have heard some nice tones using a tonedexter, to me (just me) it's NOT an acoustic sound. It's a synthetic sound.

 

Could I pick an A/B recording, which is real/which is not?

 

Nope.

 

But the idea of nitpicking strings, pins, saddles, nuts, woods, picks and such to infinity and then using a tonedexter is simply oxymoronic to me.

 

BK, that sounds just like you and it sounds great. I mean no dis-respect, I just don't get the Dexter.

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At the heart of it is just a super eq.

 

So I plug in my Neumann KM184 mic and my acoustic guitar (LG3 in this track) with undersaddle pickup and Tonedexter compares the eq from the mic’d guitar to the eq from the pickup and makes a file you can save, when happy with it, then disconnect the mic and stuff and use the Tonedexter as a footpedal at a gig/recording. Instead of the quacky undersaddle pickup sound, you get the sound of your guitar mic’d.

 

I like it!

 

Dilemmas! I like acoustic guitars with the ‘dual source’ pickup systems ( pickup plus internal mic ) like my little Maton, sounds great, but that has the barn door controls that a lot of people don’t like - and I am never ever ever going to put one of those in the 59 LG3. It had a pickup when I bought it, and plugged in to my mixer sounds like cardboard tearing undersaddle ...quack. So through the Tonedexter, it sounds like the recording above. Cool.

 

I have used the Aura gear since they came out years ago and love it, but they wouldn’t have a sound image for my LG3 or my Maton, so you use the closest one to your guitar they have. With the Tonedexter, you make your own sound image, like some people send their guitar to Fishman to get Custom Aura sounds.

 

I always had trouble with my Dobro live - the bestsound was a plain old Shure SM57 but you never get any level...or monitors without feedback. Mine has a piezo pickup and through the Tonedexter it sounds so good, I wish I had it all those years ago! It would have made gigs very easy.

 

 

BluesKing777.

Edited by BluesKing777
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While I have heard some nice tones using a tonedexter, to me (just me) it's NOT an acoustic sound. It's a synthetic sound.

 

Could I pick an A/B recording, which is real/which is not?

 

Nope.

 

But the idea of nitpicking strings, pins, saddles, nuts, woods, picks and such to infinity and then using a tonedexter is simply oxymoronic to me.

 

BK, that sounds just like you and it sounds great. I mean no dis-respect, I just don't get the Dexter.

 

What do you do murph?

 

Just mic the guitar ?

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Thanks GW and KC!

 

 

Oh, the settings I used for the track above are designed for playing live - the highs and lows that cause feedback are chopped out a bit (automatically) so you can play louder without squeals, and a few other tweaks.

 

There is another setting that doesn’t do any of this to the eq, and is probably good for recordings, we are told in the manual. I will try it out.

 

 

edit : I have since tried this 'recording' slot in the TD and it is fabulous. More to come..... [flapper]

 

BluesKing777.

Edited by BluesKing777
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I love the performance, but...

 

to my ear, it doesn't sound much like a 1959 LG-2.

 

How about doing the same tune as an absolutely "dry" recording through a good mic (no eq, no effects, no signal processing, nuthin'), just for the sake of comparison?

 

 

 

Requests?

 

And zip in the jar? Back to the blues gig, am I?

 

And it is an LG3! Very different than the LG2 - better wood. [biggrin]

 

 

Kidding - I was going to do just that but the mic and leads and things are all running through the new setup and I don't want to alter it just yet. (I got some tips from the guy that makes the TD before! So if record through a certain slot it will be more 'acoustic' for the taping, and apparently I can then save to 22 files! Though to do all my guitars, I may need.....just kidding again - I don't have many with undersaddle pickups... or K&K, none.

 

And then I will do a little comparison. [glare]

 

But the aim of the TD is the same as the Fishman Aura .....to get rid of the dreadful quack from an undersaddle pickup, and I can adjust the mic position to get different sounds but so far, mission accomplished. I will play with the sound I have ...weekend coming up....

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

Edited by BluesKing777
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I love the performance, but...

 

to my ear, it doesn't sound much like a 1959 LG-2.

 

How about doing the same tune as an absolutely "dry" recording through a good mic (no eq, no effects, no signal processing, nuthin'), just for the sake of comparison?

 

 

 

 

OK - (1959 LG3) recording done as asked - no effects, no eq, anything.

 

 

1 First section - LG3 through passive undersaddle (maybe Martin Thinline) pickup - as it is passive, no preamp, it is impossible to get any level at all, so you would never do this. But I did.

 

WATCH out for volume jump next....

 

2. Through Neumann KM184 mic....great for this, great all over but no good live as it will pick up the cabby talking in his car down the street.

 

3. LG3 through the pickup above but run to the image in Tonedexter that I created earlier:

 

 

 

 

https://soundcloud.com/bk7-3/test-lg37a

 

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

Edited by BluesKing777
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What do you do murph?

 

Struggle.

 

Fight it everyday !

 

Live with a p.a. I usually use the Carvin AG100D as a pre-amp, and personal monitor. It has a lot of eq and the first channel is voiced for acoustic guitar. (2nd for bass and 3rd for vocals with XLR and 1/4" giving you even more options) And the tweeter has an adjustment as well. Then a line out to the board. Rarely use any effects.

 

If the amp is used with no p.a. (rarely) it has an out for a monitor.

 

PHymV82.jpg

 

 

97Bu7l4.jpg

 

By no means perfect, I tweak crap regularly and struggle with tone like we all do.

 

Your recording sounded awesome man, I was just of the impression that the Dexter was a "modeler" type tool which goes against everything I believe. I had no business making a comment if I don't know what I'm talking about and for this I apologize. You ALWAYS have good tone.

Edited by Murph
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Requests?

 

And zip in the jar? Back to the blues gig, am I?

 

And it is an LG3! Very different than the LG2 - better wood. [biggrin]

 

 

Kidding - I was going to do just that but the mic and leads and things are all running through the new setup and I don't want to alter it just yet. (I got some tips from the guy that makes the TD before! So if record through a certain slot it will be more 'acoustic' for the taping, and apparently I can then save to 22 files! Though to do all my guitars, I may need.....just kidding again - I don't have many with undersaddle pickups... or K&K, none.

 

And then I will do a little comparison. [glare]

 

But the aim of the TD is the same as the Fishman Aura .....to get rid of the dreadful quack from an undersaddle pickup, and I can adjust the mic position to get different sounds but so far, mission accomplished. I will play with the sound I have ...weekend coming up....

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

Its sounds to me like you are 90+% over to a pure mic'd sound (and great playing by the way).

So I have a T^&lor (nobody likes that name here) with a pre-aura fishman pickup. I can set it for full quack, full feedback or a blend getting me both quack and feedback at the same time. I haven't wanted to replace the pickup because anything else would just leave a big hole in the side of the guitar where the controls go. But if I understand, I can just set the pickup for full piezo and the Tonedexter will magically make it sound like a real guitar with no more feedback worries?

I used to have a Gibson J-165 with the fishman aura pickup and that was really amazing - no feedback problems and it sounded exactly like that guitar but louder.

I've got another guitar (OM type) with no pickup at all. Does anyone have any recommendations for a pickup to put in? Are there mic style pickups that don't feedback as much as my old fishman and for that matter do all undersaddle pickups quack?

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Requests?

 

And zip in the jar? Back to the blues gig, am I?

 

And it is an LG3! Very different than the LG2 - better wood. [biggrin]

 

 

Kidding - I was going to do just that but the mic and leads and things are all running through the new setup and I don't want to alter it just yet. (I got some tips from the guy that makes the TD before! So if record through a certain slot it will be more 'acoustic' for the taping, and apparently I can then save to 22 files! Though to do all my guitars, I may need.....just kidding again - I don't have many with undersaddle pickups... or K&K, none.

 

And then I will do a little comparison. [glare]

 

But the aim of the TD is the same as the Fishman Aura .....to get rid of the dreadful quack from an undersaddle pickup, and I can adjust the mic position to get different sounds but so far, mission accomplished. I will play with the sound I have ...weekend coming up....

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

Its sounds to me like you are 90+% over to a pure mic'd sound (and great playing by the way).

So I have a T^&lor (nobody likes that name here) with a pre-aura fishman pickup. I can set it for full quack, full feedback or a blend getting me both quack and feedback at the same time. I haven't wanted to replace the pickup because anything else would just leave a big hole in the side of the guitar where the controls go. But if I understand, I can just set the pickup for full piezo and the Tonedexter will magically make it sound like a real guitar with no more feedback worries?

I used to have a Gibson J-165 with the fishman aura pickup and that was really amazing - no feedback problems and it sounded exactly like that guitar but louder.

I've got another guitar (OM type) with no pickup at all. Does anyone have any recommendations for a pickup to put in? Are there mic style pickups that don't feedback as much as my old fishman and for that matter do all undersaddle pickups quack?

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Its sounds to me like you are 90+% over to a pure mic'd sound (and great playing by the way).

So I have a T^&lor (nobody likes that name here) with a pre-aura fishman pickup. I can set it for full quack, full feedback or a blend getting me both quack and feedback at the same time. I haven't wanted to replace the pickup because anything else would just leave a big hole in the side of the guitar where the controls go. But if I understand, I can just set the pickup for full piezo and the Tonedexter will magically make it sound like a real guitar with no more feedback worries?

I used to have a Gibson J-165 with the fishman aura pickup and that was really amazing - no feedback problems and it sounded exactly like that guitar but louder.

I've got another guitar (OM type) with no pickup at all. Does anyone have any recommendations for a pickup to put in? Are there mic style pickups that don't feedback as much as my old fishman and for that matter do all undersaddle pickups quack?

 

 

Your old Taylor with Fishman pickup with choice of full quack, feedback or the blend with quack AND feedback, that’s funny, spilt my coffee.....that would be playing really loudly, my guess........ <_<

 

If you had a Tonedexter, as you suspect it will sound great with the Taylor undersaddle pickup. They recommend undersaddle pickups or ones like K&K. It doesn’t work well with magnetic soundhole pickups. I haven’t owned the TD long enough to try all types, but the recording above is with a passive undersaddle pickup. The Gibsons with Baggs Element pickup (undersaddle with a preamp) would be great as well.

 

The Aura Spectrum DI is great too, and would fix the Taylor problem....

 

 

BluesKing777.

Edited by BluesKing777
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Of course everyone wants to sound acoustical on their acoustic, great at home but a PITA if you want to play anywhere...which most people do.

 

Like FSharp above said, on his factory supplied pickup plugged in, he got the choice of “quack (straight pickup), feedback (internal mic), or a blend of quack and feedback “ [unsure] . Thanks F# - that is the truth of it!

 

So you need something.... Aura, Tonedexter, dual source, triple source...hard to get any volume with a mic without good help....

 

Now....

 

If I was playing at the local blues club tonight, I would take my Maton SRS808 with the fabulous dual source AP5 pickup system, just like Tommy Emmanuel uses every night....turn it all to 11, plug straight to the PA and you get what you get....but you only need the Maton, a guitar lead, tuner, strap, spare strings, rag to wipe it after. [glare] [glare] [glare]

 

I won’t be playing at the local blues club tonight, I am informed it is gone, gone, gone. Probably because they put the heater on really high to get everyone thirsty [cursing] ..... but if I was, I could also take my. Martin with the inbuilt Aura..plug in and go...

 

 

But carrying all this stuff...need to be rich with a roadie [glare] :mellow:

 

 

Oh yeah, Tonedexter...I ‘trained’my old 1935 Gibson archtop which has a piezo bridge pickup...it sounds great but really loud...I sang a blues tune but guitar was way too loud...next time.

 

 

BluesKing777.

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Wonder what I have been doing? Ha Ha.... [biggrin]

 

 

Some people listened to my track at the start of this post and because my Soundcloud file has a photo of my 1935 Gibson archtop, they thought the LG3 was an archtop..black!

 

So, I fought off the spider and the dust at the back of the cupboard to drag out the archtop, had a short play, Tonedexterized it...sounds fabulous..better than acoustic really, at least louder. I recorded a couple of tracks, but I see later on playback, I OD'd the levels in to the red...Pffffft.

 

So I went and had a cup of coffee and when I cam back I grabbed the Martin D18E Retro (with the inbuilt Aura system).

 

I then recorded with a strummy fingerpick - 2 ways....

 

1. Aura (inbuilt) image #4 Neumann KM84 - direct to my A&H mixer/iMac.

 

2. P for Pickup Only in Easy Mode of Aura to Tonedexter in slot #22 - to A&H mixer/iMac

 

3. Same as 2 but with some reverb/delay.

 

 

https://soundcloud.com/bk7-3/d18eand-td77

 

 

 

 

 

And....

 

So you can compare sounds if you want, I recorded the same kind of tune with my fantastic Maton 808 with AP5-Pro pickup system direct to my mixer - this has all the eq, vol and sweepable mids - easy and ready to plug in a PA at the club! Love it and I would take this one.. [smile] [smile] [smile]

 

https://soundcloud.com/bk7-3/dee-ap57b

 

 

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

Edited by BluesKing777
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Your old Taylor with Fishman pickup with choice of full quack, feedback or the blend with quack AND feedback, that’s funny, spilt my coffee.....that would be playing really loudly, my guess........ dry.gif

 

If you had a Tonedexter, as you suspect it will sound great with the Taylor undersaddle pickup. They recommend undersaddle pickups or ones like K&K. It doesn’t work well with magnetic soundhole pickups. I haven’t owned the TD long enough to try all types, but the recording above is with a passive undersaddle pickup. The Gibsons with Baggs Element pickup (undersaddle with a preamp) would be great as well.

 

The Aura Spectrum DI is great too, and would fix the Taylor problem....

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

Thanks much for the recommendation. I think the Aura Spectrum is probably the right choice for me. Its a little cheaper than the Tonedexter, but I don't have any good quality mics to record my sound anyway. I am not sure I would get the best out of a Tonedexter. In the end, for where I will be playing, I'd be happy with anything that sounds acoustic and doesn't feedback. It doesn't have to be exactly "my" sound. There's enough choice in the Fishman image library (cedar on rosewood, OM style) that I'm sure it will be close enough.

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Thanks much for the recommendation. I think the Aura Spectrum is probably the right choice for me. Its a little cheaper than the Tonedexter, but I don't have any good quality mics to record my sound anyway. I am not sure I would get the best out of a Tonedexter. In the end, for where I will be playing, I'd be happy with anything that sounds acoustic and doesn't feedback. It doesn't have to be exactly "my" sound. There's enough choice in the Fishman image library (cedar on rosewood, OM style) that I'm sure it will be close enough.

 

 

That’s the truth of it, FZ.

 

 

It will never sound like strumming an acoustic, but ‘the sound of an acoustic guitar through a mic’.

 

 

And a nice sound!

 

 

BluesKing777.

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