Lets see if this creates as much angst as it did with my band

[ShredAstaire]

Angst for the memories. :)

[bonzoboy]

Our local Musician's Union which is a member of the AMA defines a musician as someone who either supplements or earns their whole income from playing an instrument and they couldn't care less whether you're capable of writing something as complicated as Beethoven's 9th or if you only know 3 chords.Also International Musician and Canadian Musician magazines don't require that you sight read or know musical theory to appear in their pages and be regarded as a musician and that's good enough for me.

[zigzag]

I love this stuff!

 

I just started reading this thread, so I know I'm late. I was wondering when someone would actually define the word "musician" and sure enough Chanman came thru on the second page. But the literal dictionary definition didn't really work for me, and I realized that most of us were giving our own "connotative" definitions.

 

To me, the term "musician" carries more responsibility with it than someone who merely makes music. Being a musician requires commitment and skill. The last time we had this discussion my answer was that anyone who considers himself a musician is a musician, because after all, our own realities are personal. If I call myself a musician, I may still be a bad musician. In my own case, I've been playing guitar for over 40 years and taking lessons for the last six. I do not consider myself a musician. In my own mind, I have not reached a skill level that qualifies me.

 

I can appreciate the case of the bass player who feels like an understanding of theory is essential to qualify as a musician. This is a separate discussion in itself that we have already had many times over, but it is still relevant to this discussion. A musician who has little formal training may still be a very good musician, but knowing theory can only make him better.

[martinh]

Of couse this means that no original country blues musician was actually a "musician".........

 

Your bass player fails to appreciate that the ONLY thing that matters is the end product. How it’s arrived at (e.g. by the contributions of trained players, readers, or gifted non-players) is of no interest to anyone who’s listening. I have never played a demo to someone to have them reply “I think it sounds good, but I need to know whether the players are “musicians” before I can decide if it’s actually good or not.

 

I personally am almost entirely a theory player because I’m not good at doing things by ear. This doesn’t make me better than ear players, or vice versa, it’s just a different approach that works better in some situations, and worse in others. The real problem is that the different approaches in a band such as yours sometimes make communication difficult. In my band, a typical exchange goes something like this:

 

Me – what key is this one in?

Songwriter – I don’t know

Me – Ok, what are the chords?

Songwriter – I’m not sure what some of them are called

Me. What’s the first chord?

Songwriter – this one (strums a chord on the guitar with his back to me)

Me – I can’t tell what it is just by listening to it - tell me the notes in it

Songwriter - err (excruciatingly slowly) err A, and err D and err A and C, no sorry that’s a B, and err,umm F#,

ME - Ok , it’s a D6

Bassist - Or it's a Bm7

Songwriter - well which bloody one is it?

Me- well both technically, depending on where the root is and whether you're treating it as an inversion.

Songwriter – Sod this! Now I’ll never know what to call it.

 

AND SO ON, until I tell him to turn around and show me what he’s playing so I can read it straight off the fretboard.

 

The point is that none of this process is audible in the finished product, WHICH IS ALL THAT MATTERS. The listener may say “what great musicians” but this is based on how much he/she likes what they hear, not the process by which it was produced.

[Enmitygauged]

Not sure if I understood that correctly....so...if you call someone a great musician, its redundant? Only someone who writes and plays "great" songs is a musician? That don't make no sense to me.

 

Just to clarify I meant to say they were musicians and (Classed as) Artists by their peers and the general public

[damian]

I study law...........I'm working on law 40+ hours a week these days (as a plantiff)......

 

I'm not an attorney, but, I've learned that I AM a paralegal, without a degree.......

[Enmitygauged]

Of couse this means that no original country blues musician was actually a "musician".........

 

Your bass player fails to appreciate that the ONLY thing that matters is the end product. How it's arrived at (e.g. by the contributions of trained players, readers, or gifted non-players) is of no interest to anyone who's listening. I have never played a demo to someone to have them reply "I think it sounds good, but I need to know whether the players are "musicians" before I can decide if it's actually good or not.

 

I personally am almost entirely a theory player because I'm not good at doing things by ear. This doesn't make me better than ear players, or vice versa, it's just a different approach that works better in some situations, and worse in others. The real problem is that the different approaches in a band such as yours sometimes make communication difficult. In my band, a typical exchange goes something like this:

 

Me – what key is this one in?

Songwriter – I don't know

Me – Ok, what are the chords?

Songwriter – I'm not sure what some of them are called

Me. What's the first chord?

Songwriter – this one (strums a chord on the guitar with his back to me)

Me – I can't tell what it is just by listening to it - tell me the notes in it

Songwriter - err (excruciatingly slowly) err A, and err D and err A and C, no sorry that's a B, and err,umm F#,

ME - Ok , it's a D6

Bassist - Or it's a Bm7

Songwriter - well which bloody one is it?

Me- well both technically, depending on where the root is and whether you're treating it as an inversion.

Songwriter – Sod this! Now I'll never know what to call it.

 

AND SO ON, until I tell him to turn around and show me what he's playing so I can read it straight off the fretboard.

 

The point is that none of this process is audible in the finished product, WHICH IS ALL THAT MATTERS. The listener may say "what great musicians" but this is based on how much he/she likes what they hear, not the process by which it was produced.

 

 

Damn are you in my band ???

[Enmitygauged]

.............. [lol] ......But, ....hold on...... ........

 

Huh? sorry I no comprende

[Andy R]

My standard response to " Oh! you're a guitar player?" is usually " Well that's a matter of opinion and who you compare me to" I think the same would apply here.

[Enmitygauged]

My standard response to " Oh! you're a guitar player?" is usually " Well that's a matter of opinion and who you compare me to" I think the same would apply here.

 

I concur. Im a great Rhythm guitarist even compared sometimes to John McLaughlin's style (one review but I still brag about it) but ask me to play lead and I will sweat bullets of urine.

[damian]

Huh? sorry I no comprende

 

Ah........I've played in over 50 bands, done the whole thingee.......Thus, I've played with tons of, um, ah, "music" people......

 

I don't play live anymore.....(2005 was the last live show for me)......By the time I retired, it didn't matter to me if someone

 

could read music or not.....What was most important to me was if MY investment of time and effort was worth my while....

 

So, I became known for firing 'music' people left and right, if they were prima donas, used drugs, were argumentive, and/or

 

missed shows.......When I get back playing again, I'll be the same way........So, when you said that you're the guy in the band

 

who can't read music, from what I know of you, it occured to me that MY IMPRESSION of you is that you are the member of

 

your band whom I'd consider the MOST AUTHENTIC MUSICIAN............Genetic musical ability can not be obtained............

 

It can be augmented, and usually is..................

[Enmitygauged]

A it occured to me that MY IMPRESSION of you is that you are the member of

 

your band whom I'd consider the MOST AUTHENTIC MUSICIAN............Genetic musical ability can not be obtained............

 

It can be augmented, and usually is..................

 

Thanks man. Hopefully when we settle a little legal issue with our name and a punk band from Chicago we can actually start some web pages and let you guys hear us. all the emoticons on your other post I couldnt work it out too well what you were trying to say. Im still not 100% on all that Smiley face stuff.