Bluemoon Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Where do you think these embryos came from' date=' Bluemoon? [/quote'] I know where they come from. My wife and i went through IVF. They give the woman drugs to artificially inflate egg production. They then remove them. Mix them with the guy's sperm and then usually implant the best two or three fertilized eggs. They then free the remaining eggs--which could range from around 5 to 15. If they pregnancy is successful, they store those eggs for you for $1000 a year. Most people have them destroyed after a year or so. There are millions of eggs that are destroyed each year. What is better--destroy them or use them to help find cures to some of these diseases? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosewoody Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 James Allen said: "YOu have a current administration who feels it is necessary to take a bigger portion of your pay to give to the "greater good." That means that the US government is about to sanction fascism." I think fascism is better defined as a willingness to torture, to hold without trial, to secretly wiretap citizens, to embrace no-bid defense contracts, to employ wildcard private security firms such as Blackwater, to seize and exploit public assets for private gain, to invade Terri Schiavo's family privacy, to embrace secrecy as a government policy, to lie repeatedly to the public; these just off the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarmann199 Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 rosewoody +1 well said imo stem cell reserch is great! i think it comes down to when you consider a human alive. i dont consider it alive until it gets a heart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homz Posted March 7, 2009 Author Share Posted March 7, 2009 James Allen said: "YOu have a current administration who feels it is necessary to take a bigger portion of your pay to give to the "greater good." That means that the US government is about to sanction fascism." I think fascism is better defined as a willingness to torture' date=' to hold without trial, to secretly wiretap citizens, to embrace no-bid defense contracts, to employ wildcard private security firms such as Blackwater, to seize and exploit public assets for private gain, to invade Terri Schiavo's family privacy, to embrace secrecy as a government policy, to lie repeatedly to the public; these just off the top.[/quote'] They crucified jesus for that kind of heresy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosewoody Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 The country's been on a cross for the last eight years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notes_Norton Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Here is my take. 1) Millions of embryos are discarded in fertility clinics every year, what is immoral about using them for research or tossing them in the trash? At that point, they are not people yet anyway, but a clump of cells with no definition. Sure there is a potential for them to become a human life. But how far are you going to go back? Is masturbation murder because in each sperm cell there is a potential for human life? 2) There are people with Parkinson's (mother-in-law), heart problems, and other diseases that could possibly be cured by stem cell research. Perhaps they can fix the thyroid of someone I love, or fix the ears of musicians who played loud music all their lives for the enjoyment of others. 3) If we in the US don't do it, others will and that will simply be one more thing that the US will fall behind on. There was a local pastor with heart failure right here in St. Lucie County Florida. He was given a short term to live, so he went to Asia to get stem cells injected in his heart. He is calling it a miracle from God. BTW, he is still against stem cell research (in my book that makes him a hypocrite - do as I say, not as I do). Religious freedom is something I respect and love about the American way. However, freedom of religion implies freedom FROM religion (more specifically freedom from other people's religion). There are religions that follow rules like: it is a sin to dance ... it is a sin to to sing ... it is a sin to to play music (eek!) ... it is a sin to to wear any clothing that is any color but black or white ... it is a sin to to ride in a car ... it is a sin to take a photograph or have a photograph taken ... it is a sin to have sex with your spouse unless you are trying to have a baby ... it is a sin to to use electricity ... it is a sin to use modern conveniences like cell phones, televisions, etc. ... it is a sin to go to the movies ... it is a sin to to eat certain food combinations ... it is a sin to to use antibiotics or surgery (when I was young, I had a neighbor who died from a ruptured appendix because it was a "sin" to go to the doctor) ... it is a sin to to kill anything, even an insect so the strict Jainists cover their mouth with gauze they don't accidentally kill a gnat and dust the ground with a peacock feather so they don't unintentionally crush one ... etc. Now if your religion says it is a sin to to dance, or a sin to to use stem cell technology, that's fine, you are allowed to make your choice according to your belief system. But you have no right to deny others to take advantage of something that isn't against their religion. That violates freedom of religion. And what I really find contradictory about it is this. There are religious people who side with Bush believing that using a zygote that would have been discarded in a fertility clinic for research is murder. On the other hand they applaud Bush for staring a needless and illegal way by bearing false witness against his neighbor (there were no WMDs in Iraq and he knew it), and that has resulted in the deaths of over 100,000 men, women and children. Does this make sense? Is that zygote more sacred than the mothers, fathers, sons and daughters that have been slaughtered for no reason at all? So in retrospect, I'm all for using the embryos that would have been discarded for stem cell research. And if you find it against your religion, you don't have to accept them (although like the pastor, if they were going to save your life, you might change your mind). Insights and incites by Notes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T50 Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Stem cell research is a very important part of medical research. It can open endless possibilities for cures not yet found. Would be great if they find a cure for cerebral palsy. My little boy has it. Perhaps then he could play my guitars some day. I hope that will happen for your boy soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T50 Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Stem cell research will open doors to many currently incurable diseases. And for those who oppose to this, I sincerely hope they catch those diseases soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mick Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 They crucified jesus for that kind of heresy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSG_Standard Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 James Allen said: "YOu have a current administration who feels it is necessary to take a bigger portion of your pay to give to the "greater good." That means that the US government is about to sanction fascism." I think fascism is better defined as a willingness to torture' date=' to hold without trial, to secretly wiretap citizens, to embrace no-bid defense contracts, to employ wildcard private security firms such as Blackwater, to seize and exploit public assets for private gain, to invade Terri Schiavo's family privacy, to embrace secrecy as a government policy, to lie repeatedly to the public; these just off the top.[/quote'] What a liberal dumbazz you are rosewoofy, Your definition of fascism is INCORRECT. If you were going to look for an American president that fit your definition of facism, a much closer fit would be FDR, who illegally imprisoned Japanese Americans during WWII, illegally wiretapped US citizens, intercepted US mail illegally, etc. Or another example of a US President that fits "your" description, would be Woodrow Wilson, who illegally detained newspaper reporters for trying to write the truth about the Spanish Flu during WWI. Another close fit, might be LBJ who authorized the illegal wire tapping of Martin Luther King...or was that JFK? How about Billary Clinton, the guy that used the IRS as a weapon against his political enemies, and who illegally bombed a soverign Eropean country, against the wishes of his own congress and against the wishes of the UN. You libs/socialists/progressives are the real danger in the world. "It isn't that liberals are ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so" - Ronald Reagan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homz Posted March 7, 2009 Author Share Posted March 7, 2009 KSG the more you talk the less you say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSG_Standard Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Let's say for the sake of argument, that scientists find a cure for Cancer, and that "cure" involves human Embryonic stem cells. What do you baby killers propose? We'll soon run out of frozen stem cells and we'll have to have another source. Do we start creating embryos to be used for the cancer cure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluemoon Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 What a liberal dumbazz you are rosewoofy' date=' Your definition of fascism is INCORRECT. If you were going to look for an American president that fit your definition of facism, a much closer fit would be FDR, who illegally imprisoned Japanese Americans during WWII, illegally wiretapped US citizens, intercepted US mail illegally, etc.[/quote'] What I love about you KSG is how you undermine your own arguments with the insults. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSG_Standard Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 What I love about you moonie, is your passive agressive nature. You can't reason with a liberal, so it's more fun to use insults. Here's another one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wicked1 Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Let's say for the sake of argument' date=' that scientists find a cure for Cancer, and that "cure" involves human Embryonic stem cells. What do you baby killers propose? We'll soon run out of frozen stem cells and we'll have to have another source. Do we start creating embryos to be used for the cancer cure? [/quote'] Did you miss the part about how once you've got the stem cells, they will continue to divide and provide for a LINE of cells?? When properly cultivated, cell lines can go on for a long time. It is an embryo--not a baby. It's not even a potential baby when it is sitting in a freezer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSG_Standard Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Did you miss the part about how once you've got the stem cells' date=' they will continue to divide and provide for a LINE of cells?? When properly cultivated, cell lines can go on for a long time. It is an embryo--not a baby. It's not even a potential baby when it is sitting in a freezer. [/quote'] I didn't miss anything... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homz Posted March 7, 2009 Author Share Posted March 7, 2009 I have to go along with KSG on this one. He doesn't miss much he just doesn't allow his conscious mind the freedom to consider it honestly. Self deprecating hypocrisy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosewoody Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 What a liberal dumbazz you are rosewoofy' date=' Your definition of fascism is INCORRECT. If you were going to look for an American president that fit your definition of facism, a much closer fit would be FDR, who illegally imprisoned Japanese Americans during WWII, illegally wiretapped US citizens, intercepted US mail illegally, etc. Or another example of a US President that fits "your" description, would be Woodrow Wilson, who illegally detained newspaper reporters for trying to write the truth about the Spanish Flu during WWI. Another close fit, might be LBJ who authorized the illegal wire tapping of Martin Luther King...or was that JFK? How about Billary Clinton, the guy that used the IRS as a weapon against his political enemies, and who illegally bombed a soverign Eropean country, against the wishes of his own congress and against the wishes of the UN. You libs/socialists/progressives are the real danger in the world. [/color'] My point is that it is silly--infantile really--to equate advocating a tax increase in support of the greater good with fascism. There are other, more telling features of what most people would call fascism. I listed some. You listed others. The difference between us is that if someone you don't like did something, it must be OK for someone you like to do it. In other words, you can't (or don't) argue logically, so you make excuses for behavior, then insult the person who made the argument you can't follow. Better to take a community college course in Logic and return to the fray when you've learned how to think with more rigour. Of course, at that time you will have become more liberal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSG_Standard Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 What a liberal dumbazz you are rosewoofy' date=' Your definition of fascism is INCORRECT. If you were going to look for an American president that fit your definition of facism, a much closer fit would be FDR, who illegally imprisoned Japanese Americans during WWII, illegally wiretapped US citizens, intercepted US mail illegally, etc. Or another example of a US President that fits "your" description, would be Woodrow Wilson, who illegally detained newspaper reporters for trying to write the truth about the Spanish Flu during WWI. Another close fit, might be LBJ who authorized the illegal wire tapping of Martin Luther King...or was that JFK? How about Billary Clinton, the guy that used the IRS as a weapon against his political enemies, and who illegally bombed a soverign Eropean country, against the wishes of his own congress and against the wishes of the UN. You libs/socialists/progressives are the real danger in the world. My point is that it is silly--infantile really--to equate advocating a tax increase in support of the greater good with fascism. There are other, more telling features of what most people would call fascism. I listed some. You listed others. The difference between us is that if someone you don't like did something, it must be OK for someone you like to do it. In other words, you can't (or don't) argue logically, so you make excuses for behavior, then insult the person who made the argument you can't follow. Better to take a community college course in Logic and return to the fray when you've learned how to think with more rigour. Of course, at that time you will have become more liberal. [/quote'] Maybe you should stay in junior college another couple of years there, rosie...I didn't say that because your liberal heroes did bad things , that it was okay for other presidents to do bad things. Maybe you could take a remedial reading course? My point was that you libs pretend that Bush did THE MOST terrible things while he was in office and that he was a Fascist. When in point of fact, Bush did the same or less evil things as President that your liberal idols did. In spite of the history that's available for you to learn from, you seem incapable of learning anything. My logic seems fine, yours however is suspect. So, blow it out your azz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wicked1 Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 I guess if you didn't miss anything, then your ability to jump from A to "green" is so adept that us lesser mortals find the train of thought nigh on impossible to follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homz Posted March 7, 2009 Author Share Posted March 7, 2009 Fair warning KSG. She'll chew you up and spit you out. You really don't want to go there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosewoody Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 So, KSGenius, Obama wants to increase taxes, is therefore a Fascist. And you will agree, then, that FDR, Wilson, Clinton, LBJ, and Dubya are all Fascists, based on what they did. So, it looks like a long line of Fascists have been running the country. Jefferson, Lincoln, TR, on and on (they did some unsavory things as well). Maybe Obama doesn't look so bad. Or maybe it is just stupid to call our new president a Fascist, which is my main point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSG_Standard Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Spoonz and Mrs. Spoonz, I don't care if you and your other liberal comrades can follow my logic, or any other logic...It's a well known fact amongst you liberal elites, that you are correct and us poor, uneducated, superstitious, selfish, "right wing fascists" are wrong. So, I'll just continue to enjoy what I'm doing...thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homz Posted March 7, 2009 Author Share Posted March 7, 2009 Spoonz and Mrs. Spoonz' date=' I don't care if you and your other liberal comrades can follow my logic, or any other logic...It's a well known fact amongst you liberal elites, that you are correct and us poor, uneducated, superstitious, selfish, "right wing fascists" are wrong. So, I'll just continue to enjoy what I'm doing...thanks! [/quote'] Ignorance is bliss. Brother you are the most content I've seen in a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosewoody Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Spoonz and Mrs. Spoonz' date=' I don't care if you and your other liberal comrades can follow my logic, or any other logic...It's a well known fact amongst you liberal elites, that you are correct and us poor, uneducated, superstitious, selfish, "right wing fascists" are wrong. So, I'll just continue to enjoy what I'm doing...thanks! [/quote'] All is well...continue to enjoy being poor, uneducated, superstitious, selfish, and fascistic.....just don't stop taking your meds. You become unpleasant as well as boorish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.