Information on what may be a 1965 L-1

[BIRD909]

I just bought this guitar today.   A brief search leads me to believe this is a 1965 Gibson L-1  serial #359814 don’t know a lot about  guitars and am wondering if my research is correct and if anyone has any additional information they would like to provide on this guitar.  It also appears to be missing the pick guard.   Does anyone know where I might get a correct replacement?  Should I even replace it?  I’m pretty excited to have found this guitar and would really appreciate any thoughts or information.  Thanks!

[jedzep]

It is an LG1, with what looks like a replacement bridge.  That particular pick guard is replaceable, but I'd first be concerned with the playability and go from there.  If the neck angle is such that the strings aren't too high off the fret board, and you like the tone you get out of it then just enjoy it.  If the strings seem overly high take it to a shop for analysis and possible setup. 

I wouldn't worry about the so-called 'batwing' guard until I knew I liked the guitar. 

Edited June 9, 2022 by jedzep

[BIRD909]

13 minutes ago, jedzep said:

It is an LG1, with what looks like a replacement bridge.  That particular pick guard is replaceable, but I'd first be concerned with the playability and go from there.  If the neck angle is such that the strings aren't too high off the fret board, and you like the tone you get out of it then just enjoy it.  If the strings seem overly high take it to a shop for analysis and possible setup. 

I wouldn't worry about the so-called 'batwing' guard until I knew I liked the guitar. 

Is the replacement bridge a big deal?

[jedzep]

If it's as professionally installed as it looks, then it's perfectly functional.  Cost of restoration to a 'period correct' bridge (unless it's a plastic one) and pick guard would likely be half the market value of a '65 LG1, which may be in the $900-1100 range.  You can probably find similar on Reverb or Ebay to make comparisons.

[j45nick]

The serial number says 1965, and the ink stamp say LG 1. The LG 1 was an entry-level guitar with a ladder-braced top, but otherwise similar to the X-braced LG2.

The bridge looks like an original plastic bridge to me. You can tell be looking inside at the underside of the bridgeplate in the area where the bridge pins come through the top.  You should see 2, 3, or 4 hex-head fastenings, which  are lag screws that secure the plastic bridge to the top.

The missing batwing pickguard is easily replaced.

And welcome to the forum.

[BluesKing777]

Yep, looks like the original plastic bridge from here as well!

Get a Gibson knowing luthier to get it started for you and..whoosh, away you go!

(My 52 LG1's wood bridge cracked in two a few years ago and I now have a fantastic ebony bridge...way denser).

 

BluesKing777.

 

 

[jedzep]

I wondered if that was an ebony copy, Nick.  Glad you spotted the original.

I try to block those out of my consciousness.

[BIRD909]

Thanks everyone.   yes I didn’t look at it closely and it is a plastic bridge.   Where would I get a pick guard for this guitar?  A “bat wing one”.  preferably.   Is that something that Gibson cells as a replacement or are they all aftermarket by different companies?   Is it better to replace it or just leave it as is since the pick guard wouldn’t be original?  Are these pick guards really as expensive as one of the other replies indicated?
Thanks!

Edited June 10, 2022 by BIRD909

[Dave F]

This place does a nice job. You can print a pdf file and see how the shape fits your shadow.

https://www.terrapinisland.com/chitzenitza/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11&products_id=55

https://www.terrapinguitars.com/2011/pdf/J45-J50.pdf

 

Edited June 10, 2022 by Dave F

[egoidealmusic]

1 hour ago, Dave F said:

This place does a nice job. You can print a pdf file and see how the shape fits your shadow.

https://www.terrapinisland.com/chitzenitza/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11&products_id=55

https://www.terrapinguitars.com/2011/pdf/J45-J50.pdf

 

I'm not sure that J-45/50 guard will fit on that guitar.  I bought that exact one from them for an older Epi J-45 and traced it for my recently purchased LG-2 American Eagle and it was way too big.

[Dave F]

22 minutes ago, egoidealmusic said:

I'm not sure that J-45/50 guard will fit on that guitar.  I bought that exact one from them for an older Epi J-45 and traced it for my recently purchased LG-2 American Eagle and it was way too big.

They do offer to make it from your tracing. You can scale the shape to fit and then put the correct soundhole location and size and send it to them. 

[BIRD909]

What do these guards typically cost?

[j45nick]

13 hours ago, egoidealmusic said:

I'm not sure that J-45/50 guard will fit on that guitar.  I bought that exact one from them for an older Epi J-45 and traced it for my recently purchased LG-2 American Eagle and it was way too big.

Just print and cut out the image on the PDF link and see if it fits the guitar.

[dhanners623]

I guess as per my comment on your other thread by the same title, it isn’t the LG-1 I once owned because the plastic bridge on it had been replaced with one made of ebony, thank goodness.

[zombywoof]

For me what makes or break a '65 Gibson is whether it has the 1 9/16" nut or not.  This was a transition year so whether you get the narrower nut or a guitar with the 1 11/16" nut depends on when it rolled out of Kalamazoo.   If I recall correctly 1965 was also the year Gibson went with the reduced headstock angle.   Anyway, combined with the 1960s "speed" neck the skimpier nut is something you either take to or you do not.  Not a good or a bad thing just preference.

With regard to the pickguard the one that was originally on the guitar would have been one of those thick reddish looking scratchplates.  So, a new thinner pickguard would be an improvement.  As to those hollow bolt on plastic bridges I figure that was just Gibson at their pragmatic and conservative best coming up with a way of being able to deal with any warranty issues which might pop up as quickly and cheaply as possible.   Some want to have them replaced with a standard rosewood or ebony bridge as soon as possible while others are content to leave them be. But as long as it is not warped or cracked its fate can be left to later down the road.

The one thing I would check though is the bridge plate.  I believe those on the LG1 were fashioned with one of soft spruce which could get chewed up by the ball ends of the strings.  No matter what is in there though it is for the better all the way around to eventually go with a traditional maple plate. 

Edited June 10, 2022 by zombywoof

[BIRD909]

So you’re mentioning a lot of modifications.   Would a new pick guard and replacement Bridge and bridge plate take away from the value?  I’m not sure what’s more important on a guitar like this playability or originality?  Thanks 

[jedzep]

A bridge plate mod, providing it wasn't a hack job, would help it retain it's value for playing.  I would never want a plastic bridge, original or not, but you're not going to make drastic alteration of it's value either way.

[QuestionMark]

I have a 1965 LG1 in my collection that looks similar.  I bought it used in 1990.  Mine had the plastic bridge replaced on it sometime before I purchased it.  The guitar has opened up tremendously since 1990.  Now it quite loud and full sounding where when I purchased it it, it was kinda quiet and stiff playing.   Mine has quite good action although the nature of it having good action has caused some pick wear from me just past the soundhole on the top.  But, these things were meant to be played.

QM aka “Jazzman” Jeff

[zombywoof]

7 hours ago, BIRD909 said:

So you’re mentioning a lot of modifications.   Would a new pick guard and replacement Bridge and bridge plate take away from the value?  I’m not sure what’s more important on a guitar like this playability or originality?  Thanks 

In the case of these guitars, the modifications being mentioned would be things that most folks would want to have done.  It is a kind of setting things right which were  once done wrong thing.  

[BluesKing777]

On 6/10/2022 at 8:04 AM, BIRD909 said:

I just bought this guitar today.   A brief search leads me to believe this is a 1965 Gibson L-1  serial #359814 don’t know a lot about  guitars and am wondering if my research is correct and if anyone has any additional information they would like to provide on this guitar.  It also appears to be missing the pick guard.   Does anyone know where I might get a correct replacement?  Should I even replace it?  I’m pretty excited to have found this guitar and would really appreciate any thoughts or information.  Thanks!

 

 

Looking at your photos again, I think it looks great. (I have a junker 1952 LG1 - most LG1s didn’t get a case, I read).

I would take it to an (very) experienced luthier/tech with Gibson acoustic knowledge and get it checked and a nice setup. Plakky bridge looks straight (the bad ones look all bent and buckled and out of shape), finish is really nice, leave the guard off, looks great!

 

BluesKing777.

 

Edited June 11, 2022 by BluesKing777

[zombywoof]

3 hours ago, BluesKing777 said:

 

 

Looking at your photos again, I think it looks great. (I have a junker 1952 LG1 - most LG1s didn’t get a case, I read).

I would take it to an (very) experienced luthier/tech with Gibson acoustic knowledge and get it checked and a nice setup. Plakky bridge looks straight (the bad ones look all bent and buckled and out of shape), finish is really nice, leave the guard off, looks great!

 

BluesKing777.

 

 At the time, Gibson did not provide cases with any guitar.   Unless the store was willing to throw one in to seal a deal you had to purchase them.  An early-1960s LG1 ran you less than $100.  A hardshell case would add just over or under $40 depending on whether you went with the plush or flannel lining.  If you think about it, today that would be comparable to buying a J45 Standard and then having to lay out over $1K for the case to go with it.  If any case was purchased it would more than likely have been a "Durabilt" cardboard case at around $12.  This would make a hardshell case a very hard sale and I imagine Gibson did not order a whole lot of them to supply to shops.    So, it is not surprising that today an original hardshell case for a Kalamazoo-built LG series guitar is a rare find.  

Edited June 11, 2022 by zombywoof

[BluesKing777]

3 hours ago, zombywoof said:

 At the time, Gibson did not provide cases with any guitar.   Unless the store was willing to throw one in to seal a deal you had to purchase them.  An early-1960s LG1 ran you less than $100.  A hardshell case would add just over or under $40 depending on whether you went with the plush or flannel lining.  If you think about it, today that would be comparable to buying a J45 Standard and then having to lay out over $1K for the case to go with it.  If any case was purchased it would more than likely have been a "Durabilt" cardboard case at around $12.  This would make a hardshell case a very hard sale and I imagine Gibson did not order a whole lot of them to supply to shops.    So, it is not surprising that today an original hardshell case for a Kalamazoo-built LG series guitar is a rare find.  

 

In a weird sense of continuity, Gibson sold the Blues King  L-00s in yellow bags!

Happy to go along with it at the time but it was a PITA getting a hard case to fit a L-00 here........when asking at a shop  I was told that most cases they get have guitars in them. Derrrr. And importing a guitar case to fit was charged by weight/size = lots!

So it lived in a deep body local Maton case, bad fit, until recently when I acquired my 2 Waterloo WL-14s (L-00 size!) and 2 Hiscox cases to suit........then the Blues King got a nice budget Collings/Waterloo case and my old 37 L-0 scored the other Waterloo case - the L-0 came to me in a large Martin plakky case.

P.S.  Moral of the story is...........

 

BluesKing777.

 

 

Edited June 11, 2022 by BluesKing777

[zombywoof]

9 hours ago, BluesKing777 said:

 

In a weird sense of continuity, Gibson sold the Blues King  L-00s in yellow bags!

Happy to go along with it at the time but it was a PITA getting a hard case to fit a L-00 here........when asking at a shop  I was told that most cases they get have guitars in them. Derrrr. And importing a guitar case to fit was charged by weight/size = lots!

So it lived in a deep body local Maton case, bad fit, until recently when I acquired my 2 Waterloo WL-14s (L-00 size!) and 2 Hiscox cases to suit........then the Blues King got a nice budget Collings/Waterloo case and my old 37 L-0 scored the other Waterloo case - the L-0 came to me in a large Martin plakky case.

P.S.  Moral of the story is...........

 

BluesKing777.

 

 

I used to have the habit of snapping up used cases when I ran across them on the cheap.  I figured I would eventually bring home some guitar which would fit in them.  At present my '32 L1 is residing in a case which once housed a  Dobro while my '42 Harmony H165 is in a 1960s Guild case, my '56 H40 in a TKL-made Martin case, and so on.  

Edited June 11, 2022 by zombywoof

[BluesKing777]

8 hours ago, zombywoof said:

I used to have the habit of snapping up used cases when I ran across them on the cheap.  I figured I would eventually bring home some guitar which would fit in them.  At present my '32 L1 is residing in a case which once housed a  Dobro while my '42 Harmony H165 is in a 1960s Guild case, my '56 H40 in a TKL-made Martin case, and so on.  

 

I was thinking, thinking, thinking......of all the guitars over the years, I think I only got a Gibson stencilled case on 2 - a new J45 in 2010 and the 2005 Dove I got at a pawn shop, and that Gibson case looks like it was run over by the delivery truck! The rest came in various schitty cases and bags that don’t fit, latest being my 2002 J50 from same pawn shop in a ripped plakky bag with Japanese tags everywhere???

Every other guitar I have ever bought came in a (fairly) nice case! I went mad on Hiscox cases, but they are almost extinct at the moment with Covid sourcing problems. None for sale here, anywhere.

And my 1952 LG2 from Ebay came in a bag with the zip broken! That is how it was delivered to my door, no box. Wow, it made it. That lives in an ill fitting local Maton case as well - lots of those for sale 10 years ago, not so squeezy now.

Anyway, my 52 LG1 is behind rack with 5 guitars in cases on it  - second row back in a closet, and I have meaning to drag it out to see if it has all its bits......but I have to shuffle all those nice ones around.......hmmmm. 😬

News report just in......Man found this morning survived the night in his basement after a row of guitars in cases collapsed on top of him while moving some around. His dog found him early morning and directed other family members to assist. When questioned, one replied that they though he was still returning from a gig......

 

BluesKing777.

 

 

Edited June 12, 2022 by BluesKing777

[Murph]

10 hours ago, BluesKing777 said:

News report just in......Man found this morning survived the night in his basement after a row of guitars in cases collapsed on top of him while moving some around. His dog found him early morning and directed other family members to assist. When questioned, one replied that they though he was still returning from a gig......

 

 

My dogs worry about me too, but I think it's just because I feed them.