Strings Around or Through the Stop Bar?

[Twiz]

My vote:

 

[ke3ee]

Def. around....Robb

[yoda]

Can I ask why around?

[Twiz]

Can I ask why around?

 

Some players say that wrapping the string around the stop bar creates more sustain because more of the string contacts the bridge.

 

I really don't know if that's true or not.

[jchabalk]

i don't do it either, but i hear that doing bends is easier with the strings wrapped up around and over the tailpiece because the bend over the saddles is so minor

[Buc McMaster]

Wrapping the strings over the top of the tailpiece can cause fret rattle because of decreased down pressure on the bridge. It will definitely not contribute to sustain for the same reason. Wrapping the tailpiece is some silliness that some knucklehead started when he saw it on an old stop tailpiece Paul from the early 50's without a bridge. For those instruments it is the way they were built and is required. For everything else with a bridge/stop tail setup it is nothing more than bucking the system and can be a source of problems. You like it? Go ahead, but understand it ain't right.

[Twiz]

Wrapping the strings over the top of the tailpiece can cause fret rattle because of decreased down pressure on the bridge. It will definitely not contribute to sustain for the same reason. Wrapping the tailpiece is some silliness that some knucklehead started when he saw it on an old stop tailpiece Paul from the early 50's without a bridge. For those instruments it is the way they were built and is required. For everything else with a bridge/stop tail setup it is nothing more than bucking the system and can be a source of problems. You like it? Go ahead' date=' but understand it ain't right.[/quote']

 

Yeah, I think I started doing it b/c I saw some old footage of Jimmy Page with his LP strung that way. I couldn't tell any difference in my sound. Thanks for the info.

[SolidGuitar]

it Heard Billy Gibbons had his pearly gates strung around the bridge so it can't be all that bad. I tried it and it definitely made string bending easier.

[Twiz]

it Heard Billy Gibbons had his pearly gates strung around the bridge so it can't be all that bad. I tried it and it definitely made string bending easier.

 

Billy freakin' rules. ZZ Top is playing Pittsburgh 06.24. I can't wait!

[ke3ee]

According to Dan Erliwine and other fairly well know tech's the reason is that Gibson changed the neck angle when they moved from Kalamazoo to Nashville setting up the new CNC machines and the string break angle over the bridge changed with this. If you screw the tail peice all the way down to get max sustain , The strings will most likely touch the back of the bridge taking away sustain and harmonics also causing to much pressure on the bridge eventually leading to a downward bow and string breakage. So top wrapping allows the break angle to stay at closer to the 4-5 degrees and have the tailpeice screwed down for max sustain. This theory is in many books on setups by techs like Dan Erliwine, Buzz feiten and others.

[Buc McMaster]

According to Dan Erliwine and other fairly well know tech's the reason is that Gibson changed the neck angle when they moved from Kalamazoo to Nashville setting up the new CNC machines and the string break angle over the bridge changed with this.

 

What??! Changing the neck angle will not' date=' I repeat [i']will not[/i] change the angle of break over the saddles. It is the height differential between bridge and tailpiece that determines break over the saddles. Think about it......... You could have a neck set angle of 30 degrees, makes no difference as long as the bridge is set at sufficient height to hold the strings off the frets at a playable level. It is the tailpiece position relative to the bridge that sets string break angle over the saddles.......neck set angle has nothing to do with it. And if Erlewine said this he is misinformed, don't care how much of a guru he is perceived to be.

[SHO]

It is the height differential between bridge and tailpiece that determines break over the saddles.

 

If you screw the tail peice all the way down to get max sustain

 

so with the the other neck angle you have the bridge higher, which means more angle if the tail piece is down at the bottom. :o

[Buc McMaster]

so with the the other neck angle you have the bridge higher' date=' which means more angle if the tail piece is down at the bottom. :o

[/quote']

 

The tailpiece should not be screwed all the way down as a matter of course. The saddle should be the only point of string contact on the bridge. Depending on bridge height, screwing the tailpiece all the way down may force the string to contact the rear edge of the bridge, generating rollover pressure on the back of the bridge piece - not good. If the bridge should be heght adjusted to the action of your preference, then the tailpiece adjusted for maximum angle of break without string contact to the back edge of the bridge.

 

(And by the way, I know Billy G and he is given to doing things weird just to give all of us something to scratch our heads over. He understands being the "rock star" that he is.)

[ke3ee]

Yep...

"so with the the other neck angle you have the bridge higher, which means more angle if the tail piece is down at the bottom"

 

Its not worth arguing about.. everyone has thier opinion. I've done playing and listening tests with my SG and with the strings top wrapped and tail peice down tight there is a def. difference in sustain and harmonic transferance from the strings to the body. Possibly with a bridge and tail peice such as a TonePros that locks to the posts at the bridge and tail you would get the same type of response with the tail peice not screwed down tight.

[uyasgali]

Sometimes I feel like a nut and sometimes I don't. If it makes a difference in sustain or string bending or whatever, I can't tell really. I have loads of sustain on my SG and LP and I don't do that much string bending anyway. :-)

[80LPC]

An increase in neck pitch means the bridge is raised higher to achieve the same action. The break angle has now increased. assuming the stop bar is left at the same height. Top wrapping reduces downforce on the bridge. Firm downforce contributes to good sustain. Top wrapping with an ABR 1 means the already poorly located saddles can buzz and sap sustain. The perceived benefits of better sustain through a lower tailpiece are wiped out by the low downforce on the bridge.

 

With a Les Paul, if the stop bar screws are wound down to contact the top of the guitar, they don't meet the surface flush because of the carved top. They only make contact in a small area which damages the finish - unless you use those spacers which lock the screw to the bush.

 

Gibson sticks by the 17 degree headstock. The benefit apparently is better sustain caused by higher downforce on the nut. That reasoning applies equally to the bridge...

 

Top wrapping trashes the plating on your stop bar, but I suppose it looks 'cool', and that's gotta be worth something in Rock 'n' Roll.

[Sin]

when I get new strings I'll test my guitar with the strings around for a change

[80LPC]

But with new strings, your guitar will sound different either way New strings will have a slinky feel, be louder and much brighter. Why not try your new strings top wrapped for a few days, then switch back to normal wrap to compare.

[NeoConMan]

I string ALL my Gibsons the same way the factory has been doing it for 54 years - with the tailpiece all the way down.

I never saw an advantage to top-wrapping and doubt it improves sustain.

I've experimented, and I discussed it with others who have as well. No benefit anybody has ever shown me.

 

NEVER broke a string where it bends over the back of the bridge.

The tuner is the most common place - look again at how torturous a path that is for a string.

Another cause is a sharp saddle - easily fixed.

 

Hey, Zakk Wylde does the top-wrapping thing - but he also uses a 3/8" logging chain for a strap.....

Meanwhile, back in the real world, you can do it if you want but I worry about structural damage to the tail studs and wood.

 

You want massive sound and sustain?

String it with 13's.

[Sin]

But with new strings' date=' your guitar will sound different either way New strings will have a slinky feel, be louder and much brighter. Why not try your new strings top wrapped for a few days, then switch back to normal wrap to compare. [/quote']

 

good point, I would do it with the strings I have now but I trimmed the edges, so they are simply to short to wrap them around.

[ninety1vee]

around, but only because i have the tailpiece slammed down all the way and if i didn't wrap then the strings touch the back of the bridge...

to each their own

[Murph]

Through on everything except the '61 Melody Maker.

 

It's got a Leo Quan, so it goes around, by design.

 

Murph.

[wigglestick]

Around...If you find something, and it works for you, then to hell with what others say or how their doing it. Otherwise we'd still be doing trench warfare, treating disease with leaches, and playing archtop guitars in our big bands.

[80LPC]

Otherwise we'd still be doing trench warfare' date=' treating disease with leaches, and playing archtop guitars in our big bands. [/quote']

 

Funny you should say that...

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/179227.stm

 

Helmand.

 

Brian Setzer.

[Geff]

I put them through because......................................................

 

Thats how it was designed to work!

 

But you know what, its your guitar, you do it how you want. Just dont complain if something goes wrong or doesn't sound right.