How much difference could a string change make?

[egoidealmusic]

So here's the issue with terms like "boomy" or "thump" or "growl" as has been pointed out (and I've used them too, so no high horse here) is that they're all subjective.  However, I think when most folks talk about the sound of a J45 there's a lot of bass and low mid punch (there's another subjective word), but that most think of this sound it's seems to be sort of universal despite the term.  When I think of the great Huminbirds I've heard I don't think of those terms.  They're brighter and, I think, really more balanced than a J45.  But that has to be what you want.  Songwriters love a J45 because it is more low/mid and is less intrusive on a vocal (unless you sing real low I guess).  That being said, if one expects a J45 sound out of a Hummingbird (or the other way around) then it's not going to happen.  That's why moany of us have multiple. 🙂 

 

[E-minor7]

19 minutes ago, egoidealmusic said:

So here's the issue with terms like "boomy" or "thump" or "growl" as has been pointed out (and I've used them too, so no high horse here) is that they're all subjective.  However, I think when most folks talk about the sound of a J45 there's a lot of bass and low mid punch (there's another subjective word), but that most think of this sound it's seems to be sort of universal despite the term.  When I think of the great Huminbirds I've heard I don't think of those terms.  They're brighter and, I think, really more balanced than a J45.  But that has to be what you want.  Songwriters love a J45 because it is more low/mid and is less intrusive on a vocal (unless you sing real low I guess).  That being said, if one expects a J45 sound out of a Hummingbird (or the other way around) then it's not going to happen.  That's why moany of us have multiple. 🙂 

 

Good post - and yes, the 45 (tho a workhorse ok) also is a greater poet than the hog squares.                                                                                                      Still no Bird - therefor not hovering in that same indefinable way. 

 

What worried me was that PrairieDog didn't really dig the Bird strummed either.

PD ! don't know what U use, but try a softer pick.

[PrairieDog]

16 minutes ago, E-minor7 said:

Good post - and yes, the 45 (tho a workhorse ok) also is a greater poet than the hog squares.                                                                                                      Still no Bird - therefor not hovering in that same indefinable way. 

 

What worried me was that PrairieDog didn't really dig the Bird strummed either.

PD ! don't know what U use, but try a softer pick.

ahh, I’m actually a naked finger picker 😱, I only tried some different picks thinking it needed more force.  It didn’t help, 😄 Anyway, once I got it knocked out of my head that just because it is a big hog means it should be big and bassy, I am reassessing to appreciate it for what it is.  As I said at the very beginning it is a very pretty sounding guitar.    

If the gist of the historic thread was that older guitars have more of the subjective thump, that would mesh with my experience with the 1995 J-45 I mentioned.  It may be the only time I will get to hear the real thing.  I had no idea that wasn’t just “the sound of a J-45,” rueful chuckle 

[E-minor7]

35 minutes ago, PrairieDog said:

If the gist of the historic thread was that older guitars have more of the subjective thump, that would mesh with my experience with the 1995 J-45 I mentioned.  It may be the only time I will get to hear the real thing.  I had no idea that wasn’t just “the sound of a J-45,” rueful chuckle 

I don't recall that as an overall conclusion. My suggestion some posts ago was based on the idea that the real oldies have dried out which generally makes them so willing & able. 

36 minutes ago, PrairieDog said:

Anyway, once I got it knocked out of my head that just because it is a big hog means it should be big and bassy, I am reassessing to appreciate it for what it is.  As I said at the very beginning it is a very pretty sounding guitar.    

Once you realize the Bird isn't a 45 (which btw. perhaps may be your real target) there is a chance that you (and your wife) will become real fond of the Bird-virtues. 

Having both / all 3 would of course be ideal now that the DIFs already around.                                                                                                                         We'll await and see what happens. 

[PrairieDog]

27 minutes ago, E-minor7 said:

I don't recall that as an overall conclusion. My suggestion some posts ago was based on the idea that the real oldies have dried out which generally makes them so willing & able. 

Once you realize the Bird isn't a 45 (which btw. perhaps may be your real target) there is a chance that you (and your wife) will become real fond of the Bird-virtues. 

Having both / all 3 would of course be ideal now that the DIFs already around.                                                                                                                         We'll await and see what happens. 

Chuckle, yeah, you don’t need to tell me I’m looking for a 45.  This whole thing got started because I was lasered in searching for a plain old used, standard J-45.  I even put up a post wondering where they all were given how many have been sold and I could not find one decent one within hundreds of miles.  

Finally thinking I was going to break down and just buy the new one at my GC I got my head turned by a new Original Hbird in the case, with its come-hither good looks.

Did an intense play off with the J-45 in the store, and convinced myself a bird was what I really wanted.  The J started to sound muddy, while the Bird was more articulate.  I explained earlier the test room at my GC really accentuates the bass, so the play off was a bit rigged for this purpose.  

Went home to see about a Bird, and found this too good to pass up deal: a 2020 for less than I was going to pay for the new J.  It seemed like fate, and here we are.  

I already said I AM ready to let the bird roost for a bit while we get to know each other, and I’ll just resume my hunt for J-45.  

I DO understand and have admitted in several posts that I made a mistake thinking a bird would be similar to a 45!  

If everyone could now please stop batting me about the ears pointing out my error, that would be great, my head is getting sore from all the “thumping.” 😆

Edited June 6 by PrairieDog

[Larsongs]

1 hour ago, PrairieDog said:

Chuckle, yeah, you don’t need to tell me I’m looking for a 45.  This whole thing got started because I was lasered in searching for a plain old used, standard J-45.  I even put up a post wondering where they all were given how many have been sold and I could not find one decent one within hundreds of miles.  

Finally thinking I was going to break down and just buy the new one at my GC I got my head turned by a new Original Hbird in the case, with its come-hither good looks.

Did an intense play off with the J-45 in the store, and convinced myself a bird was what I really wanted.  The J started to sound muddy, while the Bird was more articulate.  I explained earlier the test room at my GC really accentuates the bass, so the play off was a bit rigged for this purpose.  

Went home to see about a Bird, and found this too good to pass up deal: a 2020 for less than I was going to pay for the new J.  It seemed like fate, and here we are.  

I already said I AM ready to let the bird roost for a bit while we get to know each other, and I’ll just resume my hunt for J-45.  

I DO understand and have admitted in several posts that I made a mistake thinking a bird would be similar to a 45!  

If everyone could now please stop batting me about the ears pointing out my error, that would be great, my head is getting sore from all the “thumping.” 😆

You’ve got a great attitude.. There is absolutely nothing wrong with having a H’Bird & a J-45! I think you are on to something good!

[62burst]

Here is one of the threads about "it". Maybe Emin7 can link the 3 year old thread. I just like the sound that the short scale, mahogany, and esp in slope shouldered form gives to the sound of the guitar. But it can make the "pretty" sound if one is so inclined.

And of course, Ray Wylie Hubbard immortalizes the "thump" word in Down Home Country Blues:

ps- Sorry PDog- didn't see your recent post saying you were thumped out. 😊

Edited June 6 by 62burst

[PrairieDog]

4 hours ago, 62burst said:

ps- Sorry PDog- didn't see your recent post saying you were thumped out. 😊

😄 No worries! We’re good! Now, if one more person tells me I have to “just” try 5 different sets of non-coated strings until I find the ones I like, I’m going to do it, then stick a raw, bloody, oozy finger in their beer 😆 😁

Edited June 6 by PrairieDog

[Sgt. Pepper]

I know. Saying to someone to try different brands of strings until they find what works for them is useless advise. I guess you just want to be told what to buy and be done with it? I tried lots till I came across the D’ad XS’s. I swore by Martin strings for years. Never thought I’d like coated strings either. 

[PrairieDog]

30 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

I know. Saying to someone to try different brands of strings until they find what works for them is useless advise. I guess you just want to be told what to buy and be done with it? I tried lots till I came across the D’ad XS’s. I swore by Martin strings for years. Never thought I’d like coated strings either. 

Sarge, I have responded multiple times throughout this thread to everyone who already suggested I try different strings: I HAVE TO USE COATED STRINGS.  I AM ALLERGIC TO METAL. I even say I use XSs and why.   Do you not bother to at least skim a thread before you start pontificating?  It’s not like you were the first genius to come up with that bit of break-through advice.   

Here, not my fingers, but where’s your beer? 

Edited June 6 by PrairieDog

[Sgt. Pepper]

20 minutes ago, PrairieDog said:

Sarge, I have responded multiple times throughout this thread to everyone who already suggested I try different strings: I HAVE TO USE COATED STRINGS. I AM ALLERGIC TO METAL. Do you not bother to at least skim a thread before you start pontificating?  It’s not like you were the first genius to come up with that bit of break-through advice.   

Ok so try all the coated ones. Almost every string maker has them now. But doesn’t the coating eventually get chipped and wear off. Thats when I change mine or when they sound dead. And D’ad XS’ s are coated strings. I know cause it’s what I use now. Did you read where I said I never thought I’d ever like coated strings?

And no I did not go through 3 pages of threads to read over and over sting suggestions.

As far as your bloody finger, keep that to yourself.

Edited June 6 by Sgt. Pepper

[PrairieDog]

5 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

Ok so try all the coated ones. Almost every string maker has them now. But doesn’t the coating eventually get chipped and wear off. Thats when I change mine or when they sound dead. And D’ad XS’ s are coated strings. I know cause it’s what I use now. Did you read where I said I never thought I’d ever like coated strings?

And no I did not go through 3 pages of threads to read over and over sting suggestions.

As far as your bloody finger, keep that to yourself.

Well see, if you had bothered to read any of it, you would have found out the thread was NEVER about asking for string suggestions. It was asking if FRESH strings of the ones I have might make the difference I was looking for.  

The question was pretty much settled on the first page.  The rest was just folks repeating the different string suggestions and/or scrapping the coated,  “hog”-piling on my mistake thinking a hog Bird would/could sound like a hog J, and discussing what “thump” is.  

I even already said I was making peace with the Bird for what it is, not what I wanted it to be.  

The party was over, and the lights were out  before Johnny-come-lately showed up, waking the owner with a off-topic, beaten horse, comment.  

 

[olie]

2 hours ago, PrairieDog said:

Well see, if you had bothered to read any of it, you would have found out the thread was NEVER about asking for string suggestions. It was asking if FRESH strings of the ones I have might make the difference I was looking for.  

The question was pretty much settled on the first page.  The rest was just folks repeating the different string suggestions and/or scrapping the coated,  “hog”-piling on my mistake thinking a hog Bird would/could sound like a hog J, and discussing what “thump” is.  

I even already said I was making peace with the Bird for what it is, not what I wanted it to be.  

The party was over, and the lights were out  before Johnny-come-lately showed up, waking the owner with a off-topic, beaten horse, comment.  

 

Since the horse hasn't been beat to death let me add a comment from Mark Stutman of Folkway Music, who knows a thing or two about guitars; "We use ( XS) them on all our store/stock guitars. Great strings... the XS  have replaced Elixir as the go-to coated string for most people." FWIW.

[PrairieDog]

56 minutes ago, olie said:

Since the horse hasn't been beat to death let me add a comment from Mark Stutman of Folkway Music, who knows a thing or two about guitars; "We use ( XS) them on all our store/stock guitars. Great strings... the XS  have replaced Elixir as the go-to coated string for most people." FWIW.

Grin, nod, Folkway is great.  I’ve got no complaints with the XSs, I use the PBs.  And yeah, I had a terrible experience with the elixers flaking off almost immediately and getting the shrapnel in my fingers on top of the reaction I had from the bare metal.  

[BoSoxBiker]

On 6/4/2024 at 1:59 PM, PrairieDog said:

..................

Has anyone noticed a lot more voice/depth come out with just new strings?  My others didn’t have this problem so I don’t know if this is a real fix or not.  

.........................................

Any and all suggestions welcome.  I really want to love this guitar.

Perhaps the reason for some folks getting off the beaten path is because they read the last statement of the original post.

You've already accepted that it is possible that new strings CAN help your 'bird. My Hummingbird (2018 Standard) is the one guitar I own that suffers from worn strings the most. It also suffers from 2 weeks in the case. Always better on day-2. (I have a 3-week guitar stand/case rotation thing going on.)

I used to frequent that specific GC before the Pandemic. That store during that period was the worst I have ever seen for keeping guitars in decent shape, string-wise. They had a policy for a while that only their techs could swap strings out.  The building is also old and run down. You could feel the humidity in the acoustic room.  I don't know if they've fixed the HVAC issue or not. I'm sure you've assessed the guitar's humidity health already. 

Another possible hint from my 'Bird is that mine responds to hybrid sized string sets in a big way. As such, I looked it up. Your favored XS strings come in a "Light top, Med Bottom" set which is 12-16-25-35-45-56. If that doesn't add tone thickness (thump?), I don't know what will.

Assuming the guitar is not defective, there is a benefit to letting it hang around a few months. Throw a few different sized sets of strings and maybe try altering the set up a bit to see if there is a sweet spot. If six months pass and you've not bonded with it, try to sell it for similar money you paid.

Anyway, good luck with it all.

 

[jvi]

a good guitar sounds good with bad strings I think,  if your not loving it  move on

[E-minor7]

7 hours ago, jvi said:

a good guitar sounds good with bad strings I think,  if your not loving it  move on

Like a bad guitar with worse strings probably sounds good in a loving player's hands.

            .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .

Apart from that The THUMP.                                                                                                                                                                                                        Here's the video I sat up in the 10 (not 3 as mentioned) year old thread.
                                            The guy still Ts away between 3:25 and 4:00.

                                                                                  'Dead' & Dry - yet so alive. 

[fortyearspickn]

11 hours ago, jvi said:

a good guitar sounds good with bad strings I think,  if your not loving it  move on

Absolutely!  I prefer the tone/sound of 2 year old strings on my guitars, including my H’Bird.  

['Scales]

22 hours ago, jvi said:

a good guitar sounds good with bad strings I think,  if your not loving it  move on

And heck, there’s always the tambourine 🙂

[jvi]

2 hours ago, 'Scales said:

And heck, there’s always the tambourine 🙂

and if the sound  of that sucks,  you could try new rims and cymbals....

[Sgt. Pepper]

40 minutes ago, jvi said:

and if the sound  of that sucks,  you could try new rims and cymbals....

I think Stevie Nicks is the Hendrix of the Tambourine. No one does spins and taps it like her. 

[E-minor7]

1 hour ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

I think Stevie Nicks is the Hendrix of the Tambourine. No one does spins and taps it like her. 

Do we have footage of that level of artistry ?

[Sgt. Pepper]

50 minutes ago, E-minor7 said:

Do we have footage of that level of artistry ?

Yep. The guy at the end is stoked. She is just adding so much nuance to the song. Two hands, one hand, she does it all. I wonder if she has a left or right handed one? What does she tune it to? Does Slash know she has his hat?

 

Edited June 8 by Sgt. Pepper

[E-minor7]

2 hours ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

Yep. The guy at the end is stoked. She is just adding so much nuance to the song. Two hands, one hand, she does it all. I wonder if she has a left or right handed one? What does she tune it to? Does Slash know she has his hat?

 

I think point is proven here no doubt - and of course so right to choose the half-moon version. 

Caught the guy under a spell, , , wonder if he ever came out. .  

[fortyearspickn]

That guy has serious problems.  I hope it's only drugs, and not something permanent.