NighthawkChris Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 Hi All, It looks like I am in the market for a new distortion pedal... I was planning on heading up to the store and trying a few out. The reason for this is recently, I have an old pedal I have used for quite some time - a DOD Metal X FX70. It is a pretty high gain distortion pedal and it is no longer made. I really like it and I wish that they had an equivalent that I could just pick up because that's exactly what I would do. And I want a newer pedal, because if I buy another one used I will probably run into similar issues that I am about to elaborate on. Well, getting to it, the pedal is having issues switching - i.e. turning the pedal on and off with the foot switch function. It still works, but it is unreliable to switch to clean/distortion without having to press the switch multiple times with my foot, and during a song at practice/show. I can never count on it anymore I feel. I play some hard rock/metal and like to do a fair amount of "shredding" when I play leads. Basically, think Marty Friedman years of Megadeth, or Alex Skolnick in Testament, Scorpions... I don't get into death metal, chugging stuff, metal core, etc. I like to add a little bit of reverb and get some nice "classical" metal sounds that have well articulated, sustained, singing lead sounds - which my Metal X pedal could do perfectly for me. I used to play along with all the Metallica songs from Kill 'em All to Justice when I was a kid and had this pedal, so again, I want something that will convince me I am playing with the same type of distortion and perhaps plus some. I suppose I might say a high treble-like distortion with some punchy mid and a slight amount of bass just to round out the sound so it doesn't cut up people's eardrums - and mine - when I play leads. And generally, my leads are played with the pickup in the bridge position - sometimes the neck pickup I use, but mostly the bridge to get volume and hotness I need to stand out from the rhythm in a song when playing in the band. Basically, I had my eyes on the Boss DS-1X, but it runs around $150. I heard demos of it and it doesn't look all that bad... But I need to see for myself. I generally like Boss pedals I guess since I have never had a bad experience with them ever in my lifetime as I have a couple effects by them and their analog (needle) chromatic tuner I currently use (CS? Compressor and RV6 reverb pedal); I feel Boss makes well constructed pedals overall. ALTHOUGH... I am open to other options if there are other suggestions I should explore. So I wish that my trusty pedal didn't do this . I have never explored the pedal route that much because I had THE pedal I never wanted to part with. I also wasn't much of a pedal guy for this because I had a time where I primarily got my distortion through a Peavey 5150 II EVH signature stack which has a killer distortion (lead) channel. But these days, I have a Peavey Classic 30 that I run my Metal X into as it is MUCH easier to transport and practice with. I am not a fan of the built-in distortion in this amp... So I guess I am exploring this distortion pedal world like a noob. Again, suggestions are much appreciated and I will try out as many pedals as I can to find the best option for me and my s###. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidblast Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 My offerings may seem pricey I have a Blackstar Dual HT that is a really good overdrive pedal. I front end my Gibson GA30RVS with that. Kinda roars.. Also have a Radial Tonebone Classic, and a Barber Burn Unit (2 stage) on my main pedal board. The Blackstar and the Radial both have 12AX7 tubes. They are all in the +$200 range. These have been very reliable and versatile. I've had the Barber and the Radial for well over 15 years. They just work. The only thing I don't like about the Blackstar is you can't use a standard 9v adapter, comes with it's own. It sounds good though and has two separate channels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NighthawkChris Posted February 28, 2019 Author Share Posted February 28, 2019 Thanks kid, Very interested to take a look at the Blackstar you mentioned... There is one I can see near me in a CL ad... Going for $150. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 There is such a HUGE choice now. I am in UK and just checked Andertons - they list over 400 different od/distortion pedals, going up to well over £300. But what do you want? Your basic 3-knob 1-switch pedal? Big Muff-type or clone? The above with a Keeley-type channel mod? Or with an extra boost switch? Got more to spend, go a bit more ambitious.....2 channels? Extra eq section? I have a couple of 2-channel pedals, the Xotic AC+ and the Analog Man KOT. Neither of these 2 is really suitable for metal IMO. But (much more like it) I also have a modded Rat which is the absolute business and a modded Boss DS-1. The mod on each gives me a choice of 3 different tones. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 The DOD footswitches always do that. That is their main weakness If you’re otherwise happy with the DOD, you could change the switch and your pedal will work good as new Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
american cheez Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 The DOD footswitches always do that. That is their main weakness If you’re otherwise happy with the DOD, you could change the switch and your pedal will work good as new this was going to be my advice too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NighthawkChris Posted February 28, 2019 Author Share Posted February 28, 2019 Thanks everyone, I appreciate the feedback. I have found on Reverb a sellers listing that features 4 of those momentary contact switches that I could tear out of the pedal and replace. Not afraid to do this at all - I am very proficient at soldering electronics. What I noticed though was that the momentary contact switch feeds a dual CMOS IC - an old CD4007 I believe, and it does work. I may have to stomp it a few times once in a while to switch the distortion on/off though... And I have to make sure that the plastic part of the pedal that I stomp which has a small plastic protrusion underneath it that actually presses the switch is lined up to do so. I mean, the switch could have just lost its "sensitivity" I suppose as it has probably been pressed like a trillion times since the early 90s... It would be worth a try to swap out the switch, and if it works, I'd be happier than a pig in you know what... I still want to go check out some distortion pedals though, haha! I need an excuse to go to the guitar store near me, the best kind of store - but not the "big box" store, the worst kind of store Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparquelito Posted February 28, 2019 Share Posted February 28, 2019 MXR Super Badass. It's a great and versatile distortion pedal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 Thanks everyone, I appreciate the feedback. I have found on Reverb a sellers listing that features 4 of those momentary contact switches that I could tear out of the pedal and replace. Not afraid to do this at all - I am very proficient at soldering electronics. What I noticed though was that the momentary contact switch feeds a dual CMOS IC - an old CD4007 I believe, and it does work. I may have to stomp it a few times once in a while to switch the distortion on/off though... And I have to make sure that the plastic part of the pedal that I stomp which has a small plastic protrusion underneath it that actually presses the switch is lined up to do so. I mean, the switch could have just lost its "sensitivity" I suppose as it has probably been pressed like a trillion times since the early 90s... It would be worth a try to swap out the switch, and if it works, I'd be happier than a pig in you know what... I still want to go check out some distortion pedals though, haha! I need an excuse to go to the guitar store near me, the best kind of store - but not the "big box" store, the worst kind of store Usually it’s just the tact switch. If the plastic nub has broken off of the bottom of the footpad, you can replace it with a stick on rubber bumper or something similar What I would probably do is just drill through the footpad and install a 3PDT, omitting the flip flop entirely for “hard wired true bypass”. I prefer the 3PDT because as a mechanical latching switch, you’re never worried about needing to click it multiple times A quick google search didn’t give me the schematic for this one. I don’t think anyone has cared to trace it. Looking at the controls I would guess that it’s based on the Boss HM-2 (a pedal that I absolutely LOVE) but can’t say for sure. Maybe I can find a schem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NighthawkChris Posted March 1, 2019 Author Share Posted March 1, 2019 Here's the PCB Here's the faulty switch Never mind the burnt flux haha! I do not have anything at home to clean off the flux, but I will do this when I get to work where I have something to do the job. I only have that Radio Shack desoldering tool - the blue tube with the spring-loaded mechanism. Unfortunately, I don't have a nice Pace desoldering station like I have at work... Anyhow, it is a flimsy little PCB to hold the switch and secure it with a screw to the pedal enclosure. It will be just fine. Getting to the problem here, what these switches apparently have happen over time is that the plastic top of the switch that is supposed to actuate by the footpad doesn't get pressed down all the way - and I mean 100% all the way. I verified with a multi-meter that when this is not pressed COMPLETELY into the switch enclosure, the resistance remains open circuited. Only when I pressed the switch entirely inside would I read 0 Ohms. No wonder I had to stomp the F out of this thing to get it to switch between clean and distorted... So this is why I will need to do as suggested: Get a new tactile switch (momentary contact as I called it) which I like the best right now Add in my own momentary contact switch - which I have in my handy box of electronics components (not a fan of this as I have to drill and the pedal will look like s###) Bypass the dual CMOS CD4007 and implement a mechanical switching mechanism As I mentioned, I'm really a fan of just paying out $10 + shipping to the Reverb seller because I just have to simply solder back in the switch and reinstall. It may fail again in the future, but this pedal has lasted me for a little more than 2 decades until the last few weeks when this was becoming pretty much unable to enable/bypass the distortion via footpad. I have already removed the faulty part as we all can see now which I can clearly understand why this switch is the culprit. I could do the mechanical bypass of the CMOS complimentary pair IC (the MC14007UBCP labeled IC in the image), but I am not too interested in hacking up the PCB that much as I do not have a concrete plan how to do this anyhow. I agree it is more robust though... But overall, I agree that this is a weakness of the DOD pedals from back in the day these were on the shelf. Cheap plastic switches... They may last a decent amount of time I guess, but they are bound to fail. They are like a ticking time-bomb. But the effect is real good though for my playing... I guess it is what I have to contend with. But hey, if I get 4 switches and they are as good as what these come with stock, the I have over 80 years of replacement parts! I'll be dead before then, haha! Thanks all for the suggestions. It looks like I'm ordering parts here very soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 $10 + shipping? The tact switch should cost around $0.50 Look at all the 0 ohm resistors they used as jumpers on the board. I kinda like the construction of these things, just hate the switch. If it is indeed a copy of the Boss HM-2 (which it really looks to be) then I’m sure it sounds badass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NighthawkChris Posted March 1, 2019 Author Share Posted March 1, 2019 $10 + shipping? The tact switch should cost around $0.50 Look at all the 0 ohm resistors they used as jumpers on the board. I kinda like the construction of these things, just hate the switch. If it is indeed a copy of the Boss HM-2 (which it really looks to be) then I'm sure it sounds badass I actually looked up the part. It is an Omron tactile switch PN: B3F-4000. I want to upgrade to the B3F-5001 which is the higher quality switch. I can order one for around a couple bucks from Digikey instead of buying a bunch of lower quality switches for over $10. Digikey link: https://www.digikey....SW968-ND/368376 Datasheet: https://omronfs.omro.../pdf/en-b3f.pdf FYI dimensions I measured and looked up that match are 12mm x 12mm x 3.5mm which are pretty spot on. Overall, I am going to order this from an electronics supplier - maybe a couple more if this thing needs repair in the future. I think the problem though with the design is that you have the footpad that has this slim protrusion that is not exactly centered when it actuates the switch and consequently presses the switch at an angle. It may initially work for a while, but over time, it wears down perhaps prematurely. If you look closely at the image of the switch, the plunger has a distinct mark where the footpad protrusion contacts the plunger and where it has for years. Perhaps I can concoct something to improve this so the contact of the protrusion can be more uniformly distributed... I'll see about that. Oh, and yes, this pedal kicks a##! It's worth the time to fix it. Thanks for all the feedback, it is appreciated - from everyone! EDIT: I ended up ordering from Arrow Electronics. They offered free FedEx overnight shipping and part cost less than $2 each... I ordered 4 of them, haha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NighthawkChris Posted March 1, 2019 Author Share Posted March 1, 2019 Just to note, I tried out that Boss Distortion DS-1X, and I liked it so much I decided to buy one. It is definitely a high gain pedal that I can get used to for my crap. Anyhow, if anyone likes this kind of stuff, try one out at a store near you. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zigzag Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 MXR Super Badass. It's a great and versatile distortion pedal. I actually just ordered one of these based on your recommendation and reviews I read on the net. The only distortion I had was a Big Muff Pi and what exists on my main amp (MESA Express 5:50). Looking forward to checking it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted March 1, 2019 Share Posted March 1, 2019 I actually looked up the part. It is an Omron tactile switch PN: B3F-4000. I want to upgrade to the B3F-5001 which is the higher quality switch. I can order one for around a couple bucks from Digikey instead of buying a bunch of lower quality switches for over $10. Digikey link: https://www.digikey....SW968-ND/368376 Datasheet: https://omronfs.omro.../pdf/en-b3f.pdf FYI dimensions I measured and looked up that match are 12mm x 12mm x 3.5mm which are pretty spot on. Overall, I am going to order this from an electronics supplier - maybe a couple more if this thing needs repair in the future. I think the problem though with the design is that you have the footpad that has this slim protrusion that is not exactly centered when it actuates the switch and consequently presses the switch at an angle. It may initially work for a while, but over time, it wears down perhaps prematurely. If you look closely at the image of the switch, the plunger has a distinct mark where the footpad protrusion contacts the plunger and where it has for years. Perhaps I can concoct something to improve this so the contact of the protrusion can be more uniformly distributed... I'll see about that. Oh, and yes, this pedal kicks a##! It's worth the time to fix it. Thanks for all the feedback, it is appreciated - from everyone! EDIT: I ended up ordering from Arrow Electronics. They offered free FedEx overnight shipping and part cost less than $2 each... I ordered 4 of them, haha! Are you into Entombed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparquelito Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 I actually just ordered one of these based on your recommendation and reviews I read on the net. The only distortion I had was a Big Muff Pi and what exists on my main amp (MESA Express 5:50). Looking forward to checking it out. I'm very excited for you, zigzag. I loved my Super Badass, and only let it go because: a. I since acquired a distortion pedal and a boost pedal, both crafted for me by two local mad scientists, and b. My bass-playing friend David coveted the Super Badass dearly, so I gave it to him. It's a rock-solid pedal, and ultra-versatile. I cannot believe the wide varieties of tones you can get out of it. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NighthawkChris Posted March 2, 2019 Author Share Posted March 2, 2019 Are you into Entombed? Not really... I don't know anything about them. I get into metal and hard rock with great lead guitarists. For example, really like Megadeth. I like Pantera a lot too which is probably as heavy as I like to get. Don't care for any Metallica that much anymore, but I listened to them a lot when I was a kid. I practically learned to play leads with my Metallica CDs and music books. And I REALLY love early Testament. Always had an ear for Alex Skolnick. Overall, I'm not a huge fan boy though. I listen to these bands if I want to get pumped up, but generally, I listen to a lot of different music. I don't know... I'm weird, haha! I learned music when I was 9 by learning piano since my mother played piano. I at some point in time wanted to learn how to play the guitar when I was 14, and I had a pretty good base of knowledge to start. I'm by far not the greatest pianist/guitarist, but I'm not too shabby. I play my guitars every night and my piano every morning before I go to work. I jump all around from Chopin to some popular music on the piano (popular music that I am directed sort of by virtue of the bands I play in). On guitar, I play some metal on my own, practice shredding stuff, and of course, I play the covers my band likes to play - and of course that I like to play too. I was interested in fixing my Metal X pedal because mostly, I am a dad/husband that does a vast amount of work with embedded software these days as my day job. I am an electrical engineer per my degree, but when you work for a big corporation, you tend to get into a specialization mode. So I have been doing a lot of embedded software these past few years. And being that I live in the metro Detroit area, I work in the automotive sector. So as I said, I'm sort of a weird fella... I got my hands full and it seems like I am just this wandering free spirit in terms of interests and such. And if it weren't for my band, I'd probably never leave the house these days. My wife and I both work all day, come home, sit with the kids, then I get my time at night when I'm dead tired and the kids are asleep Hey, it's a wonderful life man and it's just another chapter I'm experiencing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NighthawkChris Posted March 2, 2019 Author Share Posted March 2, 2019 I'm very excited for you, zigzag. I loved my Super Badass, and only let it go because: a. I since acquired a distortion pedal and a boost pedal, both crafted for me by two local mad scientists, and b. My bass-playing friend David coveted the Super Badass dearly, so I gave it to him. It's a rock-solid pedal, and ultra-versatile. I cannot believe the wide varieties of tones you can get out of it. :) I'll have to check it out sometime. I was really in the mode to get something comparable to my Metal X pedal first and foremost. I felt naked without it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 I have an 80's MXR Overdrive with the original Malaysian RC4558 Chip. It was the predecessor of the original Tube Screamers by Ibanez... Probably the best sounding Overdrive I've ever heard. It quit on me several years ago & got stuffed into a box in my Store room of Stuff.. I've had several Distortion & Overdrives since & none sound as good. Including my newest TS-808 Tube Screamer which is supposed authentic Spec... So I decided to take the old MXR to my Amp Tech & see if he can fix it. A Potentiometer is the problem. But, you can't buy that specific type anymore he says. He can put another type in but it will require different knobs so it will look odd. Which doesn't bother me so much. My concern is, will it affect the Sound in any way? Being it's not an original Part. I've been watching Reverb.com & other sites for them but they're scarce.. If all else fails, I'm curious if that Malaysian Chip will work with & improve the Sound in my current Tube Screamer? Bottom line to the OP, The new Stuff in many cases isn't as good as the old stuff. If you really like it's sound, You might try to get it repaired & buy another Used one for back up & or Parts. L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 I have an 80's MXR Overdrive with the original Malaysian RC4558 Chip. It was the predecessor of the original Tube Screamers by Ibanez... Probably the best sounding Overdrive I've ever heard. It quit on me several years ago & got stuffed into a box in my Store room of Stuff.. I've had several Distortion & Overdrives since & none sound as good. Including my newest TS-808 Tube Screamer which is supposed authentic Spec... So I decided to take the old MXR to my Amp Tech & see if he can fix it. A Potentiometer is the problem. But, you can't buy that specific type anymore he says. He can put another type in but it will require different knobs so it will look odd. Which doesn't bother me so much. My concern is, will it affect the Sound in any way? Being it's not an original Part. I've been watching Reverb.com & other sites for them but they're scarce.. If all else fails, I'm curious if that Malaysian Chip will work with & improve the Sound in my current Tube Screamer? Bottom line to the OP, The new Stuff in many cases isn't as good as the old stuff. If you really like it's sound, You might try to get it repaired & buy another Used one for back up & or Parts. L What is the specific name of the MXR pedal you’re talking about? You can probably still get the same replacement pot, old MXR pedals used CTS pots. A different pot wouldn’t really change the sound. I’m a vintage pedal fixer guy if you need any help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 What is the specific name of the MXR pedal you’re talking about? You can probably still get the same replacement pot, old MXR pedals used CTS pots. A different pot wouldn’t really change the sound. I’m a vintage pedal fixer guy if you need any help If you have a Source for the Pots I'd appreciate a Link.. Thanks This is the Pedal.... & some info.. MXR M-164 Overdrive (here's a Link) http://effectsfreak.com/effect/mxr/m-164_commande_series_overdrive/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 That pedal was apparently from 1981 where the TS808 was 1979 so the Tube Screamer came first. The Tube Screamer was the first to use diodes in the feedback loop of an op amp for clipping. Most overdrives copied the Tube Screamer after that. Before the Tube Screamer it was common to use diodes shunted to ground at the output for clipping like the Distortion + Anyway if you could post photos of the pots I could probably help, I actually thought you meant an earlier MXR pedal so I’m not sure which pots are in that series Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted March 3, 2019 Share Posted March 3, 2019 Just to note, I tried out that Boss Distortion DS-1X, and I liked it so much I decided to buy one. It is definitely a high gain pedal that I can get used to for my crap. Anyhow, if anyone likes this kind of stuff, try one out at a store near you. Thanks! "All-new design provides a superior playing experience that’s unattainable with analog distortion pedals.....Features BOSS’ innovative Multi-Dimensional Processing (MDP), realized with proprietary technology and custom DSP".... I actually just ordered one of these (MXR Super Badass) based on your recommendation and reviews I read on the net. The only distortion I had was a Big Muff Pi and what exists on my main amp (MESA Express 5:50). Looking forward to checking it out. "Complete analog bliss....crunchy, thick, full-on distortion tones.....early '70s low gain overdrive to modern "scooped" metal distortion and every shade of dirt in between." Well now this is interesting! Want to know what you guys think...when you get 'em...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NighthawkChris Posted March 4, 2019 Author Share Posted March 4, 2019 jdgm, regarding the DS-1X... Get one, haha! It's a great pedal with plenty of high gain. What's amazing is that you can play an E major chord like we all know and love, and it's like it is still incredibly clear as if you played it with no distortion, but yet the distortion is all there in it's entirety... hard to describe sounds, but I just want to keep it on my pedal board. I am impressed and plan on having it right next to my Metal X pedal once I replace the tactile switch tomorrow. EDIT: Another thing that I looked into was a noise suppressor pedal. The same shop I go to locally - that I picked up the awesome DS-1X from - had a used Boss NS-2 pedal which I tried out and actually am going to find useful. New, these go for around $99, but this used one was for $60 and didn't look all beat up. Yeah, I don't get the original box, but really, how often are you going to go back to that stuff... I use my pedals and don't intend on getting rid of them. So all in all I now have a handful of Boss pedals: DS-1X CS-3 NS-2 RV-6 ...to boot with my DOD Metal X (which should be repaired later this evening) and an Ibanez DE7 (Delay/Echo). Oh, and my Dunlop Crybaby I hardly use that I bought back some time in 1994... It works great still. I opened up the sealed pot that does the wah-wah and "contact cleanered" the crap out of it as it was getting VERY scratchy when it was being rockered. But that went away Sounds like new now and switches great. Just a simple wah-wah, but damn is it a tank. I figure what is the use of getting rid of these pedals when I can only get a few bucks for them anyhow - and I might want to whip them out one day... Or my boys will want to mess with them if and when they want to play guitar... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 That pedal was apparently from 1981 where the TS808 was 1979 so the Tube Screamer came first. The Tube Screamer was the first to use diodes in the feedback loop of an op amp for clipping. Most overdrives copied the Tube Screamer after that. Before the Tube Screamer it was common to use diodes shunted to ground at the output for clipping like the Distortion + Anyway if you could post photos of the pots I could probably help, I actually thought you meant an earlier MXR pedal so I’m not sure which pots are in that series I guess it wasn't that Tube Screamers weren't first it was that the Malaysian RC4558P Chip, that was used in the MXR Pedal, wasn't used til later in the Tube Screamers. Still trying to find out what Pots... Thanks, L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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