Rich W Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 What a timely thread for me. I’m going to order a new computer this week and have been going back and forth trying to decide between an iMac and a Dell XPS desktop. I’m a long-time Dell desktop guy, have had about dozen over the past 15 years for home and work; but, based on my notebook computer experience, I think I might go Mac this time. Rocketman, I smiled when I read about your experience with your notebooks. A few years ago I bought a loaded Dell XPS and a MacBook. Even though it cost quite a bit more, the Dell had several problems including an unrepairable design flaw with the motherboard; and I’ve since given up and passed it on to someone else. The MacBook, on the other hand, has worked flawlessly for all kinds of tasks with not even a hiccup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrosurfer1959 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Been using Macs since the early 80's... I've had a Mac Plus, Mac 7200, Mac 7600, Mac 9600, PowerBook G4, MacBook Air and i have an ipad and an iphone. I still have all of them and they still all work... More like the mid 80's or at least it was after the release date of January 24th 1984. I got my on Friday which was the 26th because I had to wait for that last paycheck. It cost $2495.00 and had a whopping 128k of memory and sadly no fan (since they thought convection cooling would be so much better)so it would get so warm the floppy disk would lock up after extended use and you would have to let it cool down or install a 3rd party fan in the handle. I still thought it was an amazing machine probably because it replaced by Kaypro2 running CPM. Your list look about like mine except I have a Apple Newton a Apple Lisa and a NeXT Cube that are also still working Being a nerd is what paid for all my gear and everything else I own so I don't take it as a negative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Let me tell you why. When I was in graduate school from 1989 to 1993 my professor had a Sun Spark Workstation (Unix-based). Yes I had to learn Unix but I got pretty good at it. In the 4 years the machine was in our lab it NEVER crashed, even with several intense simulations running on it sometimes 24 hours a day. Mind you this was 20 years ago!! When I went to NASA I got forced into using PCs. Yes I got sucked in. I hated those machines from the beginning but I just buying them even to this day. So I recently bought a Dell M6600 laptop (at a price of $7,000), which I need when I travel to various labs for extensive periods of time (need some serious horsepower). But for short trips I decided to buy a Mac Pro too (much lighter than the Dell). The Dell has several problems. I had it checked out but nothing really seemed to fix it. The latest is that my wireless mouse keeps crapping out. I just got done with Tech Support who did nothing to help me. I have two wireless mouses: a Dell and a Microsoft. Both of them don't work! So a Dell mouse won't work on a Dell computer and a Microsoft mouse won't work with a Microsoft operating system! Meanwhile my Mac has been nothing but great. I left it in sleep mode for several weeks and it still had about half of its battery life. The Mac never crashes, it's easy to work with, and I never had capability issues. My wife also has a Mac. After about 3 months of using it she called me and asked me the password because she turned it off. I told her the only "good" thing about PCs is they crash so often that you never forget your password!! I'm done. From now on it's Macs all the way... Welcome to the "It just works world" It took me a long time to see the reason, value etc.. with a Mac... Expensive, Proprietary blah blah,.... After spending 3 days trying to get pro tools to work on my PCs and having it install in 15 minutes on a Mac I became a believer. In fact I'm typing this on my new 13" Macbook Air I bought just cause I had to have it So my Mac line up is now: 27" iMac , 15" Macbook Pro with Dual SSD internal Raid 13" Macbook Air Mac Mini Ipad 1 Ipad 2 Iphone 4 I will never go back to PC in the near future and hate having to use windows 7 PC's at work.... SUCK!!!!! ( for me) I know some of you guys like it and no disrespect to you, To each their own and all that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman5293 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Delete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djroge1 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Personally I like Windows 7. However, I think Windows, Mac, and Unix/Linux are simply tools. You should use the tool that you can use comfortably to get the job done. At the middle school where I work it is about 75% Mac and we have nearly 500 computers. Most of the teachers love Macs but then again they are not IT people they are just teachers. The biggest problem I see is that they are forcing the kids to use Mac and most of the real world runs on PC. I think both systems should be taught and used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milod Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 drog... In ways I agree with you about most of the world using PCs, but having used both, frankly I think there's more to do with specific software and brand of hardware than whether it's "pc" or a Mac that nowadays isn't really a Mac anyway. To me it's most important to get across what a file system is, the difference between a program and the OS, and in general to keep the new user's head flexible rather than solidified on a surface degree of utilization. E.g., it's really nice to know how to make a stove work, but you then need to think about various recipes to cook stuff; how to fry, boil, broil and bake. A person taught only to fry and boil never comes close to being able to really use the stove for a wide variety of creative cooking. Those of us who "came over" from such as CPM or early DOS or Unix probably had a decent concept of file systems and such - and we were working with programs that lacked a consistent interface until, frankly, Microsoft put Word and Excel on the Mac and nascent Windows platforms. I feel personally that in a sense the PC world's current "I'm gonna cram a buncha temporary 'try before you buy' crap on their HDs is part of the complaint;" prior to that it was the old DOS interface as opposed to the Mac's graphic interface that was the big argument. I use computers to get things done, whether writing and processing photos for work or to "play" after work including recording some guitar practice. Either machine can do the job. It's just a lot less expensive on a relatively generic PC Windows platform. I'm not at all sure I really want Win7, but frankly I work better with an old PhotoShop on a Mac 9.x OS than any OSX platform. BTW, I wish those who claim Macs never freeze could have watched the Quark Express demo I saw in the late '80s in Memphis. Big wheels from Apple and Quark, expensive room, very expensive projection screen and ... never did get the program to work without killing the machine. That's part of why I say it's the individual machine setup for software more than anything else. m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrosurfer1959 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 I feel the need to point you Apple slaves over to the tech forum that I'm part of. http://www.overclock.net/ There's 2,000+ members on there daily that wouldn't touch a macintrash with a ten foot pole (and neither would I). If this exact same thread were posted over there the response would be about 50 or so pages of flame and death threats. In a world with billions of people finding 2000 other people that agree your right, doesn't really mean very much. After reading all your post there is a definite theme I just hope your very young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duende Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 The reason thousands of universities including high profile institutes like Oxford and Harvard use Apple Macs, is simply because they are top notch machines and believed by many academies to be the best! All the premiere sound recording courses and music departments in the U.K use Apple Macs - and these are brainy guys, not 'fan boy' lemmings etc LMAO You go to a composers' house and venture into his/her study - and there it is in the corner of the room, a trusty Apple Mac. There is a reason for this ;) By the way, all my recordings since 2006 have been done on the programme Logic Express - it is a great and very easy to use home studio Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman5293 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Delete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duende Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Are you suggesting that at some point in the future I'm going to like Apple? That's a good one man. I plan on continuing to build my own PC's that destroy an Apple computer in both performance and price. The applications I can run on my current rig would cripple an iMac. That worthless piece of junk would be slowed down so badly that it would probably freeze. LOL that post reminded me of Barry Kripke and his killer Robot that destroys the four guys' robot 'Monte' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrosurfer1959 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Are you suggesting that at some point in the future I'm going to like Apple? That's a good one man. I'm sorry but my opinion is not going to change any time soon. I plan on continuing to build my own PC's that destroy an Apple computer in both performance and price. The applications I can run on my current rig would cripple an iMac. That worthless piece of junk would be slowed down so badly that it would probably freeze. No I was not suggestion your opinion will change about you owning a mac anytime soon if ever. hopefully what you will understand is that nobody actually cares if you hate Macs because it's 100% with no personal stories or facts to make it real it's just your opinion with no intelligent data to support that , you sound like your way to arrogant to ever change any opinion even when you have been proven wrong. I was merely pointing out the interesting process and attitude that has been displayed by you ever since joining this forum. Your post are very consistent and follow a pattern that is made up of equal part Ignorance, arrogance and a massive and rather foolish disregard for information that others try to share it doesn't fit your active paradigm in your world. You clearly feel you know more than anyone else especially anyone who would try to share an opinion with you. My comment about hoping your young " Well if your young then this may be a simple phase and once you get proven wrong enough times you may actually learn something. and there would be a chance that you could become a valuable resource rather than just an annoyance on this board. If your all ready an adult then then this total lack of ability to understand even basic facts on social interaction in these types of forums will keep you just spouting your ill conceived and unsupported ideas is hopeless non ending loops of your thought. And if you can't mature then were wasting our time trying to help you learn and I'll be easier and more enjoyable again to just block all further content from you, because at least up to now you don't really add much other than strife. y Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zigzag Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Macs all around in our family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damian Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 I'm using PC because that's what I have.........When I can switch to MAC, I will............ [thumbup] .... Having said that, many pro music engineers are happy using PC, many use MAC, and quite a few run both............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenced Fred Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 I feel the need to point you Apple slaves over to the tech forum that I'm part of. http://www.overclock.net/ There's 2,000+ members on there daily that wouldn't touch a macintrash with a ten foot pole (and neither would I). If this exact same thread were posted over there the response would be about 50 or so pages of flame and death threats. LOL that post reminded me of Barry Kripke and his killer Robot that destroys the four guys' robot 'Monte' I just watched this episode last night! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest farnsbarns Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 How can this possibly be an argument? I might start a thread about blue being better than green. Edit: not aimed at anyone in particular, just anyone who us bothered by anyone else's pov. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy R Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 I feel the need to point you Apple slaves over to the tech forum that I'm part of. http://www.overclock.net/ There's 2,000+ members on there daily that wouldn't touch a macintrash with a ten foot pole (and neither would I). If this exact same thread were posted over there the response would be about 50 or so pages of flame and death threats. Tman5293, You do kinda turn into a trolling **** anytime this subject is brought up. Sorry I hate to be that way but it is the truth. No one is trying to convince you to buy a MAc or to even like them. There are also some long time IT people on here Including myself who have more than a passing knowledge of the subject of Building PC's and Tweaking... I can build a kick ***, smoking PC as well. I have the Money, The Knowledge and Resources to do so if I wanted to. I still have a couple around the house I never use anymore. That is what I did for many years and was just as much of "Mac's are a waste of Money... Blah Blah" as you. I've been Overclocking Processors and Video for years. I build PC Video encoding machines at work that I use for Webcasting that are monsters. I just hate the Windows OS anymore. I don't mind PC components. My first "Mac" was a Hackintosh. It's nice for me these days to be able to buy a machine off the rack, plug it in and have it work very well with 0 issues and plenty of software I can use. I can also run BootCamp or Parallels VM for mac and jump into Windows whenever I want... I can also sell my 3 year old Macbook Pro and still re-coup about 1/2 to 3/4 of what I paid for it new... You don't like Mac's.... I can respect that. Please provide those of us who have found an appreciation for them the same courtesy. Regards, Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damian Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 How can this possibly be an argument? I might start a thread about blue being better than green. Edit: not aimed at anyone in particular, just anyone who us bothered by anyone else's pov. MACs come in beautiful shades of BLUE....................... .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silenced Fred Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 AGREE WITH MY PERSONAL PREFERENCES OR YOU ARE WROOOOONNNNGGGG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jantha Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Tman5293, You do kinda turn into a trolling **** anytime this subject is brought up. Sorry I hate to be that way but it is the truth. No one is trying to convince you to buy a MAc or to even like them. There are also some long time IT people on here Including myself who have more than a passing knowledge of the subject of Building PC's and Tweaking... I can build a kick ***, smoking PC as well. I have the Money, The Knowledge and Resources to do so if I wanted to. I still have a couple around the house I never use anymore. That is what I did for many years and was just as much of "Mac's are a waste of Money... Blah Blah" as you. I've been Overclocking Processors and Video for years. I build PC Video encoding machines at work that I use for Webcasting that are monsters. I just hate the Windows OS anymore. I don't mind PC components. My first "Mac" was a Hackintosh. It's nice for me these days to be able to buy a machine off the rack, plug it in and have it work very well with 0 issues and plenty of software I can use. I can also run BootCamp or Parallels VM for mac and jump into Windows whenever I want... I can also sell my 3 year old Macbook Pro and still re-coup about 1/2 to 3/4 of what I paid for it new... You don't like Mac's.... I can respect that. Please provide those of us who have found an appreciation for them the same courtesy. Regards, Andy But.. But.. But.. You don't care what the kids on http://www.overclock.net might think? ..... Seriously though. Well said Andy, Milod, Drog and Retro. As for myself, I've spent 20+ years building, tweaking, modding, overclocking, programming etc. I would like to think I'm educated enough with computers to make up my own mind as to what I like and what works for me. I could care less what 2000+ inexperienced and highly opinionated people think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morkolo Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 I'll give PC's credit, I mean if it wasn't for Windows Vista I wouldn't have a quarter of the computer tech skills I have now. Like who really wants to install a program and run it right away, that would take all of the fun out of it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman5293 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 No I was not suggestion your opinion will change about you owning a mac anytime soon if ever. hopefully what you will understand is that nobody actually cares if you hate Macs because it's 100% with no personal stories or facts to make it real it's just your opinion with no intelligent data to support that , you sound like your way to arrogant to ever change any opinion even when you have been proven wrong. I was merely pointing out the interesting process and attitude that has been displayed by you ever since joining this forum. Your post are very consistent and follow a pattern that is made up of equal part Ignorance, arrogance and a massive and rather foolish disregard for information that others try to share it doesn't fit your active paradigm in your world. You clearly feel you know more than anyone else especially anyone who would try to share an opinion with you. My comment about hoping your young " Well if your young then this may be a simple phase and once you get proven wrong enough times you may actually learn something. and there would be a chance that you could become a valuable resource rather than just an annoyance on this board. If your all ready an adult then then this total lack of ability to understand even basic facts on social interaction in these types of forums will keep you just spouting your ill conceived and unsupported ideas is hopeless non ending loops of your thought. And if you can't mature then were wasting our time trying to help you learn and I'll be easier and more enjoyable again to just block all further content from you, because at least up to now you don't really add much other than strife. y I have several outstanding questions about this: I would like to know exactly what "intelligent data" you are looking for. In the past, on threads regarding computers both Apple and PC related, I believe I have provided information to back up my claims on many accounts. Just tell me what claims I've made in this thread that I have not supported and I try to provide you with valid data. Also, what opinion of mine has been proven wrong? Am I proven wrong because there are more replies in this thread that are in support of Macs and not PCs? Lastly, in regards to your last paragraph, you are right. My posts in this thread are childish and I plan to remove them. Maybe it was the awful mood I was in last night or something else but those posts were uncalled for nonetheless. I am sorry for the way I've acted towards Mac users. If this topic ever gets brought up again, it will not turn out the way this one and many others in the past have due to my opinions. However, in spite of all that, my opinion on Mac vs. PC still stands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman5293 Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Tman5293, You do kinda turn into a trolling **** anytime this subject is brought up. Sorry I hate to be that way but it is the truth. No one is trying to convince you to buy a MAc or to even like them. There are also some long time IT people on here Including myself who have more than a passing knowledge of the subject of Building PC's and Tweaking... I can build a kick ***, smoking PC as well. I have the Money, The Knowledge and Resources to do so if I wanted to. I still have a couple around the house I never use anymore. That is what I did for many years and was just as much of "Mac's are a waste of Money... Blah Blah" as you. I've been Overclocking Processors and Video for years. I build PC Video encoding machines at work that I use for Webcasting that are monsters. I just hate the Windows OS anymore. I don't mind PC components. My first "Mac" was a Hackintosh. It's nice for me these days to be able to buy a machine off the rack, plug it in and have it work very well with 0 issues and plenty of software I can use. I can also run BootCamp or Parallels VM for mac and jump into Windows whenever I want... I can also sell my 3 year old Macbook Pro and still re-coup about 1/2 to 3/4 of what I paid for it new... You don't like Mac's.... I can respect that. Please provide those of us who have found an appreciation for them the same courtesy. Regards, Andy This is an answer I can respect. Well said. That is all was looking for. Someone with experience dealing with computer components and building computers. You know the capabilities of a well built, homemade, PC. You know that a good Windows machine can be extremely powerful. If you still choose to use Apple after that then I can respect that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jantha Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 Lastly, in regards to your last paragraph, you are right. My posts in this thread are childish and I plan to remove them. Maybe it was the awful mood I was in last night or something else but those posts were uncalled for nonetheless. I am sorry for the way I've acted towards Mac users. If this topic ever gets brought up again, it will not turn out the way this one and many others in the past have due to my opinions. However, in spite of all that, my opinion on Mac vs. PC still stands. Good on ya! Hey, everyone has their own opinions. You just need to understand that what you find desirable in a computer is not what the typical Mac user finds desirable. I know on paper, Macs make no sense to someone who who builds their own PC's. However, there is a user experience there that a lot of people like, and will pay extra for. All I know is that it's good to have options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milod Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 I guess the thing that bothers me about the PC vs Mac debate nowadays is that it ignores what's in the future for all of us. Frankly I'm convinced the folks both at MS and Apple currently are working on the assumption that we all will be cloud users within a decade - and probably less. That bothers me for the same reason Jobs theoretically designed the original 6502 Apple: Putting computing power into the hands of the average person. Soon the Apple II became CMP compatible - by adding another cpu - and then came such as the IBM PC etc... with computing power exponentially increased and spurred apparent competition that brings the PC vs Apple religions. Now it appears to me that such as the iPad and our so-called smartphones of any ilk are seen, along with television, as simply control or display devices for stuff that's on an expanding "Internet" that we will have to lease rather than own. That does seriously concern me - and arguments on this or that brand of hardware and/or user interface are functionally irrelevant as to the future for all of us. Imagine that you have to lease a program to record your music performance, then put it into leased storage. You hit economic hard times and what? It ain't yours any more. The lease contract likely takes no responsibility for holding your files and without the leased program to play them... Maybe I'm too cynical, but I'm convinced it ain't Apple or any other manufacturer per se, because the big guys already are looking at how to simply provide us with varying modes of accessing "the web." To me that's as if all the guitar manufacturers refused to sell any, all the old ones were designed to become disfunctional after 2016, and we'd have to lease them and amplifiers that worked only with special dongles that would disallow use of the new leased instruments. Even if we bought the hardware, without plugging in lease codes, they'd become disfunctional for other than non-amplified usage. At that point we could argue Gibson vs. Fender all we might wish - but none of us would truly own them or the results of what they could do. Ditto the Apple variations of OS and PC variations of Windows. In short, in ways I think the Apple vs PC is a red herring for the real challenges we'll face that make us all more dependent on yet another "public" utility, this time for our own creative endeavors. m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retrosurfer1959 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 We will all be on the cloud, We won't get a choice - So prepare to be assimilated as the Borg always said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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