Murph Posted July 6, 2022 Share Posted July 6, 2022 On 7/5/2022 at 2:51 PM, Larsongs said: I remember a Steve Martin quote, Something like; How YOU too can become a MILLIONAIRE!!!! First… get $1 million dollars then………… Actually, he said you could be a millionaire and "not pay taxes..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted July 6, 2022 Share Posted July 6, 2022 3 hours ago, Murph said: Actually, he said you could be a millionaire and "not pay taxes..." Right! LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
differentsky Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 I think the increase of price tags from the big brands is partly due to the rise of the vintage market too. When guitars from the 50s or early 60s can reach 20k at least -and being considered as "the real thing" - it kind of allows you to raise the prices for current production. It allows for a new business plan. 4k for a Gibson, Martin, or CS Fender is still a lot more affordable compared to 20k. The other thing is that hard-working musicians is a minority group, I think the big brands sell more guitars to non-professional musicians. So we're not the main target. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 3 hours ago, differentsky said: I think the increase of price tags from the big brands is partly due to the rise of the vintage market too. When guitars from the 50s or early 60s can reach 20k at least -and being considered as "the real thing" - it kind of allows you to raise the prices for current production. I think this has merit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinder Posted July 7, 2022 Author Share Posted July 7, 2022 Very interesting thoughts, thanks all. I agree that there are good instruments out there that are pro quality but aren’t Gibsons/Martins/Collings etc. I’ve played some very impressive offerings from Eastman, Sigma and others. 99% of the time I could turn up with any of those guitars and get the job done just fine. Session work is the outlier here…generally (in the UK at least), the pickers with the recognisable/desirable kit get the work. I’ve had clients flat-out reject certain guitars because of brand prejudice. I owned a fantastic Duolian style steel bodied resonator made by Michael Messer which sounded like weeping angels…I was asked to play some slide on an Americana project and turned up with the Messer expecting to wow the clients with its beautiful tone, but they rejected it before I played a note because it wasn’t a National or Dobro. I’ve had my SJ200 turned down for not being a D18, and even my old D18 Golden Era (which sounded incredible) turned down for not being a D28. The music industry is certainly in a weird spot at the moment. It’s hard to imagine someone who works in the automotive sector walking into a tool store to buy a ratchet, only to be told “These are the professional level ratchets that only amateur mechanics can afford. As a professional mechanic, what you need is one of our amateur level ratchets over here…” It’s all cyclical though. Eventually it will level out. In the meantime, secondhand Bozeman era Gibsons continue to be just about the best buy out there, in my opinion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 Interestingly disappointing to hear 'producers' having that much bias. One thing we all here seem to agree on is "You have to hear it before you ...." Their loss long term - you loss short term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 28 minutes ago, Jinder said: Session work is the outlier here…generally (in the UK at least), the pickers with the recognisable/desirable kit get the work. I’ve had clients flat-out reject certain guitars because of brand prejudice. I owned a fantastic Duolian style steel bodied resonator made by Michael Messer which sounded like weeping angels…I was asked to play some slide on an Americana project and turned up with the Messer expecting to wow the clients with its beautiful tone, but they rejected it before I played a note because it wasn’t a National or Dobro. Their loss. Americana is supposed to sound folky. The real stuff was recorded with whatever they had at the time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jinder Posted July 7, 2022 Author Share Posted July 7, 2022 3 hours ago, fortyearspickn said: Interestingly disappointing to hear 'producers' having that much bias. One thing we all here seem to agree on is "You have to hear it before you ...." Their loss long term - you loss short term. In my experience it’s more the artists than the producers that tend to be sticklers-most producers will think with ears before eyes but it’s usually the artists who have a predisposition towards certain brands and models…the producers are usually the ones rolling their eyes and mouthing “sorry!” 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 (edited) Bias towards one brand or another. Is that anyone on this site. I'm guilty are you? Music throughout the years have been recorded with the finest Stratavarious violin's and Steinway Grand Piano's to Silvertones, and every possible brand in between. What someone wants, is what someone wants, especially when they are paying for it, and paying a musician to play it. If they have an issue with it they should have the guitar they want you to recorded with in the studio or ask if you have what they want before they bring you down to the studio and waste both peoples time. Not many of us are Vince Gill or Rick Nielsen with an endless guitar collections. Edited July 7, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 22 hours ago, Jinder said: The music industry is certainly in a weird spot at the moment. Understatement of the year. Indeed, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwlsky Posted July 12, 2022 Share Posted July 12, 2022 On 7/7/2022 at 9:48 AM, Jinder said: In the meantime, secondhand Bozeman era Gibsons continue to be just about the best buy out there, in my opinion. I completely agree. With the used Gibsons I bought I always had a Cheshire Cat grin getting a better sounding/broken-in guitar for less money. Finding an excellent condition secondhand guitar is not hard to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boyd Posted July 12, 2022 Share Posted July 12, 2022 On 7/4/2022 at 8:21 AM, Boyd said: I also see predictions that the dollar and euro will reach parity by the end of the summer. Well that was quick. Euro-Dollar parity has arrived. Now the talk seems centered around whether Pound-Dollar parity could even happen later this year. 😱 https://www.cnbc.com/2022/07/12/euro-teeters-on-the-brink-of-parity-with-the-us-dollar-on-recession-fears.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 12, 2022 Share Posted July 12, 2022 (edited) Prices on hot dogs to lumber to bales of hay to USA made guitar are going, and have been going up since this new illness came to fruition, but most peoples wages are not. So when is that magic I gotta have it USA made guitar you lust after finally going to be out of your reach, or is it already? You either have the cash for it, or you gotta save for it, or you get it as a present, or you steal it. Its about the only options we got. Complaining about it isn't gonna make anyone lower their prices. Maybe Sleepy Joe will pass an Executive Order and make manufactures lower guitar prices. No that's not the Blue Teams agenda. They are worried more about giving rights to guys who play dress up as girls, to beat them at a sport they can't beat their birth gender at. Edited July 12, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhanners623 Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 10 hours ago, Sgt. Pepper said: Prices on hot dogs to lumber to bales of hay to USA made guitar are going, and have been going up since this new illness came to fruition, but most peoples wages are not. So when is that magic I gotta have it USA made guitar you lust after finally going to be out of your reach, or is it already? You either have the cash for it, or you gotta save for it, or you get it as a present, or you steal it. Its about the only options we got. Complaining about it isn't gonna make anyone lower their prices. Maybe Sleepy Joe will pass an Executive Order and make manufactures lower guitar prices. No that's not the Blue Teams agenda. They are worried more about giving rights to guys who play dress up as girls, to beat them at a sport they can't beat their birth gender at. And all of that nonsensical screed has exactly what to do with guitar prices? I’m trying to follow the “logic” there…. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 (edited) 7 hours ago, dhanners623 said: And all of that nonsensical screed has exactly what to do with guitar prices? I’m trying to follow the “logic” there…. It means prices are going up and up and up, and you and me, and complaining about it will do nothing to change it. Is that simple enough for you? Some of us want guitars, and some like Jinder who gig and do studio work NEED them, cause they are a musicians tools. When will they be so expensive they are out of reach for guys who NEED them not WANT them. Edited July 13, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhanners623 Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 16 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said: It means prices are going up and up and up, and you and me, and complaining about it will do nothing to change it. Is that simple enough for you? Some of us want guitars, and some like Jinder who gig and do studio work NEED them, cause they are a musicians tools. When will they be so expensive they are out of reach for guys who NEED them not WANT them. Uh, there was much in your post that had absolutely nothing to do with the price of guitars or any other good or service. Admirable attempt at deflection, though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 5 minutes ago, dhanners623 said: Uh, there was much in your post that had absolutely nothing to do with the price of guitars or any other good or service. Admirable attempt at deflection, though. My wife says I am a master of deflection during our conversations, so its par for the course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RvrDxn Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 8 hours ago, dhanners623 said: And all of that nonsensical screed has exactly what to do with guitar prices? I’m trying to follow the “logic” there…. You come across as awfully entitled. Do you always feel like someone owes you an explanation when they make a post that isn’t up to your standards? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhanners623 Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 Just now, RvrDxn said: You come across as awfully entitled. Do you always feel like someone owes you an explanation when they make a post that isn’t up to your standards? As per an earlier post replying to you, give it a rest, bro. It’s not about you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 3 minutes ago, dhanners623 said: It’s not about you. My wife says that to me all the time and I tell her it is all about me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cabarone Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 On 7/4/2022 at 11:34 AM, Sgt. Pepper said: If you want the real truth - Gibson probably doesn't care. They know there are people with enough money to buy their guitars, and if you can't, another person will. Gibson are still here, and almost went under a few times, but didn't like Guitar Center, still around. As a thanks for keeping them around they will build guitars you want at prices you can't afford. End of story. I had to double check this; thought you were talking about Harley-Davison... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 2 minutes ago, Cabarone said: I had to double check this; thought you were talking about Harley-Davison... I'm not a motorcycle guy, so are their prices above and beyond what a normal motorcycle enthusiast can afford? Not someone in a MC that has to have a HD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhanners623 Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 What guitar (or motorcycle, or anything else) someone “needs” is a matter of what the person can afford — and it always has been. I dare say talented folks like Jinder will always be able to afford a decent guitar, and will make great music with whatever he has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. Pepper Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 (edited) 25 minutes ago, dhanners623 said: What guitar (or motorcycle, or anything else) someone “needs” is a matter of what the person can afford — and it always has been. I dare say talented folks like Jinder will always be able to afford a decent guitar, and will make great music with whatever he has. Right, but according to Jinder sometimes he didn't get the job due to not having a certain model guitar at the session. So in that instance he NEEDED a certain guitar, or he was told he was not needed for the session, weather he can afford one or not. Edited July 13, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhanners623 Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 5 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said: Right, but according to Jinder sometimes he didn't get the job due to not having a certain model guitar at the session. So in that instance he NEEDED a certain guitar, or he was told he was not needed for the session, weather he can afford one or not. Yeah, I read that part of his post, too. So where does it end? Say the producer in question wants the sound of a pre-war Martin. Is Jinder supposed to run out and buy one for the session? I’m sure he’d like to be able to do that, but it’s not a realistic expectation. I’d be interested to know — in the sessions Jinder didn’t get because he had the “wrong” guitar, who wound up replacing him, and what guitar did he/she use? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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