gobseulmuhri Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 Hey dear EVJ advocates, I love the natural overdrive and crunch of my EVJ, but to get to that point, I have to really crank up the volume. For my dorm room, it's just too loud, and I need a way to lower the volume but still get that naturally overdriven tone out of the amp. I know that the an amp attenuator will help fix that problem by reducing the power that go from the amp head to the speaker. But I was thinking, would it be possible to use a regular EQ pedal to sit between the amp and the speaker to lower the output going into the speaker? i.e. set the EQ and reduce the boost. This way, I can cheaply get the tone I want at lower volumes and tweak the EQ to a more optimal setting. Would this be feasible? Thanks. -Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluefoxicy Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 is that an instrument signal pedal i.e. guitar -> EQ -> amp? The signal gets amplified TWICE (preamp to line level, power amp to output level). You'll fry the EQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Lister Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 I had the same idea (posted it on old Gibson forum) -- a good idea -- but it won't work!:) You will destroy the EQ if placed after the amp! I'm no electronics wizard but it has to do with the way an amp processes the signal it receives from all that is before it (guitar, pedals, etc.) to acheive its blissful overdriven tube nirvana -- through the OT to the speaker. You have to spill-off any undesired volume excess at that point -- between amp/speaker) The only 3 ways to get to where you want to go are: 1. hotplate ($300-500), 2. volume pedal ($180-300), 3. L-pad attenuator ($80-140). I now use and highly recommend the TUBE CUBE attenuator ($80-140 "vspeeds" on ebay) with my stock ver. 3 Jr. head. Jim Sanders at vspeeds also plays Jrs. and will answer your technical questions with much more tech info if you like. So buy one-- and (be allowed to) stay in U (you'll be happy you did for the rest of your life)..., and you're right about another thing: The cranked tube tone potential of the little Jr. has to make it one the best tube amp buys of the century! How Epi ever allowed this thing out the door for under 120 clams is a monumental happening for we budget players. :D/ Hit every BLUE NOTE, baaaby..., I'm going to play on :- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strangedogs Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 I still say MY WAY is $39. I use a TS-7 Ibanez Tube Screamer (got mine @ GC for $39, on Ebay cheaper yet) - turn the amp wide open and the LEVEL on the TS down as low as you like - it works... wide open distortion at bedroom levels. Might color the tone a "slight bit" but IT WORKS and it's a $39 fix. All Attenuators color tone a bit too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-theory Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 You can get a 25w Weber load dump for $60...very similar to a hotplate, but at lower wattage, and with 4/8/16 ohm load options. You could also get an $18 wall-mount attenuator from Rat Shack, and mount it in a box with a couple of jacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follow It Home Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 Im doing a master volume mod to mine. From what I understand, it does about the same thing as an attenuator and it should cost me about 5 dollars, but its a mod so it requires some work. Maybe im interpreting it wrong, but ehh whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
layboomo Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 Im doing a master volume mod to mine. From what I understand' date=' it does about the same thing as an attenuator and it should cost me about 5 dollars, but its a mod so it requires some work. Maybe im interpreting it wrong, but ehh whatever.[/quote'] The problem with a master volume control in a valve jr is that it's before the el-84 and much of the great tone comes from the power tube overdrive. I think master volume controls in the valve jr circuit suck! What you really want is a vvr(variable voltage regulator) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-theory Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 Im doing a master volume mod to mine. From what I understand, it does about the same thing as an attenuator Actually, it's not at all the same. If you like buzzy, fizzy front end distortion, that's what you'll get with a master volume. What you really want is a vvr(variable voltage regulator) Good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlagJones Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 Noob here jumping in. What effect does the guitar's volume control have? Can you dial down the guitar volume and turn up the amp to get the distortion without it being loud? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-theory Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 Noob here jumping in. What effect does the guitar's volume control have? Lowering the guitar volume cleans up the amp, by lowering the input signal. I run all of my amps very hot, and use my guitar volume to get anything from "cleanish" tones to fully overdriven. You won't get overdriven tones by rolling the guitar volume back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Lister Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 yes/NO When you have the amp up high enough to distort (say 2 to all-out) you have virtually no control with the guitar vol. The slightest increase from nil is LOUD plus you have fully amplified electronic hiss to ruin your day. Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby... I'm going to play on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
layboomo Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 yes/NO When you have the amp up high enough to distort (say 2 to all-out) you have virtually no control with the guitar vol. The slightest increase from nil is LOUD plus you have fully amplified electronic hiss to ruin your day. Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby... I'm going to play on [/quote'] I'm sorry but that's just plain wrong! Here are 2 clips exact same amp and guitar nothing else and only the guitar volume adjusting the level.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8U8ieiWBBOY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-theory Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 When you have the amp up high enough to distort (say 2 to all-out) you have virtually no control with the guitar vol. The slightest increase from nil is LOUD plus you have fully amplified electronic hiss to ruin your day Check your volume pot. Sounds like you've got a problem there. I run my amps pegged, and my guitars clean up beautifully when I turn them down. I've never been in a live situation where amp hiss is an issue myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 same here. it's the reason I finally got off my butt and rewired the pain in the neck sheraton with new pots and caps etc.. I wish I'd put in the treble bleed..but, it's good enough after all that stringing thread through holes. the lp studio is going to get the treble bleed and new stuff, too.. much easier to work on. but that's the problem I have with that method. you lose too many highs rolling back--for me. TWANG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-theory Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 but that's the problem I have with that method. you lose too many highs rolling back--for me. Definitely gots to have the bleeder. I recently swapped the pups in my lester, and wired it to '59 specs, but ended up throwing the bleeder back in, because, in spite of what "they say," it definitely lost highs as I rolled back. Dude, I don't envy you on the Sheraton work. Too bad you didn't include that bleeder in that one...you're going to be digging back into it again sometime in the near future, I predict! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWANG Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 actually I noticed today that the output jack tends to want to turn. which made me think I should go back in. god it's a drag though. *L* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlekenny Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 would it work if you ran the VJ head through a solid state amp, turned the all the eq knobs down to zero and used the volume on the solid state as a master volume? sorry for hijacking the thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wpkg Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 yes/NO When you have the amp up high enough to distort (say 2 to all-out) you have virtually no control with the guitar vol. The slightest increase from nil is LOUD plus you have fully amplified electronic hiss to ruin your day. Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby... I'm going to play on :- HUH? maybe if you have a POS shorted out volume pot, but any guitar i have ever played the volume knob does what its supposed to. and a nice gradual sweep at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wpkg Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 Definitely gots to have the bleeder. I recently swapped the pups in my lester' date=' and wired it to '59 specs, but ended up throwing the bleeder back in, because, in spite of what "they say," it definitely lost highs as I rolled back. Dude, I don't envy you on the Sheraton work. Too bad you didn't include that bleeder in that one...you're going to be digging back into it again sometime in the near future, I predict! [/quote'] M-theory, do you find that you lost bass overall when putting in the bleeder cap? I alligator clipped one to my neck humbucker and could A/B pretty quickly and I found that I lost some bass even when the volume was wide open, which i thought would take the cap out totally. Loved what it did for the clarity, but missed the bass. this was on an LP copy with GFS 59s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-theory Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 M-theory, do you find that you lost bass overall when putting in the bleeder cap? I alligator clipped one to my neck humbucker and could A/B pretty quickly and I found that I lost some bass even when the volume was wide open, which i thought would take the cap out totally. Loved what it did for the clarity, but missed the bass. this was on an LP copy with GFS 59s It doesn't do anything when the volume is cranked. It only comes into play at volumes below that, and it should only affect the tone by sending some highs directly to output when the volume is cut back. It shouldn't affect lows at all. It's possible that you're interpreting the increased highs as a loss of lows. Either that, or something's not right with either the cap itself or the way it's mounted. It should be .001uf (this is the most common, but there are no steadfast rules about value, really), and should be soldered between the wiper and non-grounded lugs of the volume pot. Also, check the value of the pot. It should read pretty close to 500k for HB. Most modern pots aren't even close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eracer_Team Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 would it work if you ran the VJ head through a solid state amp' date=' turned the all the eq knobs down to zero and used the volume on the solid state as a master volume? sorry for hijacking the thread[/quote'] No that won't work and you'll wreck both amp's...you would need a line out signal from the VJ and you don't get that off the speaker out. And what would be the point of buying a tube amp to run it through a solid state amp? Not just you little kenny but everyone in the post is missing the point. cGil/Layboomo and others have spent the last 2+ years thrashing the VJ around... This post it nothing new. On an amp like the VJ all the volume controls and master volume controls are before the final power tube, so all you get by doing so is control over the first 2 gain stages of the 12ax7, the el84 still runs flate out in single ended class A mode. Throwing a tubescreamer type machine on the front end does not control the tube distortion of the el84 output tube... so you can turn down your volume control on the amp and distort the incomming signal but the second gain stage of the 12ax7 is turned down and the el84 is uneffected; so hence pointless. Only 2 ways to controll the el84, one is by an attenuator like a rat shack control you can build, webber minimass or a hotplate type of thingy..but that changes tone. The other way is by controlling the voltage within the amp; like Layboomo said use the VVR circuit which doesn't change tone. Guys really need to start some serious reading that all of us had to do at one point in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlekenny Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 thanks eraser, i'm pretty new to having tube amps so i just wanted to check before i tried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eracer_Team Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 No problems LK, between this site and the sewatt.com site everything and I mean everything has been tried and asked on the little VJ's. There's been more than one person that has smoked resistors because they wouldn't slow down... Just remember: Tongues and fingers do not make good temperature/voltage probes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Lister Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 When you're right , you're right.... I've got to hand it to you guys (m-theory, wpkg, layboomo, and just about everyone else) -- did a multimeter test on my vol. pot, tested bad, swapped in a new dimarzio I had and wahlah. Sincere THANK YOU for your straight on advice! :- Didn't mean to mislead anyone at all with my earlier comment..., I was just reporting the result that I was having with my LP volume control and Jr. up high. Hit every BLUE NOTE baaaby... I'm going to play on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wpkg Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 It doesn't do anything when the volume is cranked. It only comes into play at volumes below that' date=' and it should only affect the tone by sending some highs directly to output when the volume is cut back. It shouldn't affect lows at all. It's possible that you're interpreting the increased highs as a loss of lows. Either that, or something's not right with either the cap itself or the way it's mounted. It should be .001uf (this is the most common, but there are no steadfast rules about value, really), and should be soldered between the wiper and non-grounded lugs of the volume pot. Also, check the value of the pot. It should read pretty close to 500k for HB. Most modern pots aren't even close. [/quote'] the cap was .001, HUmbuckers, and the pot read close to 500k as I recall. there was most definately a difference in tone even with the pot wide open, which is why I decided against it. I did hear a difference sweeping the volume pot back and forth, and these were good and predictable changes, but with volume full on I heard a difference when I took the cap in and out. tried two caps as well... I did however aligator clip them in and out...could the length of wire in the clips have added enough resistance to take out some bass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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