fortyearspickn Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 Earlier this week I got a voicemail from our city's water company stating they would be installing new water meters. Electronic, which they can control, read and monitor from their offices. At the same time, in the news, they got approval yesterday to implement a changes to their pricing practices. First and foremost - monitoring and fining those who use too much water or for watering your lawn, outside of approved hours on your day. Last week - our home thermostat (Nest brand) started showing an orange message in the little round screen. Instead of the temperature - for over a week now, it has shown a little 'utilities' icon with the message "If you would like us at the Electric Company to control your home's temperature, reducing it at peak usage times, just click here. " So - our water and power are basically controllable by bureaucrats. San Antonio has a dry climate - 32" average rainfall/year. And of course, very hot. So water and electricity are certainly issues. The problem is exacerbated by the population growth - in the Top Five for the past several years. From 1.3M in 2000 to 2.4M in 2023. City Leaders want to attract people and businesses and the money they bring in. Schools, roads and utilities are always struggling to keep up. Not the same city we moved to 25 years ago. In 1991 the city water people were just waking up. They found the Biggest Number One water user was some guy on the outskirts who had a massive catfish farm! Funded by an investor from NJ, rather than install filters to clean the water in his ponds - he just continuously flushed them with new water. Using 45 million gallons a day from the well he drilled - the worlds largest water well! 1/4 of the entire city's usage. They shut him down after a years long struggle in the courts and legislature. The water was free to him ! Sometimes it's hard to have confidence in the 'experts' - and when they control your water and power - it becomes scary. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvi Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 water around here ( BC west Coast) is getting scarce, too many users, we are told to conserve and my town just put in kilometers of roadside lawn with sprinkers, just to look nice, Im told to get rid of grass and use mulch or some no water dependent veg. - I do think running a populated country cant be easy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 And your state is allowing them to do that to you? rct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gearbasher Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 The average American uses between 80 and 100 gallons of water a day. I live alone and my average use is 60 gallons a day. Do I get rewarded? NO! Anything 80 gallons and under gets charged a flat rate. That makes me feel like using another 20 gallons a day, just because I'm paying for it. It's almost the same for the gas and electric companies. You pay a certain amount for the first amount of units, then when you go over they charge less per unit than the original cost. If they charged more for the over usage, maybe people will use less energy. Also, with all the "smart" meters, all someone has to do is hack the system and they know when you're home and when you're away. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NighthawkChris Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 I used to have a septic system. A few years back the field failed and of course you need a permit to get it repaired - technically. Instead, since I was within X feet within the new sewer main, the township would not approve and instead said I need to connect to the sewer main - and be in a special assessment district where I have to install this grinder station on my property on my dime of course at 5% interest over 10 years if you can’t pay the $24k up front. Now I get a bill that started around $170 every quarter that has increased year over year where I am now paying nearly $220 a quarter. The system sucks… it has an alarm when the grinder can’t push your crap and pee where you have to be at the mercy of the water dept to fix this. I don’t install that smart crap in my house. My thermostat is “dumb”, my fridge, oven, laundry equipment… everything. I don’t have any of those spy Alexa crap devices, I run Linux instead of MS… eventually, they’ll get me by the you know what though… just staving off the inevitable for the meantime. Good luck @fortyearspickn I feel ya… 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanvillRob Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 Water and utilities (PG&E) are an issue in the SF Bay Area. I have one acre of land....so my water usage is higher than normal. There are only 2 people living here, so not too many showers.... not too much washing. I installed a drip system throughout my yard, and have no natural lawn to water.... in the summer my water bill is still close to $1K every 2 months! There is a 'smart meter' on my water inlet...but a guy drives by and collects the usage, (it somehow transmits to his car). As for electricity, PG&E (so it's both natural gas and electricity) as still VERY high. I put in a 12kW solar system, (no big hail to damage the panels like in Texas), so I don't pay for electricity at all until my "true-up" month....and then I pay for whatever I used that the solar system didn't produce, or they pay me for electricity my system produced and I didn't use, (I'm usually VERY close to breaking even). I do pay for gas each month.....in the winter, my bill be get up to $400-$500 a month for gas....which is STUPID! The solar system cost me $40K....I've had it 7-1/2 years, so I'm close to breaking even on my investment. We have a "smart meter" on our electricity input, and they charge different rates at different times of the day..... this doesn't affect me, because of the solar system. Also, I use a medical device at night, (CPAP machine), so I'm on a special account. Not cheaper, but they have to give me plenty of warning before they interrupt my service, (I have a home generator anyway that kicks in if/when the service is interrupted). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanvillRob Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 7 minutes ago, NighthawkChris said: I used to have a septic system. A few years back the field failed and of course you need a permit to get it repaired - technically. Instead, since I was within X feet within the new sewer main, the township would not approve and instead said I need to connect to the sewer main - and be in a special assessment district where I have to install this grinder station on my property on my dime of course at 5% interest over 10 years if you can’t pay the $24k up front. Now I get a bill that started around $170 every quarter that has increased year over year where I am now paying nearly $220 a quarter. The system sucks… it has an alarm when the grinder can’t push your crap and pee where you have to be at the mercy of the water dept to fix this. I don’t install that smart crap in my house. My thermostat is “dumb”, my fridge, oven, laundry equipment… everything. I don’t have any of those spy Alexa crap devices, I run Linux instead of MS… eventually, they’ll get me by the you know what though… just staving off the inevitable for the meantime. Good luck @fortyearspickn I feel ya… You're like a "Mountain Man"! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duane v Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 Until I get a letter, I use as much water as I want. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tx-ogre Posted Friday at 10:13 PM Share Posted Friday at 10:13 PM 7 hours ago, fortyearspickn said: Earlier this week I got a voicemail from our city's water company stating they would be installing new water meters. Electronic, which they can control, read and monitor from their offices. At the same time, in the news, they got approval yesterday to implement a changes to their pricing practices. First and foremost - monitoring and fining those who use too much water or for watering your lawn, outside of approved hours on your day. Last week - our home thermostat (Nest brand) started showing an orange message in the little round screen. Instead of the temperature - for over a week now, it has shown a little 'utilities' icon with the message "If you would like us at the Electric Company to control your home's temperature, reducing it at peak usage times, just click here. " So - our water and power are basically controllable by bureaucrats. San Antonio has a dry climate - 32" average rainfall/year. And of course, very hot. So water and electricity are certainly issues. The problem is exacerbated by the population growth - in the Top Five for the past several years. From 1.3M in 2000 to 2.4M in 2023. City Leaders want to attract people and businesses and the money they bring in. Schools, roads and utilities are always struggling to keep up. Not the same city we moved to 25 years ago. In 1991 the city water people were just waking up. They found the Biggest Number One water user was some guy on the outskirts who had a massive catfish farm! Funded by an investor from NJ, rather than install filters to clean the water in his ponds - he just continuously flushed them with new water. Using 45 million gallons a day from the well he drilled - the worlds largest water well! 1/4 of the entire city's usage. They shut him down after a years long struggle in the courts and legislature. The water was free to him ! Sometimes it's hard to have confidence in the 'experts' - and when they control your water and power - it becomes scary. We’re in the same boat here in Hays County, just south of Austin. The bureaucratic/political geniuses keep telling us to conserve water and placing additional restrictions on us. But at the same time, these same clowns can’t issue building permits for more residential, commercial and industrial properties fast enough. A lot of people are calling for a moratorium on new building until a real solution to the water issue has been found. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted Saturday at 12:42 PM Author Share Posted Saturday at 12:42 PM 14 hours ago, tx-ogre said: We’re in the same boat here in Hays County, just south of Austin. The bureaucratic/political geniuses keep telling us to conserve water and placing additional restrictions on us. But at the same time, these same clowns can’t issue building permits for more residential, commercial and industrial properties fast enough. A lot of people are calling for a moratorium on new building until a real solution to the water issue has been found. Exactly. It was like this in South Florida in the 70s. Developers, Bankers and Politicians got rich with 'dredge and fill' housing tracts that had no infrastructure behind them. Here and now - when a third of the population doesn't know how it was 20 years ago - there are no expectations of how it should be, or what shouldn't be changed. They accept horrible traffic, brownouts, etc. The NBA team, San Antonio Spurs, are now threatening to leave the city if they don't get a new arena. Their first was The AlamoDome - built in '93. Had a new one (AT&T Center) built in 2002. Politicians have to save face and keep our one and only top level team (we have no MLB or NFL teams) so they need the money to pay for it. It's circle joke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notes_Norton Posted Saturday at 02:41 PM Share Posted Saturday at 02:41 PM Lucky me. I live in an unincorporated area of the county, 2 houses south of the City Limits. I have a water well and a septic tank. They aren't stealing from me. But the electric company does. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted Saturday at 05:02 PM Share Posted Saturday at 05:02 PM On 6/21/2024 at 4:29 PM, gearbasher said: Also, with all the "smart" meters, all someone has to do is hack the system and they know when you're home and when you're away. I hadn't thought of that. I don't have any smart meters (yet). Cherry has just had a gas one installed though. My water metered is at the edge of my property, I pay just over £4 ($5) per month which averages at £50 a year. This year I had a water leak from an underground pipe (now fixed) that bumped up my bill and I got a rebate from the Portsmouth Water Company when I told them. The pipe was on my property. They sent someone along to check on it and I told him my insurance company got it repaired. He told me I'd get a bill commensurate with my usual usage. I feel fortunate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrairieDog Posted Saturday at 06:45 PM Share Posted Saturday at 06:45 PM On 6/21/2024 at 10:38 AM, DanvillRob said: Water and utilities (PG&E) are an issue in the SF Bay Area. I have one acre of land....so my water usage is higher than normal. There are only 2 people living here, so not too many showers.... not too much washing. I installed a drip system throughout my yard, and have no natural lawn to water.... in the summer my water bill is still close to $1K every 2 months! There is a 'smart meter' on my water inlet...but a guy drives by and collects the usage, (it somehow transmits to his car). As for electricity, PG&E (so it's both natural gas and electricity) as still VERY high. I put in a 12kW solar system, (no big hail to damage the panels like in Texas), so I don't pay for electricity at all until my "true-up" month....and then I pay for whatever I used that the solar system didn't produce, or they pay me for electricity my system produced and I didn't use, (I'm usually VERY close to breaking even). I do pay for gas each month.....in the winter, my bill be get up to $400-$500 a month for gas....which is STUPID! The solar system cost me $40K....I've had it 7-1/2 years, so I'm close to breaking even on my investment. We have a "smart meter" on our electricity input, and they charge different rates at different times of the day..... this doesn't affect me, because of the solar system. Also, I use a medical device at night, (CPAP machine), so I'm on a special account. Not cheaper, but they have to give me plenty of warning before they interrupt my service, (I have a home generator anyway that kicks in if/when the service is interrupted). Whoa, that water bill is dang scary. Average SF bill is around 100 a month. Even on an acre, it’s by usage, not parcel size, and like you said it’s not like you are watering lawns all day. I’m surprised your water board hasn’t been out to do an audit. Are you sure your drip system isn’t leaking somewhere? Or maybe you have a silent leak in one of your toilets? Have you checked all your fixtures? Those can lose 1/2 to 1 gallon an hour. If you are losing even just a gallon of water an hour, that is 100s of gallons a month. We have an electric well pump and our electric bill skyrocketed for a while, till we found out we had a broken line to the barn that was causing the 1/2 hp pump to run every 5 minutes or so. We couldn’t figure out why the pump was cycling on and off even when we weren’t running water. Finally had to have a contractor come out and excavate the whole 300 ft line down to the barn, starting at the well, and of course, the break was right at the wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tx-ogre Posted Sunday at 12:42 AM Share Posted Sunday at 12:42 AM 11 hours ago, fortyearspickn said: Exactly. It was like this in South Florida in the 70s. Developers, Bankers and Politicians got rich with 'dredge and fill' housing tracts that had no infrastructure behind them. Here and now - when a third of the population doesn't know how it was 20 years ago - there are no expectations of how it should be, or what shouldn't be changed. They accept horrible traffic, brownouts, etc. The NBA team, San Antonio Spurs, are now threatening to leave the city if they don't get a new arena. Their first was The AlamoDome - built in '93. Had a new one (AT&T Center) built in 2002. Politicians have to save face and keep our one and only top level team (we have no MLB or NFL teams) so they need the money to pay for it. It's circle joke. Same thing here. My wife and I moved to the Austin area permanently in 2012 after I retired. Most of my wife’s family live here and we had been coming here 2-3 times a year since 1986. The population of the city of Austin has tripled and the population of the suburbs has exploded. Austin is so expensive to live in that a lot of people are moving further and further out. And unbelievably, other than the construction of the toll roads (that a lot of people railed against at the time), there has been very little improvement/expansion of the road system. We live in unincorporated Hay County just south of the Austin city limits/Travis County line. What used to feel like country living is now a three-ring circus. We have talked about relocating in a few years. We had no desire to live in Austin, mostly because of the incompetence of city/county government. While the local governments in Buda, Kyle (the fasting growing city) and San Marcos (County Seat) leave something to be desired, we are constantly reminded after seeing the Austin City Council and Mayor in action, we could be a lot worse off. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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