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Are Black Sabbaths Never Say Die and Technical Ecstasy really so bad?


dem00n

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It got me thinking, why are these last two records of Black Sabbaths Ozzy era considered so bad? I mean, there is the fact these two records are the least heavy records they ever recored. Theres also a lot of experimentation with genres and overall other instruments. Everyones musicianship is fine, no ones lacking. Bill is still slamming the drums, Tony still has the chops, Gezzer is a bit lost in the mix sometimes but i hear his bass and Ozzy sounds fine (even though he lost his voice a few years back). These aren't heavy metal records, this is hard rock at its finest.

What do you guys think about Never Say Die and Technical Ecstasy?

 

 

A Hard Road is a great song!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-upJRUsPxU

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And Bill Ward sings,

 

The records are not bad now but they did back then compared to their own standards.

 

The production is poor too, but nowadays in trying to getaway from loud compressed over-produced music I love the way they sound.

 

I hope Rhino re-issues them on vinyl.

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Maybe it's all about context. Had Never Say Die and Technical Ecstasy not been preceded by their early great albums and then followed by Heaven and Hell and Mob Rules with Ronnie then they would be viewed more kindly. Hard to shine surrounded by albums like that!

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They were different, but in many ways they are "better" than the early stuff. More explorative, more difficult music and arrangements. As with most departures, they didn't set well with the hardcore fans that detest change in any form. I will agree that the production value wasn't there. Perhaps that was due to the internal strife that was brewing in the band, or perhaps they were experimenting in the studio a little too much.

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Are you kidding me? Technical Ecstasy is one of my favorite all time Sabbath records. In fact, it was the first record I ever bought on vinyl with my own money. "All Moving Parts" - "Rock and Roll Dr." are as heavy and hard rockin tunes as they ever recorded. "Never Say Die" is NOT one of my favs, but still it was the last album with Ozzy, so that has to count for something.

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They were different, but in many ways they are "better" than the early stuff. More explorative, more difficult music and arrangements. As with most departures, they didn't set well with the hardcore fans that detest change in any form.

This.

 

I had both when they came out (where are they now? :-k Hmmm...) and, after the initial 'surprise' wore off, came to like them albeit in a slightly different way from the band's earlier offerings.

 

I confess I didn't notice any issues with the production values but I was listening to them on an old hand-me-down mono 'Radiogram'...[scared]

 

P.

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All Moving Parts Stand Still is a good song. Although I could actually see it more as being on Blizard of Oz... Still I jammed Never Say Die LP constantly in 1997 when I was in college at Towson State. Everybody hated me because dipshit bands like 311 and Bostones were popular then. ah well....

 

Technical Ecstasy isn't a bad album overall. but its definitely different from Volume 4. Which i think is the New Testament of Metal.

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This.

 

I had both when they came out (where are they now? :-k Hmmm...) and, after the initial 'surprise' wore off, came to like them albeit in a slightly different way from the band's earlier offerings.

 

I confess I didn't notice any issues with the production values but I was listening to them on an old hand-me-down mono 'Radiogram'...[scared]

 

P.

I really don't know it the production value lacked, or if it was just so different from the bottom end heavy recording I was used to.

 

Also, I first heard it on cassete tape, it could have been a poor transfer.

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