Used guitar market bubble bursting?

[merciful-evans]

On 3/23/2024 at 9:26 PM, Rabs said:

Thats pretty good.. But really after my 336s, I cant even be looking at buying one 🙂  Yeah, hopefully I will get my own, better one finished.

I was surprised that they were that much! Considering that I got mine brand new for half price. 

I know they wouldn't suit you because of the increased neck width anyway, so I wasn't suggesting this to you. I was just weighing in with more examples of crazy prices.  I know your one will be exactly what you want. 

[Sheepdog1969]

Yesterday was Good Friday, and I went to Woodstock, IL to "get my hair did", so I could look purdy for Easter Brunch at the Country Club. (yes the Woodstock where Groundhog's day was filmed, and no, a haircut cannot make me purdy)

After my cut, I decided to stop in to a pretty crappy music store on the square. The proprietor owns the building, and makes his money from the apartments on the top two floors, the rent from the Bar in the basement, and the rent from the fairly sizeable practice space/performance space behind his tiny music shop. He always seems bothered when anyone comes in, ALWAYS has a different, attractive, middle aged woman, talking with him behind the counter, and every crappy used instrument in his store is covered in dust with no price tags. But us locals know that he loves estate sales, and every so often he'll have a old Gibson or two for sale that he got cheap at those auctions.   

I walked in at 3:55pm, and he sternly made it clear that he was locking up in 5 min, since it was Good Friday. After telling him I only needed 10 minutes, just to f with him, I saw two Gibson Les Pauls hanging there, the only guitars devoid of dust. One was a 90's Custom, with a decent Burgundy finish and scratched but not tarnished/pitted Gold hardware. The other was from the '90's with chrome hardware and a dulled black finish that showed heavy wear in all the places a gigging guitar would exhibit, yet the fret board, covered humbuckers, tuners, bridge, tail stop, and frets had been lovingly cared for. Since the truss rod cover had been replaced with a personalized one, (Roy something or other), I didn't know if was a Custom, Standard, Studio, Deluxe, or what. The Gibson logo on the headstock was inlayed mother of pearl, and the fretboard had beautiful mother of pearl Super 400 inlays. 2 volume and two tone speed knobs, three way selector with the chip, and pressed numbers starting with 9,  and no CSE markings. 

But what really freaked me out was the price tag it surprisingly had on it, which I confirmed was correct with the owner. $400.00 it said. As I held my best poker face, I said, "Gee, this ones really beat up, I assume it doesn't even work anymore. Mind if I plug it in and see?". He replied, "Not today, I'm locking up. I open at noon tomorrow."  I didn't even have time to jot down the serial number before he gave me the bum's rush out the door. 

So, I guess the used market IS collapsing, at least at this idiot's shop in Woodstock, IL. I'm heading down there in a few hours and plan to run the serial numbers, and to discretely check a few things before trying to haggle him down LOL. If it's legit, $400 is great even if it needs some work. We'll see.

[fortyearspickn]

For $400,  I'd buy it just to make him wonder.  

[Larsongs]

3 hours ago, fortyearspickn said:

For $400,  I'd buy it just to make him wonder.  

If it’s a real 90’s Gibson Les Paul with no major problems $400.00 is a steal..  On Reverb they’re over $2000.00 + up.. Even a 90’s Orville is $1188.00..

$400.00…. Something fishy..

Edited March 30 by Larsongs

[Pinch]

Idiot is a bit strong. I'd love to see more people sell LPs for $400.

[cookieman15061]

On 3/25/2024 at 9:02 AM, Larsongs said:

How does a kid start playing with B.B. King when he’s 11 years old? How does he get Frank Sinatra’s Mgr? I don’t know about his back story but very well could be he was born into it.. Coming from a family of Wealth & Influence doesn’t hurt… I don’t know that he did but, either that or his Stars aligned…

He wasn't born into it. Comes from a middle class upbringing. His dad owned a neighborhood music store. 

The guy busted his *** for years to be as successful as he is. He learned the music business and markets his music, concerts and swag himself. 

He also supports other artist with his Keeping The Blues Alive foundation.

He's a guitar/amp geek like most of us, just on a larger scale.

[Sgt. Pepper]

On 3/31/2024 at 3:54 PM, Pinch said:

Idiot is a bit strong. I'd love to see more people sell LPs for $400.

Ya know who wouldn’t want that . . . 

[John Shiflet]

The video about the state of the U.S. Guitar market was intriguing.  It aligns with other articles I've read that the current glut of guitars is only going to get worse because like it or not. the Boomer Generation (ever have some little snot say "Okay, Boomer" to you?) is aging out and not many new players are coming in to replace those who go to the great Woodstock concert in the sky.  I've noted from browsing the guitar ads on e-Bay that a large number of offerings mention in their listings "from Japan".  Since the Japanese got burned by the Great Recession (2008)  with American real estate, some turned to high end guitars as an alternative hedge and they looked at them as blue chip stocks to hold rather than instruments to play. I think now, it's beginning to dawn on some of them that the once thriving market for prime guitars just isn't there anymore. Sure, if you have a '59 LP in mint condition, you're still good, but those in the mid-range there's simply too many of them for any rapid appreciation.  A new generation needs to be educated and brought into the fold. I think the School of Rock movie concept wasn't too far fetched. I mean they still have band practice courses in some schools. It's not fantasy to consider a music program format for electric guitars. I suppose part of the trouble is the "Bad Boy" image Rock musicians have had but those in the know understand that the anything goes, wild and crazy music scene of the 1960's and '70's is now populated by men (and maybe a few women)  who are on a countdown to a nursing home; that is, if they're lucky and haven't already died.

The incessant imports of guitars reminds me of the onslaught of imported cars in years past.  I regret there isn't a universal standard of playability that requires a minimum number of performance standards to be met. I mean, imported cars always have had to meet U.S. standards to be street legal and sold in dealerships. I suppose I can't blame importers for wanting to sell their so-so guitars by undercutting mainstream domestic Guitar makers-that was the strategy used to grab market share from American car makers. I'm not a huge fan of protectionism but in the instance of quality guitars, our domestic makers don't need to go the route of American made electronics.  (anyone remember Zenith TV's?)  I bought a darn good American made stereo system in the late 70's- A Phase Linear 400 power amp, a Phase Linear 4000 Autocorrelation Pre-Amplifier  (and had lots of fun dazzling others with that exotic name)  and Rectilinear III's speakers. All that gone with the wind, now. I subscribed back then to Stereo Review and Audio magazines whichin each issue highlighted the newest American made models, Everyone had to remember what the "RMS" stood for after the stated output wattage. (RMS translating to Root Mean Square of a waveform on an Oscilloscope)  Sound distortion was measured in hundreds and even thousands of a percentage point and the icing on the cake was the magic 20-20,000 hertz representing the audible limits of human hearing.  Do young folks today even know what such accurate and precise measurements mean? I'd wager most don't have a clue and an even larger number don't give a damn.

In summary,  the only way the quality guitar world can survive is we have to nurture and  bring a younger generation into the player fold. I attached a local recent  newspiece (from Wheeling, WV) about yes, an ELEVEN year old guitar player who got noticed via the social media route. Not surprisingly, part of the story focused on the public outpouring of support and generosity this kid has received. He's been gifted two free guitars from strangers and he's communicated with some musical greats, including, you guessed it, John Bonamassa.  It's gives me hope that some of my guitars will continued to be played in the future. I think Gibson could be ahead of the game by sprinkling good player type instruments around middle and high schools provided they will create a guitar playing program. Create brand loyalty early and the kids will stay with the brand for life. I don't want to see everything we cherished in our generation dying with us. After all, the premise is or maybe was, that Rock and Roll will never die and the only way to make that happen is with new blood and younger players.  I'll end by advising makers to de-emphasize the "relics" being built and marketed, Stay with and build quality instruments and don't weaken the brand quality image by making people think all they made nowadays are beat up guitars. (hence concluding by some that the makers may have lost their pride)

[Larsongs]

Sounds like many articles I read before Covid. However, the Population of the World isn’t shrinking.. It’s increasing exponentially. Last time I checked, more Guitars are being sold today than ever.

The most desirable Gibsons produced  in 1959 were numbered by 100’s not thousands.. They are still a great hedge against inflation..

Recent numbers of bands playing Guitars has increased., Country is bigger than ever.. Rap is starting to wane.. Rock is even starting to make a comeback.. I just read 100,000 new Songs are released everyday on Spotify.. Most of them aren’t making any money. But, there still is vast number of people making music.. Why? Who knows? But, they are…

[Sgt. Pepper]

So yelling obscenities and the N word into a microphone with a backing track is starting to wane? I’ll be glad when it ceases to exist.