Murphy Lab Acoustic Collection

[gibsonchiq]

On 10/24/2023 at 10:06 AM, gibsonchiq said:

https://imgur.com/a/1r3XZky

 

This stuff, kind of spider webby. It runs west/east of the guitar and sometime in swirls in all 3 l-00s I ordered and I thought it was weird. But if you Google vintage guitars, they've got them as well. 

I don't care too much about relic and how good or authentic they are. Im just here for the guitar and sounds 

 

you can see the same spider webby, paint run looking thing here on a real one

[PrairieDog]

24 minutes ago, gibsonchiq said:

you can see the same spider webby, paint run looking thing here on a real one

Again, I’m not doubting that some original versions had rushed or poor finishes, that is my kinda my point. I’m just wondering why ML thinks people should pay 1,500 dollars more for the effect? Especially since they don’t seem to be tone-wise any different from the other high end torrefied replica guitars.  

It would be nice if they explained what ML is intending by “relic-ing.” To me, relic-ing a guitar implies artificially adding the natural checking, dings and scratches that happen over decades.  There are plenty of true, beautiful vintage guitars that have even, mellow, aged finishes with honest use marks.  

But they don’t all have drippy color, or uneven lacquer (not the spiderweb effect you are talking about, I’m talking about when you run your hands over the guitar the lacquer looks and feels softly bumpy all over, like an avocado, since my orange peel analogy doesn’t seem to be making my point). This was my main complaint on the one I played.  

Those sorts of issues aren’t a result of relic age, just bad factory work.  A guitar either came like that new, or is the result of a bad refinish at some point.  It just seems backwards to me to celebrate the poor finishes that came out of the factory and charge more for it.  

I do really understand you don’t care about the cosmetics, and I’m very glad the guitar sounds great to you.  That is what is most important.  

[BluesKing777]

5 hours ago, gibsonchiq said:

 

you can see the same spider webby, paint run looking thing here on a real one

 

 

That fellow could talk underwater!

How about getting a couple of good close up photos of your 2 guitars and show us exactly what you mean....?

 

BluesKing777.

 

[gibsonchiq]

1 hour ago, BluesKing777 said:

 

 

That fellow could talk underwater!

How about getting a couple of good close up photos of your 2 guitars and show us exactly what you mean....?

 

BluesKing777.

 

I did. It's in this thread further up. There's a link

[BluesKing777]

16 minutes ago, gibsonchiq said:

I did. It's in this thread further up. There's a link

Yes, I saw that one, but wasn't entirely sure what we are looking at!

Maybe stand back a bit and photo both guitars?

Here is my J50 with bad finish checking, sometimes caused by rapid change of temp ( cold car to warm house?) - previous owner did it - not Mr Perfect!☺️

Do you think your checking should be straight like this? Is that what you mean?

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

[gibsonchiq]

22 minutes ago, BluesKing777 said:

Yes, I saw that one, but wasn't entirely sure what we are looking at!

Maybe stand back a bit and photo both guitars?

Here is my J50 with bad finish checking, sometimes caused by rapid change of temp ( cold car to warm house?) - previous owner did it - not Mr Perfect!☺️

Do you think your checking should be straight like this? Is that what you mean?

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

its really light aging. any further than where i took that photo will just look like a new guitar.  the checking didnt show up unless i went up close like that

[gibsonchiq]

2 hours ago, BluesKing777 said:

Yes, I saw that one, but wasn't entirely sure what we are looking at!

Maybe stand back a bit and photo both guitars?

Here is my J50 with bad finish checking, sometimes caused by rapid change of temp ( cold car to warm house?) - previous owner did it - not Mr Perfect!☺️

Do you think your checking should be straight like this? Is that what you mean?

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

yeah, exactly, i thought checking ran north south like yours, on mine a lot of it runs east west

[BluesKing777]

As people on various forums have pointed out when ‘aged’ or ‘relic’ acoustic guitars are announced - how will we know if THAT ding or THAT gouge is supposed to be there? Was that in the plan or a booboo that can pass as ‘aged’ now?

Where an expected ‘perfect’ finish is pretty easy to show flaws.........it wasn’t all that long ago that I picked up some great acoustic guitars leaning in the dark part of the shop for unloved guitars because they had.....gasp....pick scratches and buckle marks!

What a silly world, eh? How will we know what to look for when the relic guitar is 10 years old?

(I would still get that L-00 Aged if it played/sounded good/was built correct! Save worrying over the first ding!)

 

BluesKing777.

 

 

[PrairieDog]

9 hours ago, BluesKing777 said:

Here is my J50 with bad finish checking, sometimes caused by rapid change of temp ( cold car to warm house?) - previous owner did it - not Mr Perfect!☺️

Do you think your checking should be straight like this? Is that what you mean?

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

Yours shows what real, natural checking looks like.  

What GibsonChiq has, (and her pic shows pretty well) and the one I tried is a surface scratching treatment that loops and swirls around on the back of the guitar as if someone took a box cutter to it. It makes no sense.

As I was trying to say in my first post in the thread, I’m not sure what use-wear pattern that is  trying to emulate, unless replicating a polishing cloth with a grain of sand embedded in it?  Mine also had the lumpy avocado texture of a rushed lacquer job. 

I totally agree that making fake relics is problematic for possibly clouding the future of “real” vintage vs modern, especially if unscrupulous sellers start doing things like fudging/tampering with labels and serial numbers.

An unintended consequence is that discriminating, experienced buyers “should” have enough clues to tell the difference, but casual and hobby folks, like me, could get burned.  And if enough folks get fooled, it could dampen the whole market if folks start to mistrust whether any “vintage” guitar is really just a modern copy.

 I know Gibson’s job isn’t in protecting resales, except that the massive used market helps feed their mystical image and justifies the lasting value of their product.  

Who knows? Maybe that is their plan all along: to crash the resale market and drive everyone to just buy new “old” guitars. Chuckle….wait…..

Edited November 2, 2023 by PrairieDog

[gibsonchiq]

1 hour ago, PrairieDog said:

Yours shows what real, natural checking looks like.  

What GibsonChiq has, (and her pic shows pretty well) and the one I tried is a surface scratching treatment that loops and swirls around on the back of the guitar as if someone took a box cutter to it. It makes no sense.

As I was trying to say in my first post in the thread, I’m not sure what use-wear pattern that is  trying to emulate, unless replicating a polishing cloth with a grain of sand embedded in it?  Mine also had the lumpy avocado texture of a rushed lacquer job. 

I totally agree that making fake relics is problematic for possibly clouding the future of “real” vintage vs modern, especially if unscrupulous sellers start doing things like fudging/tampering with labels and serial numbers.

An unintended consequence is that discriminating, experienced buyers “should” have enough clues to tell the difference, but casual and hobby folks, like me, could get burned.  And if enough folks get fooled, it could dampen the whole market if folks start to mistrust whether any “vintage” guitar is really just a modern copy.

 I know Gibson’s job isn’t in protecting resales, except that the massive used market helps feed their mystical image and justifies the lasting value of their product.  

Who knows? Maybe that is their plan all along: to crash the resale market and drive everyone to just buy new “old” guitars. Chuckle….wait…..

I think that's exactly why they're doing it, they want people to buy the new old guitars. 

Mine doesn't have the orange peel texture. Smooth. On mine it's not like like a box cutter texture, the "checking" doesn't penetrate the finish

Edited November 2, 2023 by gibsonchiq

[fortyearspickn]

What Gibson should do - is create 'Wraps'.  Like those plastic sheeting things you can put on your car to simulate racing stripes, shark teeth or outlandish colors on the hood ...    Just create a static, self-cling  sheet that fits over the face of the guitar (no one cares about the back or sides, really) that has dings and crazing and  simulated cigarette burns painted on.   Might affect tone, but I'm guessing those who pay extra for 'factory reliving' don't care as much about tone.  

[PrairieDog]

1 hour ago, gibsonchiq said:

I think that's exactly why they're doing it, they want people to buy the new old guitars. 

Mine doesn't have the orange peel texture. Smooth. On mine it's not like like a box cutter texture, the "checking" doesn't penetrate the finish

It’s not any kind of “checking.” Checking is a specific type of cracking of the finish that follows the woodgrain, like the pic above, and does go through the finish.  Wood and finishes, both lacquer and poly, have different expansion tolerances, with wood more responsive and elastic and the finish more stable and brittle.  So when the wood expands from rapid temp/humidity changes, the finish can’t adjust fast enough to take the strain and breaks along the wood grain, leaving the classic “checkered” pattern in the finish.  

What you and I are seeing are just scratches.  Anything sharp lightly dragged over the surface would cause it and does not have to go through the finish. Box cutters are just common shop tools.  You’d get the same swirly effect if a grain of sand was momentarily caught in a polishing cloth.  Of course, that would create sincere marks found on a legit vintage. Maybe that is really what ML is trying to replicate with the scratch treatment? A single incident of poor polishing? 

[BluesKing777]

The overall theory is simple really - sell a new guitar reissue of a old famous model and recreate the old look for people who want it NOW and don't want to bother with broken ole things....😬

Originally started by Fender repair department to match old guitar parts after repairs, then when the vintage Fender prices went to the stratosphere, famous touring musos wanted exact replicas of their famous guitar to take on the road, saving the old guitar for...??? the glass case. Then, Fender Custom Shop started offering relic model Fenders - new guitars that looked like an old model. And everyone laughed. Then Gibson Electrics....exact replicas of '59 Les Pauls! Etc....

But mostly, they offer guitars now that are the 'light aged'.

Would Gibson Acoustic be brave enough to release a replica of something like my 1937 gibson L-0? Unlikely! 😁:

 

BluesKing777.

Edited November 3, 2023 by BluesKing777

[jt]

54 minutes ago, BluesKing777 said:

Would Gibson Acoustic be brave enough to release a replica of something like my 1937 gibson L-0? Unlikely! 😁:.

Or my 1929 Nick Lucas that spent over a half-century in a shed in Tasmania sans case:

 

[Dave F]

How about a nice Relic'd '68

[BluesKing777]

Well, they WON'T want to reissue my 1972 Tele Custom!

(Why oh why did I polish it every hour on the hour all these years? And 3 times after a gig?  It would be worth more if I left it in the shed) 😁

 

 

 

 

 

 

BluesKing777.

 

 

 

 

[JuanCarlosVejar]

 

[gibsonchiq]

for what its worth. recently i was able to play an actual 1933 L-00 and the Murphy Labs reissue was the better sounding guitar, at least against the real 1933 i played.

Edited December 17, 2023 by gibsonchiq

[Larsongs]

Hey Santa! Bring me this! Please! I’ll be good! I promise!

https://www.gibson.com/en-US/Electric-Guitar/1959-Les-Paul-Standard-Reissue-Limited-Edition-Murphy-Lab-Aged-With-Brazilian-Rosewood-Exclusive-94191/Murphy-Burst?sc_src=email_1476409&sc_lid=163611965&sc_uid=vaC4yEHEul&sc_llid=38717&sc_customer=e648c4e2-b758-473b-91bf-9314979b7567&utm_source=Emarsys&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=12.19.23%3A+Serialized+Brazilian+Rosewood+Les+Pauls