ksdaddy Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Both of my daughters go to college and they are home for the summer. The oldest WAS working and the business closed several months ago. She gets unemployment with a student deferral. She has a Camry, which is financed. $170 a month. The payment is her responsibility as is the insurance. She is on my policy but she is to pay me what the cost for (full) coverage is every month, about $70. Her boyfriend lives with us and works on a semi-regular basis. He does not contribute to the household expenses. However I cut him a lot of slack because he will be putting a new roof on my house this summer and does not want to be paid for his labor. I do plan to pay him however, even if it's ten bucks an hour, just to make it worth his while to some degree, in addition to the room and board he's gotten for the last 7-8 months. We have a massive behemoth of a cell phone plan that runs about $250 a month. All the bells and whistles. Smart phones, mobile hot spots, the whole deal. I have a 4 year old Motorola with no internet access. I am supposed to pay so much and she and her boyfriend are to pay the balance (we've tweaked the details so it all makes sense, although I can't quote them on command). The past two months I have made her car payment because she was broke. Ditto for the cell phone and insurance. They eat my food, use my washer and dryer, and yet I have to come home after working my admittedly overpaid and underworked government job and do the dishes and clean the cat box. I left her a note this morning and told her I was not paying her car payment next month and she needs to make arrangements to see that it gets paid. I then went on Verizons site and ascertained when each cell phone plan expires and then de-authorized her as an account manager, lest any cell phone plans get extended without my consent (there will be no consent). I'm sick of being walked on. I have enough on my plate, trying to heal from the loss of Tammie and now juggling time with two single white females, both psycho in their own way. Ginger and Mary Ann time. Don't get me started on them. I need to focus on getting MY s___ together and don't need my checkbook drained while I'm preoccupied elsewhere. Back me up here, guys. Tell me I'm doing right by being an a** hole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChanMan Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Every child is different. This is not a course I would pursue, but my kids aren't yours. My daughter makes her own way and only comes to us for help if she has exhausted all other means. My eldest son has a college fund, but at this time does not work or go to school and lives at home with us. We'd not have it any other way. My youngest son is home from college... where he attends on a mostly full scholarship. He has no job, as his job is the same as it hs been since he turned old enough to work... passing classes. Is it a financial drain? Sure. Do we sacrifice certain lifestyle things for our kids? Sure. Is it worth it to us to know our kids are here, safe and well taken care of? Sure. Are they intentionally taking advantage of us? No, I don't think so. I've told them they will spend the overwhelming majority of their lives working because they have to. I'm ok with them taking it as easy as possible while they can. Let me reiterate: ALL kids are different and need to be treated individually. If you've discussed this issue with them and gained no efforts on their part, then you gotta do what you gotta do... Good luck man, and prayers your way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Marsh Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 You are not being an a@@hole - WHile parents should be expected to help out occasionally, or in an emergency you're by no means obligated to float their collective boats. Indeed, helping too much is enabling the children to avoid responsibility they will need when you're not around to help them any longer. Just do you know you're not the Lone Ranger, my wife and I have been there and done that - refinanced a house that should have been paid off years ago to pay off auto loans we had co-signed for (so our credit remained intact knowing by experience that our sons would rather buy guitars, tattoos, computers and the like rather than pay the auto payments, etc.)and just generally pull their chestnuts out of the fire when their path becomes what they perceive to be a little tough. We finally withdrew all monetary support and guess what? They both managed to survive and, against all odds, still love us ....So don't feel bad about using a bit of tough love - I imagine you've worked all your life to get where you are as Dottie and I have and you deserve a break. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marvar Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Your kids are your responsibility, no matter how old they are, at least, IMO. But, That doesn't mean you have to support their spouse's either- and just because they are your kids, doesn't mean that you should't have a "COME TO JESUS" so to speak, talk with them. ONe on my daughters married a real loser as far as being a provider- She is welcome to move back home whenever she want's to, but, it would have to be without him- I'm not supporting a deadbeat son in law- let his own parents take care of him- they are the one's that seem to have made him that way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
This_Dying_Soul Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 There's a limit. Every parent should be willing to help out their kids when times are tough, but there comes a point where you must cut the apron strings. At one point when I was around 20, I was told to get a job and either start paying rent or move out. While my father didn't really expect me to move out, it was the best thing that ever happened to me. Reason being, is that I wanted to prove to my father I didn't need his help and would be able to find my way in life even if I have to struggle to do so. My father passed away 3 years ago, and I think I'd be having a very hard time coping if I hadn't learned to make it on my own. He would have always been there for me if I needed him, but I know if I had relied on him to bail me out every time things got tough, I would probably be lost now that he's gone. As hard as it might be, sometimes you have to take a tough love approach. Especially if the kids think they are entitle to a free ride for their entire lives. The most important thing they can learn is how to survive without their parents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveinspain Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Well I can't give any advised backed with experience as i don't have any kids but maybe you could talk with them and say, look as long as I'm paying the bills around here you guys have to clean house and that includes the cat box... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oopssorryy Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 This is all IMO, so take it for a grain of salt, so to speak. Once a kid hit's 18-20 you have to let them make their own mistakes and suffer the consequences. That's life, and you can't shelter them forever. One day they will be out on their own, and will have to be able to handle tough situations. Now I'm not saying kick them to the curb, the the steps your taking I would say are good, and have their best interest in mind. Tell them that if they have literally exhausted every other legal means of making money, they can still come to you for some help, but they are to support themselves like the adults the government says they are. Now I know not all 18-20 isn't a magic age were kids suddenly mature and understand the ways of adult life, but with a bit of tough love in the right places, every kid can learn and grow quickly enough to get out on their own or at least support themselves. Keep at what your doing, and if they really have no other way to pay (to be determined my you) then I would help them on the car/insurance for this month and this month only. The next is her responsibility as it should be. And as for the phones, if she wants 3G and wifi then she can pay for it, other wise a simple cell plan is all that's needed, and she should eventually be expected to pay for that as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpo Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Both of my daughters go to college and they are home for the summer. The oldest WAS working and the business closed several months ago. She gets unemployment with a student deferral. She has a Camry, which is financed. $170 a month. The payment is her responsibility as is the insurance. She is on my policy but she is to pay me what the cost for (full) coverage is every month, about $70. Her boyfriend lives with us and works on a semi-regular basis. He does not contribute to the household expenses. However I cut him a lot of slack because he will be putting a new roof on my house this summer and does not want to be paid for his labor. 1st off as a father of 2 adult children let me tell you 1 thing. You're getting walked on because you are a PUNK! You left her a NOTE??? You are not even Man enough to TALK to her face to face? And whats with this guy leeching off you and you allow him to live in your home??? What is a MAN doing living in your home with your Daughter? You are allowing him to leech off YOU TODAY for some promise you think will happen in the tomorrows of your Dreams!?! Man up now and throw the bum out! Give your daughter 2 weeks to get any J O B, any JOB! Take away her damn SMART phone and give here one of those freebee DUMB phones that she can use only to call up prospective jobs and her lecherous boyfriend! My god and putting this up on a Guitar forum, almost wants to Brand you and strip you of your guitar! As a matter of fact maybe you ought to put that damn guitar down and go RAISE your KIDS/young adults! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveinspain Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 1st off as a father of 2 adult children let me tell you 1 thing. You're getting walked on because you are a PUNK! You left her a NOTE??? You are not even Man enough to TALK to her face to face? And whats with this guy leeching off you and you allow him to live in your home??? What is a MAN doing living in your home with your Daughter? You are allowing him to leech off YOU TODAY for some promise you think will happen in the tomorrows of your Dreams!?! Man up now and throw the bum out! Give your daughter 2 weeks to get any J O B, any JOB! Take away her damn SMART phone and give here one of those freebee DUMB phones that she can use only to call up prospective jobs and her lecherous boyfriend! My god and putting this up on a Guitar forum, almost wants to Brand you and strip you of your guitar! As a matter of fact maybe you ought to put that damn guitar down and go RAISE your KIDS/young adults! A bit harsh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpo Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 My eldest son has a college fund, but at this time does not work or go to school and lives at home with us. Sorry but letting an adult child live at home and not work or go to school is setting your child up to become a ward of the state down the line or worse. No one should have the luxury of doing nothing. It's not good for the soul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damian Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 I was a parent.......................hmmmm......You gotta do what you gotta do.......I did, and some of my kids turned out fine, some didn't........ Hmmm.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpo Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 A bit harsh... Yes it is. When my kids were 15 and I knew they wanted to drive at 16 like their friends did I made them both take jobs and save to pay for their own insurance throughout high school. Which they did. When they hit College 1 for 4 years (BA), and 1 for 2 years (Associates), my wife and I paid for everything till they finished. Once out of schools they were given 2 month to f off and then told to get jobs and get out! It worked for me because they learned the value of a $ and the value of saving ones money for things one wants early on. It's a lesson lost in today's world of "I want to be my kids friend instead of their damn Parent"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duane v Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 KS IMO it's all good, and it's only money... I think the boyfriend moving in is a little wierd, but I'm sure you had your reasons for letting this happen.... Dont let this situation ding your relationship with your daughter, it's not worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 KS IMO it's all good, and it's only money... I think the boyfriend moving in is a little wierd, but I'm sure you had your reasons for letting this happen.... Dont let this situation ding your relationship with your daughter, it's not worth it. My thoughts exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xaj Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 KS, I absolutely understand you. However, let me give you another point of view. It may or may not help but hopefully it'll give you some other perspective. I got laid off 14 months ago and I haven't managed to get a job since. I have had small jobs with previous customers but sadly they are not as regular as I would like. Now, I don't have enough money for everything. I have made a commitment to myself that I will be able to pay the morgage to my apartment, pay all the bills (phone, cable, electricity, gas, water). I have borrowed my grand-father's car (he doesn't drive anymore) and I pay petrol for it. However, my parents have decided that they wanted to help me. I refused help saying that while I still can pay my bills, I won't ask them for anything. So instead they offered for me to have meals with them, and that does take a considerable amount of pressure on my finances. So I have lunch with them every day, and bring dinner home. I don't go out clubbing, I don't spend money I shouldn't (except on books), and even when I go out with friends (once a week), my budget is 10 euros. I have cut back drastically. I used to take a cab into the city and then back so that I was able to have a few drinks with my friends, but I decided that it was cheaper to take the car and have two drinks, a cup of coffee and a bottle of sparkling water (hey, I'm driving so I don't drink alcohol at all). This is what I have done out of necessity and some pride. My parents have always paid for everything whilst I was studying. I couldn't even get a summer job back then because my father always said that my job was to study and get graduated and that holidays were exactly that: holidays. So for a long time I was pampered, lived a great life and never knew how hard it was to pay for my things. Then I got a job, got a car, got an appartment. The car went when I got the company car, but when I got laid off, well no more car. I couldn't possibly justify buying one without a job. It just doesn't make sense to me. Borrowing my grand-father's car is just luck. But if I had to pay for it I wouldn't have it. I can't. I don't think that I can live with credit, with money I don't have, so I only live with what I have. And until I get a steady job again, I won't change this. If the job doesn't pay enough to buy a car, well, I'll take public transport. That's fine. What I mean to say is that, yes, you are doing the right thing, because you are being rational about it. Just don't forget to give your support to your daughter, who is unemployed, and simply encourage her, in a positive way to keep trying. However, having her boyfriend in the house... I'm not too sure about that. I certainly would not be benevolant to someone who does not share in the expenses. But your daughters, well they are your daughters. This will work as a lesson. If they want something they'll have to work for it. That's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milod Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 I just think every situation is different. And... as the old saying goes, kids are like elephants from my perspective. Fun to watch, but I'm glad I don't have to feed or clean up after one. Maybe when I'm a grownup - which at my age ain't likely. m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FarnsBarns Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 I have no kids but when I was 19 I was out of the house. I have had one loan of a grand from my father once in the following 15 years for 1 month while I moved and waited for return of the previous security deposit. It messed up my financial life to the extent that I still have a poor credit rating but it did me good as well! On the other hand I have done some work for both of my parents since and I charged them full whack, goes around, comes around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigKahune Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 . Step 1 - Make your limits known to your daughters and other freeloader/s. Step 2 - Make the consequences of overstepping the set limits known to your daughters and other freeloader/s. Step 3 - After making sure steps 1 and 2 have been covered, follow through with the consequences. Step 4 - This is that spot for the "last chance"; after all - late fees and defaults can be expensive; and - to think of what Tammie might have said. Step 5 - You've given plenty of warning - time for responsibility to rear it's ugly head and for your daughters to come to grips with fiscal responsibility. Pull the money tap. Scott - I wish you the best possible outcome for this dilemma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksdaddy Posted May 20, 2011 Author Share Posted May 20, 2011 Thanks for all the responses. My 'take' on bringing up my kids has always been to try and give them what they want, within reason. My oldest pointed out (when she was about 15) that she didn't like bringing her friends over because our house is small and beat to crap. I pointed out that we could live in a bigger, nicer house but she wouldn't have satellite tv, cell phones, and whatever clothes she wanted. If she has come to me in the past wanting something and I couldn't afford it, I explained why that was and what we might be able to do to change it so we could afford it. I think she's learned some pretty good lessons and she has a great ability to plan out expenses and come up with a budget. The problem is that when she gets into a financial scrape, I am right there to help out. That's my own fault. I'm daddy and I don't want my kids to walk around gut-shot, even though that's maybe exactly what they need to do. I'm going to hold my ground on the car payment and the cursed cell phone though. If need be, I'll just start slashing features until I come up with a monthly amount they can magically come up with. I haven't said much about my younger daughter. She doesn't ask for much. Yes, I bought her a $350 car last year and I do pay her insurance, which is only $40 a month because it's only liablility. But she almost never asks for a nickel other than that. I don't feel taken advantage of anyway, not like the older one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crocstar6 Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 ......And thats why i dont want kids. I see my peers in school now as total ****** bags. Not worth my time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chase1410 Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Thanks for all the responses. You seem like a good Dad KS, under alot of stress....I can guarantee your kids are not INTENTIONALLY taking advantage of you...I think they just don't know any different and this is how it's always been...If you strip everything right away there going to think you abandoned them..but if you slowly but surely start taking away the things she should be paying for..Maybe she'll understand and get the point...I can tell from the post you have a BIG heart..So how bout you talk to your kids about how you feel, like your telling us? Of course this coming from a 21 year old son...so take it for what its worth..Good luck KS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowdiddley Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Well I can't give any advised backed with experience as i don't have any kids but maybe you could talk with them and say, look as long as I'm paying the bills around here you guys have to clean house and that includes the cat box... I agree with Dave, expectations should be made clear, by you. If you haven't already done that, they aren't doing anything wrong, just being lazy. Kids do that on occassion. I say all of you should have a sit down meeting and you tell them what you expect in return for what you're doing. KS Dont let this situation ding your relationship with your daughter, it's not worth it. Smartest thing said on this subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowdiddley Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Thanks for all the responses. My 'take' on bringing up my kids has always been to try and give them what they want, within reason. My oldest pointed out (when she was about 15) that she didn't like bringing her friends over because our house is small and beat to crap. I pointed out that we could live in a bigger, nicer house but she wouldn't have satellite tv, cell phones, and whatever clothes she wanted. If she has come to me in the past wanting something and I couldn't afford it, I explained why that was and what we might be able to do to change it so we could afford it. I think she's learned some pretty good lessons and she has a great ability to plan out expenses and come up with a budget. The problem is that when she gets into a financial scrape, I am right there to help out. That's my own fault. I'm daddy and I don't want my kids to walk around gut-shot, even though that's maybe exactly what they need to do. I'm going to hold my ground on the car payment and the cursed cell phone though. If need be, I'll just start slashing features until I come up with a monthly amount they can magically come up with. I haven't said much about my younger daughter. She doesn't ask for much. Yes, I bought her a $350 car last year and I do pay her insurance, which is only $40 a month because it's only liablility. But she almost never asks for a nickel other than that. I don't feel taken advantage of anyway, not like the older one. Where do you find a $350 car? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 I don't have kids, at 42, so there is a lot I have missed to be able to say something that is "good" as far as a solution. But, you must remember how lucky you are. To be able to be a Dad is a great thing. There are a lot of dads that have children they don't get to see. Some dads don't have anything of value to offer their children, and that can be heartbreaking. I remember a time last year, when I ran out of money and had everything due, was loosing my house, and one by one the utilities were shut off. My thought was about those who are dads and have to look at thier children and wives go without, how they must feel. I didn't get to go to college, because my dad went broke and could no longer afford to support me. I'm sure it hurt him at least as much as me when that happened. Men are providers, that's what we do. When we cannot, we feel empty. Dealing with being sucked dry by your daughters is about the most beautiful thing in nature, it means you are a man and you have kiddies. One last point: the economy sucks right now, but even still, if it was good like it was a few years back, the younger generation has it a lot harder than we did when we were their age. Being able to go out into that and NOT take advantage of everybody else the way it seems it has to be for many to make it I think is the real struggle. In the meantime, I realize in your post there is a lot more between here and there that you didn't write, but I noticed no mention of the wife. I fear that isn't Tammie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksdaddy Posted May 20, 2011 Author Share Posted May 20, 2011 Where do you find a $350 car? 80 year old woman up the road who just wanted to get rid of her '93 Sable. It's like driving your couch down the road. but I noticed no mention of the wife. I fear that isn't Tammie. Tammie's gone, lost her in January. Ashes are in a blonde maple box that would have made a nice Gibson had it not been used for a more noble purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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