Fearomoon Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 Hi @all I bought a new Gibson Les Paul Classic with Burstbucker 61 pickups. This is my first Les Paul and I haven't played guitar in 20 years and just started playing again. My problem is the height of the pickups. Since I haven't had a Les Paul yet, I can't rely on my hearing as to what the Burstbucker 61's sweet spot is. Can you tell me what the optimal height of the pickups would be in mm? Unfortunately, I can't get along with the inches. I don't want to start a big discussion, just usable dimensions would be nice because the factory dimensions sounded horrible, at least that's what I can judge 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 take a look at this first link to PU height thread Also, Gibson pickups sound different. Burstbuckers, 490s and 57 Classics all have a unique sound. Good luck. Post back if you make any progress (or are still struggling). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 12, 2023 Author Share Posted March 12, 2023 This is so confusing… both Pickups on high e side 1.6 and low e to 2.4mm… right? And then start tweaking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveFord Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 https://www.gibson.com/en-US/GibsonTV/gibsons-guide-to-guitar-setup-and-maintenance/how-to-adjust-the-height-of-your-guitar-pickups Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 12, 2023 Author Share Posted March 12, 2023 9 minutes ago, SteveFord said: https://www.gibson.com/en-US/GibsonTV/gibsons-guide-to-guitar-setup-and-maintenance/how-to-adjust-the-height-of-your-guitar-pickups I know the video but I am explicitly concerned with a setting for the Burstbucker 61 in my Classic and not with a general setting or mediocrity. in the video it's all rather general what applies to all Gibson pickups but as was said above all pickups are different. I'm just looking for info from someone who has found a great setting with a sweet spot and can tell me what their dimensions are and I can test it to see if it suits me because I have no experience with Gibson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted March 12, 2023 Share Posted March 12, 2023 (edited) Hello I have found that setting the neck pickup flush with the pickup surround and putting the bridge pickup 2-3mm higher works for me. This should get the volumes roughly equal. And I usually keep the pickups flat, i.e. treble strings side NOT higher than the bass. This is on an ES-139 which has burstbuckers. YMMV. Edited March 12, 2023 by jdgm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 13, 2023 Author Share Posted March 13, 2023 Things I tried so far: Jim DeColas setting: Bridge e 1,2mm E 1,6mm Neck e 1,6mm E 2,0mm Conslusion: To general and sounded way to bassy and muddy Local Luthiers Setting: Bridge & Neck both down to Pickup surround, Neck slightly deeper. (He said modern Pickups don't need to be under the Strings) Conslusion: Nothing I imagine the sound of a Gibson to be like. Sounds quiet and soulless. Settings from second Post: Bridge e 1,6mm E 2,4mm Neck e 1,6mm E 2,4mm Conclusion: The highs are much too high (almost screaming), hardly any mids, bass is sometimes too boomy and muddy What I have read in the few posts on the net regarding the Burstbucker 61 and also had to realize for myself is that these pickups react much more sensitively to changes than other Gibson pickups (according to the reports), a quarter turn changes the response and the tone very much . Btw. I'm using D'Addario NYXL 10-46 Strings and Marshall DSL & Boss Katana MK2 and I play Blues/Rock/Metal if that plays any role for the setup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eracer_Team Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 Actually don’t think there’s any ‘ magic’ setting in your first post you said you can’t rely on your hearing yet in your last post appears you are. so where do you go from here? lower the pickups use the pole screws (raise/lower) to get the note definition you’re looking for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 13, 2023 Author Share Posted March 13, 2023 I said I can't rely on my hearing for how a Gibson is supposed to sound. Of course I can say what totally sounds like crap 😂 And now I've had so much screwing back and forth behind me that I can no longer say whether it's better or not. 🤯 I found a post in the My Les Paul forum where the thread creator posted audio files for the pickups, how it shouldn't sound, how it sounds with the standard setting and then how it sounds in his personal top setting. Unfortunately, the audio files no longer work because the post is quite old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted March 13, 2023 Share Posted March 13, 2023 I don't think anyone can authoritatively say how a Gibson is supposed to sound. I think it best to simply be guided by your ears. Probably jdgm has the informed advice, because he has Burstbuckers. I had imagined that BBs were better suited to the genres you cited. Looks like I'm wrong. If you cant achieve a usable sound no matter how you adjust the PUs, you might just not get on with BBs? I will confess I tried out a LP Standard with BBs, for about 45minutes, alternately using Orange and Marshall amps in 2 demo rooms. I used every combination of amp & guitar controls & could not get a usable sound out of it. Mind you, I was only using clean settings the whole time. They didn't suit me for cleans, which is why I thought they would probably be more effective with gain. If all else fails: try out, if at all possible, some LPs with different PUs onboard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IanHenry Posted March 14, 2023 Share Posted March 14, 2023 On 3/12/2023 at 8:28 PM, jdgm said: Hello I have found that setting the neck pickup flush with the pickup surround and putting the bridge pickup 2-3mm higher works for me. This should get the volumes roughly equal. And I usually keep the pickups flat, i.e. treble strings side NOT higher than the bass. This is on an ES-139 which has burstbuckers. YMMV. Jdgm's recommendation should get you in the right ballpark, after that use your ears. Throbak pickups also do a very good guide on YouTube that's well worth a look: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted March 14, 2023 Share Posted March 14, 2023 On 3/12/2023 at 10:41 AM, Fearomoon said: Hi @all I bought a new Gibson Les Paul Classic with Burstbucker 61 pickups. This is my first Les Paul and I haven't played guitar in 20 years and just started playing again. My problem is the height of the pickups. Since I haven't had a Les Paul yet, I can't rely on my hearing as to what the Burstbucker 61's sweet spot is. Can you tell me what the optimal height of the pickups would be in mm? Unfortunately, I can't get along with the inches. I don't want to start a big discussion, just usable dimensions would be nice because the factory dimensions sounded horrible, at least that's what I can judge 😉 Fear not. Here's my story, and here's what you do. My LP came with 60s Burstbuckers, and I hated them the way they came set up. You probably know how to measure pickup height, but if you don't, you press down on the last fret, then measure the distance between the polepiece and the string. First off, measure the original height if you haven't already, and write it down. Then set as follows: on the bass side: 4 mm. Yes, really. On the treble side: 3 mm. Same on both pickups. You might need to raise the high E polepiece a little on one or both pickups. Just a touch. The distance might sound like it's too much, but... No. That's the sweet spot for me. No prizes for guessing it took a loooong time to find it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted March 14, 2023 Share Posted March 14, 2023 On 3/13/2023 at 9:52 AM, Fearomoon said: What I have read in the few posts on the net regarding the Burstbucker 61 and also had to realize for myself is that these pickups react much more sensitively to changes than other Gibson pickups (according to the reports), a quarter turn changes the response and the tone very much. Very much so. It took me forever to find the creamy mids spot (see above). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 14, 2023 Author Share Posted March 14, 2023 3 minutes ago, Pinch said: Fear not. Here's my story, and here's what you do. My LP came with 60s Burstbuckers, and I hated them the way they came set up. You probably know how to measure pickup height, but if you don't, you press down on the last fret, then measure the distance between the polepiece and the string. First off, measure the original height if you haven't already, and write it down. Then set as follows: on the bass side: 4 mm. Yes, really. On the treble side: 3 mm. Same on both pickups. You might need to raise the high E polepiece a little on one or both pickups. Just a touch. The distance might sound like it's too much, but... No. That's the sweet spot for me. No prizes for guessing it took a loooong time to find it. Unfortunately I missed to measure the original height and no one can tell me how original height was….did you write it down?! I’ll try that… local Lucier told me today that the 60s had to be very far away from the strings… that agrees with your statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted March 14, 2023 Share Posted March 14, 2023 Just now, Fearomoon said: Unfortunately I missed to measure the original height and no one can tell me how original height was….did you write it down?! I’ll try that… local Lucier told me today that the 60s had to be very far away from the strings… that agrees with your statement. Ah, it's more of a general rule and I think I forgot to do it myself 😄 Yeah, it was weird setting them up. Not only do they respond like crazy to a quarter of a turn, but you think, 4 and 3 mm, surely not? But, actually, yes. Any lower, you lose some of the sweet mids, and any higher, they get a little too boomy for me, or whatever it was. It took days, but now I wouldn't swap them for anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 14, 2023 Author Share Posted March 14, 2023 Exactly what I said, they react massively to the smallest changes and I'm sure or wished that they just had to be good... boomy was exactly my problem... I screwed up and down and it all sounded crap but the idea was like that I didn't get to screw down that far... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 14, 2023 Author Share Posted March 14, 2023 19 minutes ago, Pinch said: You might need to raise the high E polepiece a little on one or both pickups. Just a touch. What do you mean by that? Quarter Turn? Half Turn? Full turn? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted March 14, 2023 Share Posted March 14, 2023 Just now, Fearomoon said: Exactly what I said, they react massively to the smallest changes and I'm sure or wished that they just had to be good... boomy was exactly my problem... I screwed up and down and it all sounded crap but the idea was like that I didn't get to screw down that far... Don't worry, you'll get them to sound great and very, very Les Paul-y. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted March 14, 2023 Share Posted March 14, 2023 Just now, Fearomoon said: What do you mean by that? Quarter Turn? Half Turn? Full turn? You'd need something like a DAW to measure the output level. I just raised the high E polepiece on the neck pup 1/8 of a turn. Chances are you won't have to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 14, 2023 Author Share Posted March 14, 2023 luckily I haven't rearranged the pole pieces yet...this time I'll remember how they were...silly not to write it down 💩 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted March 14, 2023 Share Posted March 14, 2023 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Fearomoon said: luckily I haven't rearranged the pole pieces yet...this time I'll remember how they were...silly not to write it down 💩 I found they were fairly even in output level from the factory, even after my drastic height adjustments, so you probably won't have to worry about that bit at all. The settings above are for a Standard with no weight relief - I've no idea if the weight relief of the Classic changes anything there, but probably not. You'll get to THAT tone soon enough! Edited March 14, 2023 by Pinch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 14, 2023 Author Share Posted March 14, 2023 I don't think that a bit of weight relief makes a difference... think rather the ultra modern weight relief of a studio would be more noticeable... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted March 14, 2023 Share Posted March 14, 2023 Just now, Fearomoon said: I don't think that a bit of weight relief makes a difference... think rather the ultra modern weight relief of a studio would be more noticeable... Same. Anyway, try them very low like above and see what you think 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearomoon Posted March 15, 2023 Author Share Posted March 15, 2023 holy ****... that's exactly the tone i was looking for... thank you for that! I've always tried between 1.6 and 2.4... I would never have gone that low. I would not have come up with the idea. I would have probably swapped the pickups. now it just sounds awesome. 🤩 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinch Posted March 15, 2023 Share Posted March 15, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Fearomoon said: holy ****... that's exactly the tone i was looking for... thank you for that! I've always tried between 1.6 and 2.4... I would never have gone that low. I would not have come up with the idea. I would have probably swapped the pickups. now it just sounds awesome. 🤩 I know, right? 4 and 3 mm sounds ludicrous but really, that's where THAT tone is with those pickups, for me at least (and you, apparently). I kept going back and forth thinking, this CAN'T be right. I'm losing it. But no. It's really strange because you'd think you'd lose something crucial at that height, but it's the opposite - that's where the fullest sound is with those pickups. They don't even sound like the same pickups! Crazy. I've never encountered anything like that with any other pickup. But, there you go. Happy I could help. Enjoy your guitar 🙂 Edited March 15, 2023 by Pinch 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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