sunking101 Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 I picked up a 2020 Sixties ES335 DOT last week and it's a great guitar. Just one thing though, the volume and tone knobs don't seem to be fully pushed down. They stick up proud of the surface and are nothing like as flush as the knobs on my Les Pauls. Is this normal for the reflector knobs on a 335? I can't push them down any further than they already are and they look kimda goofy, like they're only on halfway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbluesplayer Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 Got a pic? It's possible that the pots are mounted in there with the shafts sticking up too far. There's a backing nut on the shaft of the pot under the top of the guitar that is adjusted to get the right height on the pots. Maybe they're just mounted too high. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted October 25, 2020 Author Share Posted October 25, 2020 (edited) Edited October 25, 2020 by sunking101 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted October 25, 2020 Author Share Posted October 25, 2020 It's hard to show in a pic, surprisingly. The knobs sit much higher than they do on any other Gibson guitar that I own (5). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Manhost Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 (edited) I recently got a 335 Dot Satin Vintage Sunburst, and my knobs sit that high I believe Edited October 25, 2020 by Mike Manhost 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted October 26, 2020 Author Share Posted October 26, 2020 5 hours ago, Mike Manhost said: I recently got a 335 Dot Satin Vintage Sunburst, and my knobs sit that high I believe Yes I believe they do! They aren't ridiculously high but I feel they should sit a bit lower. I would be interested to know if they're all like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twang Gang Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 I would agree with Badblues, they are just mounted too high and could be adjusted, but getting into a 335 through the f-holes is a pain. If there is a good luthier that you know of, you might ask him to tackle the problem, but it is solvable, just not the easiest thing to get at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted October 27, 2020 Author Share Posted October 27, 2020 6 hours ago, Twang Gang said: I would agree with Badblues, they are just mounted too high and could be adjusted, but getting into a 335 through the f-holes is a pain. If there is a good luthier that you know of, you might ask him to tackle the problem, but it is solvable, just not the easiest thing to get at. Why would they mount them too high at the factory? I agree that getting the height changed would be a real PITA on a 335. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 They didn’t mount them “too high”, the pot is mounted to a thin piece of wood so more of the shaft is revealed. The second nut is not a standard feature on pots. This is not a QC issue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 For reference, the clearance between the underside of the skirt of the knobs and the top of my '59 Historic ES-335 is a full .25" or about 6.5mm, for each of them. The top thickness is going to determine how much shaft is exposed above the top, and how high the knobs sit. Thicker top= lower knobs for a given shaft length. There's not much in the way of threads sticking above the retaining nuts, so the knobs couldn't sit measurably lower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted November 5, 2020 Author Share Posted November 5, 2020 (edited) My 2018 335 has around 1mm clearance between the wood of the guitar and the bottom of the witch's hats knobs. Why are these optimally mounted and the 2020 335 knobs aren't? Shorter pot shafts? Deeper pockets inside the knobs? Edited November 5, 2020 by sunking101 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 Those are completely different knobs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted November 5, 2020 Author Share Posted November 5, 2020 4 hours ago, Dub-T-123 said: Those are completely different knobs... Indeed but what has that got to do with it? Are some knobs designed to fit poorly and some are designed to fit optimally? If so, why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 2 hours ago, sunking101 said: Indeed but what has that got to do with it? Are some knobs designed to fit poorly and some are designed to fit optimally? If so, why? They may only "fit poorly" to your eye. To someone else, that might be an "optimal" fit. As far as why they sit the way they do, pull a knob off each of your guitars and inspect and measure the post heights and the post socket inside of the knobs. I pulled a vintage witch hat from 1968 out of my parts box. The post socket is about 12.5mm (just over 1/2") deep measured from the bottom of the skirt. The knob itself is 15mm tall (about 19/32"), so there's about 3/32" of plastic thickness at the top of the knob. Looking at a couple of photos of the top of the guitar those witch hats are from, it looks like the witch hats sit closer to the top than the (non-reflector) knobs on my '59 Historic, so I have no answer to this one. As I said, the knobs on my '59 Historic ES 335 from 2010 fit the same way as your reflectors. It has never bothered me, either playing or esthetically. To tell the truth, I would never have noticed it if you had not brought it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted November 6, 2020 Author Share Posted November 6, 2020 7 hours ago, j45nick said: They may only "fit poorly" to your eye. To someone else, that might be an "optimal" fit. As far as why they sit the way they do, pull a knob off each of your guitars and inspect and measure the post heights and the post socket inside of the knobs. I pulled a vintage witch hat from 1968 out of my parts box. The post socket is about 12.5mm (just over 1/2") deep measured from the bottom of the skirt. The knob itself is 15mm tall (about 19/32"), so there's about 3/32" of plastic thickness at the top of the knob. Looking at a couple of photos of the top of the guitar those witch hats are from, it looks like the witch hats sit closer to the top than the (non-reflector) knobs on my '59 Historic, so I have no answer to this one. As I said, the knobs on my '59 Historic ES 335 from 2010 fit the same way as your reflectors. It has never bothered me, either playing or esthetically. To tell the truth, I would never have noticed it if you had not brought it up. Whilst in no way is it a dealbreaker (I love the guitar) I was just curious why my other 335 and LPs have control knobs as flush with the tops as you would expect and yet my new 335 has them sitting goofily high in comparison. I just assumed that whoever assembled my guitar in the Gibson factory might have installed them incorrectly. If people had weighed into this thread saying that their 335s are the same...well that's what I was hoping for to be honest. I tried to pull the witches hats off my other 335 to see it they press all the way down on the pots of my new guitar but I can't get them off for love nor money.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted November 6, 2020 Share Posted November 6, 2020 Be careful not to destroy the pots by yanking on the shafts. Witch hat knobs are usually installed with a set screw. Not sure what you’re trying to learn there really but different knobs are different.... The 335 has the same pots and knobs as an SG or similar guitar. The wood on the 335 where the pot is mounted is thinner so the pot sticks out more. BBP introduced the idea that all pots come with two nuts into this thread which is not true. He also implied that it would basically be easy to adjust the pot shaft height on the 335 using the internal nut which is not true. That would further complicate an already difficult electronics installation for virtually no benefit. The idea of Gibson ordering special sized pots and knobs just for the 335 just to address this “problem” is equally silly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted November 6, 2020 Share Posted November 6, 2020 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Dub-T-123 said: Be careful not to destroy the pots by yanking on the shafts. Witch hat knobs are usually installed with a set screw. Not sure what you’re trying to learn there really but different knobs are different.... The 335 has the same pots and knobs as an SG or similar guitar. The wood on the 335 where the pot is mounted is thinner so the pot sticks out more. BBP introduced the idea that all pots come with two nuts into this thread which is not true. He also implied that it would basically be easy to adjust the pot shaft height on the 335 using the internal nut which is not true. That would further complicate an already difficult electronics installation for virtually no benefit. The idea of Gibson ordering special sized pots and knobs just for the 335 just to address this “problem” is equally silly. I think these are the pots in my '59 Historic. Not sure if they are the same as the ones used in standard ES 335s or not. 500k ohm pots This another pot Gibson apparently uses. Note that it comes in long shaft and short shaft versions another 500k ohm pot Edited November 6, 2020 by j45nick added additional info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 Long shaft pots are for Les Pauls. As I mentioned these are the same knobs and pots you’d find on an SG or similar guitar. These are the “short shaft” pots mounted on a ~1/8” thick piece of wood. For anyone curious about adding a second nut to adjust the knob heights on their 335, give it a shot and let us know how many hours you spend doing it and why you think Gibson should incorporate that process into their production line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted November 7, 2020 Share Posted November 7, 2020 36 minutes ago, Dub-T-123 said: For anyone curious about adding a second nut to adjust the knob heights on their 335, give it a shot and let us know how many hours you spend doing it and why you think Gibson should incorporate that process into their production line Let's hope they have little tiny fingers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted November 8, 2020 Author Share Posted November 8, 2020 19 hours ago, Dub-T-123 said: Long shaft pots are for Les Pauls. As I mentioned these are the same knobs and pots you’d find on an SG or similar guitar. These are the “short shaft” pots mounted on a ~1/8” thick piece of wood. For anyone curious about adding a second nut to adjust the knob heights on their 335, give it a shot and let us know how many hours you spend doing it and why you think Gibson should incorporate that process into their production line So back to my original question, are high knobs the norm on a 335? Your comment would suggest that they are and yet I have a 335 that came direct from Gibson with knobs that are optimally flush with the top. So what is the reason for this? Shorter pot shafts? Spacers? The knobs have a deeper recess? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 I have not commented so far because, if I'm honest, I have not taken it seriously. But clearly this is bugging you. I knew the knobs of one of my guitars were mounted high, but couldn't recall which one it was. So I've just checked and its not the ES-339. Its actually the Les Paul, and the knobs are between .250"-.300" clearance. That's quite high. But for whatever its worth, I agree with j45nick here. On 11/5/2020 at 9:54 PM, j45nick said: As I said, the knobs on my '59 Historic ES 335 from 2010 fit the same way as your reflectors. It has never bothered me, either playing or esthetically. To tell the truth, I would never have noticed it if you had not brought it up. Quote So what is the reason for this? Shorter pot shafts? Spacers? The knobs have a deeper recess? Will the answer to this help you? If so, I suggest asking Gibson direct. Someone there will know. Either way, I hope you can come to terms with it. If you cant, you should either get it modified or return the guitar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 Maybe if we just ignore him he’ll get stuck here wondering about knob height Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted November 8, 2020 Author Share Posted November 8, 2020 2 hours ago, Dub-T-123 said: Maybe if we just ignore him he’ll get stuck here wondering about knob height I have just bought a very expensive guitar which has volume & tone knobs positioned much higher than on ANY of my other Gibsons and also on my other 335. I was asking the reason for this and nobody seems to know. Some are and some aren't isn't the kind of answer I was looking for. Surely there should be some kind of consistency at the factory? No it's not a dealbreaker at all but yes, the 335 with control knobs that are flush looks all the better for it. As it's such a monumental task to adjust something like this on a 335 I was merely asking if it's more of a norm to have high knobs. If mine is an anomaly then I would be slightly aggrieved. Nobody has yet managed to offer any explanation as to why the control knobs are flush with the guitar body on my 2018 335. What did the factory do differently...and why didn't they do the same on my 2020 model? I'm failing to see why this is such a crazy question not worthy of reply? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted November 8, 2020 Share Posted November 8, 2020 I’m going to try to break this down to your your level of reading comprehension so I apologize in advance that it will seem condescending. 7 minutes ago, sunking101 said: As it's such a monumental task to adjust something like this on a 335 I was merely asking if it's more of a norm to have high knobs. Yes it is normal. 9 minutes ago, sunking101 said: Nobody has yet managed to offer any explanation as to why the control knobs are flush with the guitar body on my 2018 335. They are different knobs. Different knobs are different. 10 minutes ago, sunking101 said: What did the factory do differently... They used different knobs. 12 minutes ago, sunking101 said: and why didn't they do the same on my 2020 model? It’s a different guitar. Different guitars are different. 13 minutes ago, sunking101 said: I'm failing to see why this is such a crazy question not worthy of reply? What do you call all the posts in this thread that aren’t from you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunking101 Posted November 8, 2020 Author Share Posted November 8, 2020 38 minutes ago, Dub-T-123 said: I’m going to try to break this down to your your level of reading comprehension so I apologize in advance that it will seem condescending. Yes it is normal. They are different knobs. Different knobs are different. They used different knobs. It’s a different guitar. Different guitars are different. What do you call all the posts in this thread that aren’t from you? I take from your reply that: Gibson make some knobs that fit correctly and some that don't? There is an inconsistency when fitting pots in the factory which nobody on this board is bothered about. You didn't realise that I was replying to that last specific poster who said that I should be ignored. I wasn't stating that nobody has replied, duh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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