JAddison Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Appologies if this has been asked before; I got some new bone pins for my LG2 and when restringing I have noticed that they 'pop' off the bottom of the pins and must be up against the underneath of the bridsge plate. Is this normal? If not is it safe or will I end up chewing up my bridge plate? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Morton Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 I am pretty sure the bridge pin holds the ball end against the bridge plate. the ball should not only be at the end of the pin. JM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 the strings are supposed to sit against the plate ... i dont know what you mean 'slipping off the pins '. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-minor7 Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 I'd be amazed if J.M. wasn't right - Your imagination might play tricks on you, JAddison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigKahune Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 . Normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Yu do not want the ball end of the string pulling straight up and you do not want it touching the end of the pin. I always bend the ball end of the string a bit before I stick it into the pin hole so it locks against the bridge plate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Picture perfect example, BK. I'm lazy & don't change strings often enough, but when I do, I check with a mirror to make sure all strings are seated properly against the bridge plate. In particular with Gibson's plastic bridges from the '60s, a poorly seated string pulling on the spruce top can rather quickly spell disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 i've been playing about 25 years and i've never looked inside a guitar , i'm slightly amazed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Yep...the ball ends have to be 'jigged', a fishing term, referring to lifting and dropping until they slide up against the pin and get lodged under the plate. I like your technique of bending, Z. That works. If the ball end pulls the pins up, they are poorly wedged against the pin and hole, and/or your sizing is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 i've been playing about 25 years and i've never looked inside a guitar , i'm slightly amazed Know your instrument. A light and mirror (or camera, if you go high-tech) are your friends. You'll be amazed at what you find. You have opened the hood of your car, haven't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Yep...the ball ends have to be 'jigged', a fishing term, referring to lifting and dropping until they slide up against the pin and get lodged under the plate. I like your technique of bending, Z. That works. If the ball end pulls the pins up, they are poorly wedged against the pin and hole, and/or your sizing is wrong. If you bend the strings before inserting them, push the ball ends down past the plate, and insert the pin while gently pulling the strings up, the ball ends almost always seat properly. The key is to have the ball ends below the bottom of the plate when you start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasAK Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 A light and mirror (or camera, if you go high-tech) are your friends. You'll be amazed at what you find. Yep, things like dust mice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeljohnr Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 It's normal as stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 Know your instrument. A light and mirror (or camera, if you go high-tech) are your friends. You'll be amazed at what you find. You have opened the hood of your car, haven't you? haha , yeah i open the 'bonnet' of my car from time to time and i will make it a point to look inside the guitar with the missus' little mirror , hell i'll even put a picture up here if folk might want to see . i guess youre right nick , i outta have a look . but the point that made me ever so slightly amazed was that folk look with a mirror after restringing . and i'm not saying i think ill of them for doing it , just wide eyed at the differences in pernickityness . i have used the bend the ball end method for donkeys years and it quite simply never occured to me that something might not be right 'under the hood' i just stick new strings on , tune up n play i am still perplexed from the original post ... was someone trying to get the ball end of the string balanced on the end of the bridge pins ? i would think that a near impossible task ! maybe i'm misunderstanding the 'slipping off the bridge pins' part ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAddison Posted February 8, 2013 Author Share Posted February 8, 2013 haha , yeah i open the 'bonnet' of my car from time to time and i will make it a point to look inside the guitar with the missus' little mirror , hell i'll even put a picture up here if folk might want to see . i guess youre right nick , i outta have a look . but the point that made me ever so slightly amazed was that folk look with a mirror after restringing . and i'm not saying i think ill of them for doing it , just wide eyed at the differences in pernickityness . i have used the bend the ball end method for donkeys years and it quite simply never occured to me that something might not be right 'under the hood' i just stick new strings on , tune up n play i am still perplexed from the original post ... was someone trying to get the ball end of the string balanced on the end of the bridge pins ? i would think that a near impossible task ! maybe i'm misunderstanding the 'slipping off the bridge pins' part ? As embarrasing as it is.. yes I was live and learn I guess! thanks for the insight guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 As embarrasing as it is.. yes I was live and learn I guess! thanks for the insight guys ah geez , dont feel bad ... we've all had to learn . i wish i hadve had this when i first started . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 but the point that made me ever so slightly amazed was that folk look with a mirror after restringing . and i'm not saying i think ill of them for doing it , just wide eyed at the differences in pernickityness . What drives me to do it is that I never want to experience another top crack due to an improperly seated string. This occurred on a B25 with the plastic bridge. I got it cheap because of that crack, and eventually stabilized it by removing all the hardware & installing an ebony bridge and a cleat on the impacted area directly behind the bridge. But even those crazy plastic bridges will hold up if you're cautious. My '66 Epi Cortez still has the plastic bridge, and everything is structurally sound. A wood bridge is of course glued to the top rather than bolted, but even still, it is not the primary job of the spruce top or the bridge to absorb the load from the strings. That task belongs to the bridge plate, and it can only do it's job if the strings are seated properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindboygrunt Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 What drives me to do it is that I never want to experience another top crack due to an improperly seated string. This occurred on a B25 with the plastic bridge. I got it cheap because of that crack, and eventually stabilized it by removing all the hardware & installing an ebony bridge and a cleat on the impacted area directly behind the bridge. But even those crazy plastic bridges will hold up if you're cautious. My '66 Epi Cortez still has the plastic bridge, and everything is structurally sound. A wood bridge is of course glued to the top rather than bolted, but even still, it is not the primary job of the spruce top or the bridge to absorb the load from the strings. That task belongs to the bridge plate, and it can only do it's job if the strings are seated properly. i'm learning here . i've never had anything 'vintage' so i suppose i've never had that inclination of checking regularly .. nick joked about me opening the 'hood' of the car , when i drove an old merc i looked at least once a week , but the golf i drive now , not so often . i should look inside though , nick's right. tell me this then , do problems just naturally occur under the bridge ? is there a certain amount of unavoidable wear n tear just by the physics of the ball ends on the bridge ? or is it a case of if the string isnt settled correctly then something is going to happen ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedzep Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 The wear is unavoidable at that stress point and over it's lifetime will eventually cause an indentation in the plate. If you pay attention to proper positioning it may never evolve into a more problematic issue in a person's lifetime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j45nick Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 The wear is unavoidable at that stress point and over it's lifetime will eventually cause an indentation in the plate. If you pay attention to proper positioning it may never evolve into a more problematic issue in a person's lifetime. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigKahune Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 i'm learning here . . . . is there a certain amount of unavoidable wear n tear just by the physics of the ball ends on the bridge ? When wear begins to get worse, like this Some resort to this - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobouz Posted February 8, 2013 Share Posted February 8, 2013 is it a case of if the string isnt settled correctly then something is going to happen ? That certainly is the concern. Say the ball end is slid somewhat off to the side of the hole, and seats itself there as you bring up tension. Now with pressure it will dig in further at this less than ideal angle. Next string change, your new string finds the same dig spot, seats itself there, and so on. Eventually you might start seeing signs of the mess shown in BK's photo above (and I have indeed seen similar damage multiple times). Worse case scenarios: The string can no longer find a clean spot to seat itself in the proper position, or the bridge plate cracks between the holes, or the string seats itself into the spruce top. All of which can put undue pressure on the top & bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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