Do The Beatles still hold up to modern music?

[Karloff]

On 10/8/2023 at 6:30 PM, rct said:

Of course you say that, neither of us will be here.

We had our time.  It was great.  Let them have theirs.

rct

as long as they stay off my lawn they can listen to whatever crap they want.

SLOW DOWN !!!

[Murph]

59 minutes ago, DanvillRob said:

I'd like to see the movie..... where can I get it?

It was on YouTube if I recall.

[DanvillRob]

1 hour ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

Netflix

And Carol was guitar player most of her life,  and then one day the bass player didn't show up for a session and the rest as they say . . . 

Hey Pepper play a D#dim7min13 chord in that last chorus. Sure just show me where to put my fingers.

Yes, I saw her play guitar on the documentary....she KNOWS her way around a guitar!

[Sgt. Pepper]

3 hours ago, Murph said:

I loved "Let It Be". The desire of them wanting to do a "live" sounding project, WITHOUT the multiple overdubs and tape splicing was brilliant to me. I actually prefer the "Naked" version that Paul remixed to the original release with Spector's influence.

However, I think the thread got a little de-railed.

Perhaps it's just me but I thought it was about the MUSIC holding up to musical standards, not so much PERSONAL preference.

While I'm sure Taylor Swift will have old fans 60 years from now who still like her music, the Beatles work is considered great by scholars, musicians, sound engineers and writers for many of the reasons you stated earlier. Leaving the tonic to go off on a tangent of different progressions, stories and timing, coming back/or not. 

It was so fresh and unheard of in pop music at the time. Your insights and incites are quite good.

Here is the thing. Lets say you think Molly Tuttle or Billy Stings music is going to hold up in 50 years and people will be taking about them, then that is your personal preference right? The Beatles, Zappa and Yes are mine. 

The pure fact we are discussing The Beatles 60 years after they got together right here on this platform is proof that in another 50 people probably will. 

The Giles Martin Remix not Remaster of Let It Be is killer. The worst part of LIB was Phil (Nut Job) Spector putting those Saccharine Strings on The Long And Winding Road (which isn't a fav of mine anyway). I think Giles left the strings in and Paul removed them on Naked. 

The Long And Winding Road and Carry That Weight was a foreshadow of what Paul's post Beatle career would eventually become.

Edited October 10, 2023 by Sgt. Pepper

[DanvillRob]

47 minutes ago, Murph said:

It was on YouTube if I recall.

I'm going to look for it.    Thanks

[Sgt. Pepper]

4 minutes ago, DanvillRob said:

I'm going to look for it.    Thanks

https://www.justwatch.com/us/movie/the-wrecking-crew-2008

[DanvillRob]

Just now, Sgt. Pepper said:

https://www.justwatch.com/us/movie/the-wrecking-crew-2008

Thanks.

[MissouriPicker]

The influence of The Beatles cannot be denied.  I like a lot of their songs.  Especially the folksy ones.  There were/are lots of great bands (Beatles, Stones, Beach Boys, Ventures (among my rock & roll favorites) and countless 1-2 hit wonders that no one could match on their particular hits..  It depends on what each of us like.   Along with all the great bands you’ve got folks like Dylan, Cash, Prine, Clark, Cohen, who were literally their own genres.  If it tells a human story, I’ll likely enjoy it.

[DanvillRob]

19 hours ago, MissouriPicker said:

The influence of The Beatles cannot be denied.  I like a lot of their songs.  Especially the folksy ones.  There were/are lots of great bands (Beatles, Stones, Beach Boys, Ventures (among my rock & roll favorites) and countless 1-2 hit wonders that no one could match on their particular hits..  It depends on what each of us like.   Along with all the great bands you’ve got folks like Dylan, Cash, Prine, Clark, Cohen, who were literally their own genres.  If it tells a human story, I’ll likely enjoy it.

MP, I tend to like good music.    I can (usually) leave the politics behind and enjoy the music for music's sake.

You didn't name one band/artist that I don't enjoy some of their music....and not one who has produced some music I don't care for.

The "song" is all important....I feel the true 'musicians' are those who write great songs, (like our own Murph).   Guys like me are just hacks, (but I ain't complainin').

[Sgt. Pepper]

52 minutes ago, DanvillRob said:

 I tend to like good music.   

Ah, but who is the determining  factor for what is GOOD? 

What I think is good other think may think its c-rap, and vice versa. 

Its the old Jimi Hendrix is still, and always will always be considered  the BEST guitarist ever, and will be until the Earth stops rotating. Jimi was great and influential, and ahead of his time, but the best? 

Go to 4 mins 30 secs and Jimi will tell you who is the best. I think once when asked what its like to be the best guitarist, Jimi said go ask Rory Gallagher. 

https://www.google.com/search?q=jimi+hendrix+on+****+cavcet&rlz=1C1CHBD_enUS988US988&oq=jimi+hendrix+on+****+cavcet&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOdIBCjExNTYwajBqMTWoAgCwAgA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:4f993ef0,vid:VGf9PTYyJ4A,st:0

 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Sgt. Pepper

[DanvillRob]

4 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

Ah, but who is the determining  factor for what is GOOD? 

What I think is good other think may think its c-rap, and vice versa. 

Its the old Jimi Hendrix is still, and always will always be considered  the BEST guitarist ever, and will be until the Earth stops rotating. Jimi was great and influential, and ahead of his time, but the best? 

When I say 'good music', I mean good to me.

I don't care if anyone else likes what I like.

There is no 'Best' guitarist..... different 'greats' for different genres....  Is Jimi greater than Segovia?   Is SRV greater than Django?

The good thing is that music isn't (at least SHOULDN'T be) a contest.

When I play with people not as skilled as me, I try to teach them..... when I play with people with more skills than me, I try to learn from them.

[Sgt. Pepper]

46 minutes ago, DanvillRob said:

The good thing is that music isn't (at least SHOULDN'T be) a contest.

The Rolling Stones are touted as the Greatest Rock And Roll Band In The World. They are the greatest at phoning in an album and going through the motions of making one.

I got two words for anyone that thinks they are the greatest - Emotional Rescue, or Dirty Work, or Voodoo Lounge, or this is where I'm gonna rustle some feathers - Tattoo You.

I remember after getting Some Girls and loving it, and then E R came out, and I got it for Xmas when I was 14, and I said to myself - WTF is this k-rap

Edited October 11, 2023 by Sgt. Pepper

[cody78]

I agree there is no such thing as 'the best'. People have their favourites. I guess there is 'technically' more proficient in music, but it's still subjective.  In classical and jazz you have to be an extremely proficient musician, but in most other styles you can be great, average or poor and still influence millions of people. I love a lot of classical and jazz music, but I also love a lot of punk and grunge music. The skill involved is miles apart, but the overall sound is just as relevant to my ears. 

[MissouriPicker]

2 hours ago, DanvillRob said:

MP, I tend to like good music.    I can (usually) leave the politics behind and enjoy the music for music's sake.

You didn't name one band/artist that I don't enjoy some of their music....and not one who has produced some music I don't care for.

The "song" is all important....I feel the true 'musicians' are those who write great songs, (like our own Murph).   Guys like me are just hacks, (but I ain't complainin').

Yeah, I’m not into the politics of an artist I might like.  I don’t care for much of Springsteen’s politics, but I really like several of his songs and his shows are non_political..  As you stated, it’s the song that’s important…….Yes, guys like us are just hacks.  “Hack” sounds more manly than amateur, so I’m happy to be a hack….

[Sgt. Pepper]

50 minutes ago, cody78 said:

I agree there is no such thing as 'the best'. People have their favorites. 

I have said that for ages.

Jimi may be your favorite, but he is not the best. 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Sgt. Pepper

[Sgt. Pepper]

33 minutes ago, MissouriPicker said:

Yeah, I’m not into the politics of an artist I might like.  I don’t care for much of Springsteen’s politics, but I really like several of his songs and his shows are non_political..  As you stated, it’s the song that’s important…….Yes, guys like us are just hacks.  “Hack” sounds more manly than amateur, so I’m happy to be a hack….

But us as the "hacks" are the reason these people have careers. We buy their music (or we used to), we go their shows (but for a while we couldn't), and we buy the merch. Piss off enough of your fans and you wont have any.

 

 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Sgt. Pepper

[cody78]

Well, I wouldn't consider myself a 'hack' musically. I did complete a music degree back in 2008 with first class honours. I am a 'hack' when it comes to self promotion and marketing though and that is what sells a lot of records...or streams/ downloads. I think there are many on the forum who are self taught, but also a few who studied music. Many of the great musicians were self taught, so either path is good. 

[cody78]

1 hour ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

I have said that for ages.

Jimi may be your favorite, but he is not the best. 

Indeed. 

Edited October 11, 2023 by cody78

[DanvillRob]

I meant "Hacks" in the respectful way!

I know that musicians...those who know music like the backs of their hands, practiced a LOT.... lived and breathed music....that's how they got so good....and us 'hacks' had other interests...lives outside of music.

It's a choice we make....not EVERYONE can be a professional musician.

[Ceptorman]

Jimi stated once that Billy Gibbons was the best guitarist in the world.

A lot of people say that Eric Clapton was the greatest, my opinion was that he was the 3rd best guitarist from The Yardbirds!

[MissouriPicker]

In the mid-50s, when I was 9-10, my dad took me to a bar called The Chestnut Inn ( years later became a strip joint called The Shady Lady).  He went to high school with the guy who owned it (Joe Spinello).  The guy let us in through the kitchen to see Johnny Cash & The Tennessee Two.  I didn’t know anything about Cash then ({my dad was a fan), but I still remember how people were packed-in to the joint and how the women were screaming his name.  I believe that made a real impression on me (guitar= babes)…..In my high school days (a few years ago), I’d sit on the steps after school got out and strum Peter, Paul & Mary songs.   Even though I was a guitar hack (about the same as now), girls who normally wouldn’t even say much to me would stop and talk with me.  I got a lot of dates out of it.  I’m never offended if I’m referred to as a guitar hack.   “I yam what I yam, and that’s all that I yam.”  I’m self-taught through years of “trial and error” and am now at a point where I can find the fingerpicking melody for anything I want to do instrumentally and I understand where to go up-and-down the neck for solo breaks of my own songs.  Certainly not anything special as I keep it simple and have a lot of fun……For me, it’s all about having fun….Plus, it’s good therapy for the brain.

Edited October 11, 2023 by MissouriPicker

[DanvillRob]

2 minutes ago, MissouriPicker said:

In the mid-50s, when I was 9-10, my dad took me to a bar called The Chestnut Inn ( years later became a strip joint called The Shady Lady).  He went to high school with the guy who owned it (Joe Spinello).  The guy let us in through the kitchen to seen Johnny Cash & The Tennessee Two.  I didn’t know anything about Cash then ({my dad was a fan), but I still remember how people were packed-in to the joint and how the women were screaming his name.  I believe that made a real impression on me (guitar= babes)…..In my high school days (a few years ago), I’d sit on the steps after school got out and strum Peter, Paul & Mary songs.   Even though I was a guitar hack (about the same as now), girls who normally wouldn’t even say much to me would stop and talk with me.  I got a lot of dates out of it.  I’m never offended if I’m referred to as a guitar hack.   “I yam what I yam, and that’s all that I yam.”  I’m self-taught through years of “trial and error” and am now at a point where I can find the fingerpicking melody for anything I want to do instrumentally and I understand where to go up-and-down the neck for solo breaks of my own songs.  Certainly not anything special as I keep it simple and have a lot of fun……For me, it’s all about having fun….Plus, it’s good therapy for the brain.

My early music career is well known in here…..but after, I played at several of my SIL’s weddings.    At one of them, I was playing some songs, and one of my SIL’s friends came up to me and asked, “Do you screw as good as you play?”    My wife was right there and didn’t much appreciate what she said!    I wanted to tell her, “yeah…..pretty much a hack at both.”

[Sheepdog1969]

If I had a nickel for every "life choice" I made as a young man, that ultimately used, "will this get me laid easier" as the deciding factor, I would be worth twice as much as I am now. Although I did not decide to learn guitar at 8 for this reason, I defiantly understood that playing my guitar at parties in High School, College, and beyond would give me a better chance with the fairer sex than playing my trombone at said gatherings, (even though I was an exponentially better trombone player than a guitar player,  back then).

But, as a cautionary tale; I have a dear, life long friend who is an incredible guitar player. He still plays lead for a band gigging a few nights a week in Chicago. He is 5' 8" and 100lbs soaking wet, who had no fashion sense or concerns about his looks. I remember sitting with him near Navy Pier on Chicago's lake front, on a perfect summer Saturday, as he played his acoustic amongst the throngs of  people there. As usual, he was "on", and effortlessly nailed everything he played. Yet not one person, let alone a "pretty girl", stopped to listen to him play. He did get many approving head nods, mostly from middle aged men passing by, but he defiantly wasn't getting the attention his skills deserved. He wasn't "performing" for tips, nor did he even have his case open for said. He was just playing because he liked to. After an hour or so of playing, a decent looking young guy came up and asked if he could play my friends guitar for a bit. This guy barely could play, but with-in minutes, an ever-growing crowd  of pretty women sat down to hear him butcher each tune. And, after he murdered the three songs he "knew", he handed the guitar back to my friend who calmly lit into some serious SRV. Despite my friend's solid rendition of "Voodoo Child", every single "pretty woman", walked away before the song ended. 

He, and I, knew at that moment that even exceptional guitar skills are no match for "good looks" for attracting women, especially in that type of setting. Thankfully, he eventually met and married a wonderful woman who appreciated all he had to offer, (and he did begin to care about his appearance.)

So, for those who may assume that it was only your guitar skills that attracted the opposite sex to you, (or that attracted anyone you found attractive to you), you may be better looking, (and possibly less skilled at guitar), than you think! As such, I must be massively attractive, because my guitar hackery cannot be appealing enough to account for the notches in my bed post! Yup, that's the story I'm going with.

[Larsongs]

19 hours ago, DanvillRob said:

I meant "Hacks" in the respectful way!

I know that musicians...those who know music like the backs of their hands, practiced a LOT.... lived and breathed music....that's how they got so good....and us 'hacks' had other interests...lives outside of music.

It's a choice we make....not EVERYONE can be a professional musician.

My older brother was a far better Musician than my younger brother & myself.. He ended up with a Masters Degree, taught at the College level, played in the Philharmonic & then decided there wasn’t any money in Music for him.. Went back to Law School became an Attorney & now he’s loaded..

My younger brother & I still write, play, sing & record.. We love doing it! We never left a gig empty handed, if you know what I mean…

Edited October 12, 2023 by Larsongs

[Sgt. Pepper]

15 minutes ago, Sheepdog1969 said:

If I had a nickel for every "life choice" I made as a young man, that ultimately used, "will this get me laid easier" as the deciding factor, I would be worth twice as much as I am now. Although I did not decide to learn guitar at 8 for this reason, I defiantly understood that playing my guitar at parties in High School, College, and beyond would give me a better chance with the fairer sex than playing my trombone at said gatherings, (even though I was an exponentially better trombone player than a guitar player,  back then).

But, as a cautionary tale; I have a dear, life long friend who is an incredible guitar player. He still plays lead for a band gigging a few nights a week in Chicago. He is 5' 8" and 100lbs soaking wet, who had no fashion sense or concerns about his looks. I remember sitting with him near Navy Pier on Chicago's lake front, on a perfect summer Saturday, as he played his acoustic amongst the throngs of  people there. As usual, he was "on", and effortlessly nailed everything he played. Yet not one person, let alone a "pretty girl", stopped to listen to him play. He did get many approving head nods, mostly from middle aged men passing by, but he defiantly wasn't getting the attention his skills deserved. He wasn't "performing" for tips, nor did he even have his case open for said. He was just playing because he liked to. After an hour or so of playing, a decent looking young guy came up and asked if he could play my friends guitar for a bit. This guy barely could play, but with-in minutes, an ever-growing crowd  of pretty women sat down to hear him butcher each tune. And, after he murdered the three songs he "knew", he handed the guitar back to my friend who calmly lit into some serious SRV. Despite my friend's solid rendition of "Voodoo Child", every single "pretty woman", walked away before the song ended. 

He, and I, knew at that moment that even exceptional guitar skills are no match for "good looks" for attracting women, especially in that type of setting. Thankfully, he eventually met and married a wonderful woman who appreciated all he had to offer, (and he did begin to care about his appearance.)

So, for those who may assume that it was only your guitar skills that attracted the opposite sex to you, (or that attracted anyone you found attractive to you), you may be better looking, (and possibly less skilled at guitar), than you think! As such, I must be massively attractive, because my guitar hackery cannot be appealing enough to account for the notches in my bed post! Yup, that's the story I'm going with.

Being able to play an instrument, and money has always attracted women to rock stars. 

Look at Rik Ocasek  and Billy Joel. Both were marrred to supermodels. Nuff said.