Pinch Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 15 hours ago, Sgt. Pepper said: Wait 5 years and insert name of new CEO. Are you sure? It seems like they have people who actually know things about guitars running the show now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Pinch said: Are you sure? It seems like they have people who actually know things about guitars running the show now. For your guys sake I hope so. They still need to get better QA. Cause the guys that buy them come here weekly to vent about it. I’m sure I can go look an there are probably 5 or 6 threads up right now if bad QA. Martin too on theirs. Gibson is not alone. Martin is probably no different, but has there ever been a news story or scandal out of that camp? None I can recall. Plus some one with the last name of Martin has been in charge there since day one. Now does that mean anything, probably not. Edited July 15, 2023 by Sgt. Pepper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 8 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said: For your guys sake I hope so. They still need to get better QA. Cause the guys that buy them come here weekly to vent about it. I’m sure I can go look an there are probably 5 or 6 threads up right now if bad QA. Martin too on theirs. Gibson is not alone. Martin is probably no different, but has there ever been a news story or scandal out of that camp? None I can recall. Plus some one with the last name of Martin has been in charge there since day one. Now does that mean anything, probably not. Yeah, QC needs to improve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 Repeating 'QC needs to improve' because people come here expressly to complain about things 98% of those who buy Gibsons don't notice - is like calling for World Peace or bigger watermelons. Those who DON'T have problems DON'T sign up to the forum and come here to NOT complain. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 1 hour ago, Pinch said: Are you sure? It seems like they have people who actually know things about guitars running the show now. Quite possibly because they can't get anyone else, which is definitely a bad thing. rct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 2 hours ago, fortyearspickn said: Repeating 'QC needs to improve' because people come here expressly to complain about things 98% of those who buy Gibsons don't notice - is like calling for World Peace or bigger watermelons. Those who DON'T have problems DON'T sign up to the forum and come here to NOT complain. But what about the ones that do and have legit issues, and I see over and over this phrase - “I’d keep it”. Chances are you wouldn’t cause your not the one with a faulty guitar. Chances are you wouldn’t except a $25 steak cooked rare if you ordered it well done at a restaurant, but a $2500 guitar you’d keep? Laughable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 20 hours ago, Sgt. Pepper said: But what about the ones that do and have legit issues, and I see over and over this phrase - “I’d keep it”. Chances are you wouldn’t cause your not the one with a faulty guitar. Chances are you wouldn’t except a $25 steak cooked rare if you ordered it well done at a restaurant, but a $2500 guitar you’d keep? Laughable. You are 100% correct on the steak thing. Rare vs Well Done is a big difference though. I was talking more about minor cosmetic differences on a guitar that is not stamped out in a cookie cutter manufacturing process. My frame of reference was the current thread on the Acoustic forum where someone purchased a guitar where "the back strip appears to be mis-aligned 1/8th inch where it meets the heel". New poster asking for opinions on whether it would bother us. You noted there that it is only HIS opinion that matters in the final analysis. Of course, I agree with that 100% too. But, without a decent picture, since he said he otherwise loves the J45, he got some quick and dirty opinions. One member confessed he has to keep a window shade down so he doesn't have to look at a neighbors mis-aligned downspout. So - I guess we all have different tolerances. But, I agree - they would go up quickly if it were $2,500 of our own money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, fortyearspickn said: You are 100% correct on the steak thing. Rare vs Well Done is a big difference though. I was talking more about minor cosmetic differences on a guitar that is not stamped out in a cookie cutter manufacturing process. My frame of reference was the current thread on the Acoustic forum where someone purchased a guitar where "the back strip appears to be mis-aligned 1/8th inch where it meets the heel". New poster asking for opinions on whether it would bother us. You noted there that it is only HIS opinion that matters in the final analysis. Of course, I agree with that 100% too. But, without a decent picture, since he said he otherwise loves the J45, he got some quick and dirty opinions. One member confessed he has to keep a window shade down so he doesn't have to look at a neighbors mis-aligned downspout. So - I guess we all have different tolerances. But, I agree - they would go up quickly if it were $2,500 of our own money. So Gibson uses no CNC machines? From start to finish 100% hand made? Edited July 16, 2023 by Sgt. Pepper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 9 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said: So Gibson uses no CNC machines? From start to finish 100% hand made? Didn't say that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 1 hour ago, fortyearspickn said: Didn't say that. You said no cookie cutter for Gibson. That’s exactly what a CNC machine does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 A look at any guitar manufacturing video, be it Gibson, Fender, Fujigen, World Musical Instrument etc) will show pretty much the same thing. CNC makes the bodies/necks. The assembly, finishing and set ups are very much hands on. There is no point in making everything by hand. It takes longer and its less precise. Its also expensive. I have two guitars that are entirely handmade. One acoustic & one electric. So what? As working instruments they are no different. CNC production makes good sense (I used to program and operate them in the aerospace industry). They are merely a sensible production aid. You gain nothing by using regressive methods of production. Bankruptcy maybe. People skills are still essential to guitar production right now. They could be fully automated with robots. Only then would they be cookie cutter (hands off production). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 4 hours ago, merciful-evans said: A look at any guitar manufacturing video, be it Gibson, Fender, Fujigen, World Musical Instrument etc) will show pretty much the same thing. CNC makes the bodies/necks. The assembly, finishing and set ups are very much hands on. There is no point in making everything by hand. It takes longer and its less precise. Its also expensive. I have two guitars that are entirely handmade. One acoustic & one electric. So what? As working instruments they are no different. CNC production makes good sense (I used to program and operate them in the aerospace industry). They are merely a sensible production aid. You gain nothing by using regressive methods of production. Bankruptcy maybe. People skills are still essential to guitar production right now. They could be fully automated with robots. Only then would they be cookie cutter (hands off production). Yep - exactly. I’m damn sure Martin does to. They should promote me to CEO, cause I would make all the guitars you guys talk about here. You want J-45’s. I’d have Bozeman make J-45’s more J-45er than all the previous J-45’s. Maybe a HB, Dove and SJ-200 too. But mostly just J-45’s. And no neon green ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 On 7/17/2023 at 1:47 AM, Sgt. Pepper said: Yep - exactly. I’m damn sure Martin does to. They should promote me to CEO, cause I would make all the guitars you guys talk about here. You want J-45’s. I’d have Bozeman make J-45’s more J-45er than all the previous J-45’s. Maybe a HB, Dove and SJ-200 too. But mostly just J-45’s. And no neon green ones. I was gonna say the same thing about Gibson 😄 Rabs will get his Slash with a 60s neck. QC will improve. The 84 Explorer will be available in white (I suspect they're working on a white Hetfield signature model), at a reasonable price. Complimentary breadsticks for everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 1 hour ago, Pinch said: I was gonna say the same thing about Gibson 😄 Rabs will get his Slash with a 60s neck. QC will improve. The 84 Explorer will be available in white (I suspect they're working on a white Hetfield signature model), at a reasonable price. Complimentary breadsticks for everyone. Steve Ford would get his Firebird V or VII. Can't remember which one he wants. For Murph, I would stop making SG's with P-90's, You would get your white '84 Explorer. Slash would get no more signature models, but Bill Nelson would get a sig ES-345. Just watched some Be-Bop Deluxe the other day on the Old Grey Whistle Test. And for everyone else post suggestions here. 1. 2. 3 4. 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 And we'd get an extra hat for Steve's tortoise! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Pinch said: And we'd get an extra hat for Steve's tortoise! He has a massive hat collection. He might have more than one tortoise. He has a few snakes, and some crazy lizards. I wonder if Steve has a hat like Zappa is wearing on Hot Rats? Edited July 18, 2023 by Sgt. Pepper 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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