Why so twangy ?

[fuzz]

Folks

 

I've been playing the ES335 for about 7 years now and every day I become a little more disturbed by the twangy sound I get out this guitar. I play it through a 60's style fender twin which of course is not known for distortion.

 

I play alongside another guy who plays strat plugged into a modern fender with 4-10s. He gets all kinds of throaty deep sounds out of that combination - but he uses various gain settings.

 

I find that unless I use a stomp box for overdrive, or maybe chorus box, I'm less and less happy with the sound I get out of my combo. It's just too clean and twangy.

 

I used to play the thinner strings (start with .10) but moved up to slightly wide .11 If I move up to .13 then the strings become harder to bend.

 

I am looking for a bluesy deep throaty wailing sound out of my Gibson. Perhaps I need to set tone on guitar differently or maybe on amp differenty? I've tried a variety of settings but usually return back to setting where I use both pickups and with tone knobs set to 10 and volumes in about middle. The Twin is so loud I rarely cross the 4 setting even when playing outdoors.

 

I've started shopping for other guitars. But before I leave the ES 335 I thought I'd try this forum to see if maybe there's something else I should try on this guitar. Maybe different pickups?

 

Or could it be that my style is just not the kind that will ever produce the desired sound?

 

COmments? SUggestions?

[Silenced Fred]

In all honesty, maybe a sound clip would help. What are some of your influences? What kind of music are you playing?

[cdntac]

A friend of mine has a Fender Deluxe and I'm not a fan of the tone that comes out of that amp with my Byrdland. There's that Fender twang that you speak of that I easily hear.

 

What does your 335 sound like through your buddy's amp (with gain)?

 

Here's what I'd do (in order):

 

1) Get an amp that has the ability to adjust the gain. I have another friend who has an older Fender Twin and it's near impossible to get any distortion out of it since you have to crank the volume to get the distortion. And that's just not possible with these amps unless you're in a very large hall. They're just too damn loud!

 

 

2) Play with the guitar's volume set to 10.

 

I find that if I want the raunchiest sound out of my Byrd I need to have the guitar's volume on 10. Cutting it back drastically reduces the grunt. FWIW, I never play with both pickups at once --- always with each separate.

 

3) Raise the pickups closer to the strings. You may be surprised at how that will affect your tone.

[Dub-T-123]

It's not the guitar's fault.

[Murph]

Get one of these..

 

 

<<<<---------------

 

 

They don't twang.

[Robin Nahum]

Folks

 

I've been playing the ES335 for about 7 years now and every day I become a little more disturbed by the twangy sound I get out this guitar. I play it through a 60's style fender twin which of course is not known for distortion.

 

It sounds like you're now wanting a darker warmer tone.

 

I find that unless I use a stomp box for overdrive' date=' or maybe chorus box, I'm less and less happy with the sound I get out of my combo. It's just too clean and twangy.

 

I used to play the thinner strings (start with .10) but moved up to slightly wide .11 If I move up to .13 then the strings become harder to bend.

 

I am looking for a bluesy deep throaty wailing sound out of my Gibson. Perhaps I need to set tone on guitar differently or maybe on amp differenty? I've tried a variety of settings but usually return back to setting where I use both pickups and with tone knobs set to 10 and volumes in about middle. The Twin is so loud I rarely cross the 4 setting even when playing outdoors.

 

I've started shopping for other guitars. But before I leave the ES 335 I thought I'd try this forum to see if maybe there's something else I should try on this guitar. Maybe different pickups?

 

Or could it be that my style is just not the kind that will ever produce the desired sound?[/quote']

 

I agree that there is a bit to try before you change guitars. A 335 is very versatile and should be getting you towards the darker sounding end of the range - before you get into full archtops. I think that the amp is the major issue here but a pickup swap might be something to try.

 

Strings

 

I think going to 11s is a good idea and would not go higher if you lose the ability to bend. You could try Gibson Vintage Reissue 11s. These are a darker sounding line. You might also be ready to try flatwounds. Thomastik flatwound 12s (which I am trying out at the moment) are actually quite supple and are not as dark as some flatwounds.

 

Setup

 

You may get some tone variation if you vary the height of the pickups as cdntac noted.

 

Amp

 

Now we're getting into spending but maybe this is what you need to do.

 

You are wanting the amp to break up a bit. As you note, a Twin is not the best choice for this. In addition it has a SS rectifier which means it has quick attack whereas you probably want more sag. On top of this, a Twin Reverb is quite a bright amp. You haven't got the brightness switched on have you? (Just checking!)

 

I think that you might find that a lower wattage amp with a tube rectifier will get you closer to the tone you are after (and be a whole lot less to shlep). These kinds of amp will break up more readily and give you more sag.

 

If you want to stay with Fender, you might look at some second hand early silverfaces (say 68-73), or blackfaces (63-67) if you have the money. I would be trying a Pro Reverb (40W, 2 x 12, 2 x 6L6), Super Reverb (40W, 4 x 10, 2 x 6L6) and possibly a Vibrolux (35W, 2 x 10, 2 x 6L6). You might also find that a Deluxe Reverb floats your boat (22W, 1 x 12, 2 x 6V6). All have the GZ34/5AR4 rectifier.

 

Going to tweed, there is the '59 Bassman (40W, 4 x 10, 2 x 6L6 but no reverb) . An original could be nice but may be a bit outside your budget. But there is a reissue. My only reservation with a reissue is that it has a PCB rather than point-to-point wiring.

 

Pickups

 

If your 335 has the later version of the Classic 57s you might want to think about swapping them out for a darker sounding pickup. I swapped in Vintage Vibe pickups with the weaker AlNiCo2 magnets on my 2002 345 and have been much happier with the tone.

 

As a matter of interest, what other guitars did you try? Did you try them with your Twin? Did any sound more like what you are after?

 

RN

[charlie brown]

Try a Hot Rod Deluxe, Deluxe Reverb (no real "twang" unless you want it), or Hot Rod Deville (4x10 or 2x12).

If it's really "Fender" tone, you're opposed to, then try a Vox, Marshall, Hi Watt, Orange, or Mesa. I have a

feeling it's not "Fender" amps, though. I've used a Twin Reverb, for 30 years, and never felt it was too

"Twangy," at all. The EQ you use, can make a LOT of differnce, from guitar to guitar. Even the room, can

be a factor. In smaller venues, I use a Blues Jr. w/Celestion Vintage 30 speaker. It gets plenty "bluesy,"

with whatever guitar I use. I do set it a bit differently, with a semi-hollow body, than with my Tele or Strat,

but, all that takes is a bit of experimenting. Then, write down your preferred settings (Unless you have a better

memory, than I do, these days), or you play enough, to memorize them, outright. I also use (some) pedals, but

vary sparingly...and NOT to get my basic tone, just to "push it," or color it, a bit, when needed. Basic tone, is

whatever guitar I'm using, and the amp, alone. Good Luck!

 

CB

[milod]

Sometimes you can get kinda that woody bluesy sound by backing off volume on the bridge with it set about 3 on tone and running the neck pickup a little deeper. Then work the amp to handle the lesser guitar output.

 

m

[Thundergod]

Get a Telecaster.

 

Twang will get as bad as it can. But at least you'll know for sure what's causing it

[Uncle Dave]

The Twin Reverb is known as the ultimate clean tone and you will have to use pedals to get crunch in most situations without excessive volume. Or try plugging your guitar into the first input of channel 1, then run a sheilded patch cord from the second input of channel 1 to the first input of channel 2. Play with the volume of both channels till you get the tone you want. Also, there is the Fender " magic six" trick. Volume 6, Treble 6, Middle 3, and Bass 2. Turn the bright on and set the reverb to 2. Give it a try.

[Californiaman]

Get a Telecaster.

 

Twang will get as bad as it can. But at least you'll know for sure what's causing it

 

Again, you've stolen my thunder. Arrrgh!!

 

But seriously, try your buddy's amp out. Or go get a Roland Jazz Chorus. That'll fix ya up nicely.

[fuzz]

Many many thanks to all who commented

 

Regarding skill level - don't know what to say there - I'm not ready to fill stadiums with screaming fans - but i'm a notch or two beyond the garage band stage. playing on/off for 30 years - play in a cover band now

 

I will try my buddy's amp. He's got the Fender hot rod delux - will take my ax to local Guitar Center outlet and plug into every style amp on the floor to see what comes out

 

will try adjusting the pickups higher

 

Especially like the notion of plugging Channel 1 into CHannel 2 - will try - seems kind of gimmicky but if it works - who cares!

 

I love the "Fender 6 setting" idea too - the 6 6 3 2 setting - will try

 

Will try assorted brands of strings but am less optimistic there.

 

Thanks to all who provided comments of any kind ! I knew this forum would provide meaningful info.

 

fuzz

[FirstMeasure]

Could just need a Pickup Swap.

 

The pick ups may have gone "Microphonic". An ES 335 should sound warm and fat through the thinnest of Fender Amps. A Pickups magnetic field will sometimes "Spread Out", leaving the string less field to interrupt, giving it a thinner sound.

 

A "Microphonic" pickup will pick up your voice like a cheap microphone.

[Robin Nahum]

.....

 

I will try my buddy's amp. He's got the Fender hot rod delux - will take my ax to local Guitar Center outlet and plug into every style amp on the floor to see what comes out

 

will try adjusting the pickups higher

 

....

 

Be aware that Hot Rod amps have SS rectifiers - although I believe the circuit design nods to the Bassman circuit which mellows them, and they do have a nice clean. But you might want to try and A/B a Hot Rod with one of the silverfaces I mentioned.

 

I'd try pickup adjustments in both directions. Maybe a visit to a luthier for a diagnosis?

 

Sounds like you might also need to try out another 335 or two in your travels.

 

RN