Classic Rock......

[Murph]

How, and where, is the format/genre going to end?

 

There is a good Classic Rock station in this area that goes from the Beatles to the early '90's. Very large playlist, not like some stations that play the same 40 songs over and over and over and over......

 

Sirius/XM has interesting concepts with the 50's/60's/70's Deep Tracks, ect., but I'm speaking here for FREE FM reception.

 

As an old radio jock, we always considered 50's stuff "Good Time" rock, ect, and "Classic Rock" pretty much started with the Beatles, but........

 

Where does it end, and another format kick in?

 

And what is it to be called?

 

How many genres will it be?

 

[saturn]

IMO, Classic Rock is any rock that stands the test of time and still sounds good 20 or more years after it came out.

 

That's why some songs (especially from the 80s) might be older, but they don't get put in with the classic rock category. They sound too dated or corny now. We are reaching the point in time where bands like U2, Police, REM etc are now being called classic. Soon it will be Pearl Jam and Nirvana.

 

Man we're really gettin' old

[FirstMeasure]

I don't think there will be another category for Rock, except maybe when some Classic Rock starts to be called Vintage Rock. Take cars for example, when I was growing up, a Mustang 2 and Mustang Mach 3 were not Classic Cars, they weren't old enough. Now 85 Mustangs are starting to ease into the Classic Car category.

 

I think it's more of a title for those who stand the test of time, more than a sound or style.

[milod]

I think the terms may change, but the music will be played for a long time.

 

My reasoning on that is that there's a lotta melodic stuff that's catchier than much else that's available, for one thing; for another, much of the newer material isn't necessarily going through the traditional music channels and therefore the older stuff is both easier for radio to acquire and "pay for" and easier to know there's a decent audience there.

 

Here's one to think about: "Rock" as we know it came in a combination of combos replacing big bands, the electric guitar and more volume for music...

 

So why is the old stuff still popular? Ask what truly "new" has happened since maybe the mid 1950s. Not much except increasing use of electric guitars through the 1960s.

 

m

[Murph]

I think the terms may change' date='

[/quote']

 

That's kind of what I was wondering, as a former disc jockey.

 

How long (in years) can one format continue? Will mid '60's Beatles stuff continue to be mixed in with stuff from 2010 ( 20 years from now), or will the format be split into different sub formats?

 

Will the early Eagles stuff be played alongside the Smashing Pumpkins?

 

[Californiaman]

That's the problem Murph.

There is no delineation between where one genre ends and another begins.

I think they call that 50's stuff Oldies. No offense there bud. I like it too.

I agree with the British Invasion as being the beginning of Classic Rock.

Eagles and Smashing Pumpkins though, just can't imaging that though.

[FirstMeasure]

That's kind of what I was wondering' date=' as a former disc jockey.

 

How long (in years) can one format continue? Will mid '60's Beatles stuff continue to be mixed in with stuff from 2010 ( 20 years from now), or will the format be split into different sub formats?

 

Will the early Eagles stuff be played alongside the Smashing Pumpkins?

 

 

 

 

I think the Decade that a song comes from will continue to be less important than the song itself. Look at Classical Music, while it's broken down int several sub categories it's all played by the same Orchestras and radio Stations (when you can find one). Whether it's a Mozart or a Rodger Sessions piece, it's all in the Classical Section of Barnes and Nobel.

 

Rock gonna be Rock for the next 100 years, we'd need 90 different radio stations if we continue to separate it by decade.

[milod]

Yeah, I think it's likely it'll just be called "rock" but given the way the radio biz has been going I don't know how much any given substyle will be played.

 

For example, "swing" was maybe really going hot on the "hit parade" for maybe 10-15 years at most... Nowadays the majority of 1930s arrangements like used by Larry Clinton aren't even heard beyond some "special" because they don't sound enough like Glen Miller or Artie Shaw. The "swing" music generation is pretty much gone and guys my age who play it are basically going by what their parents were listening to and what audiences want - and that fits the "ears" of modern audiences because of other changes.

 

I've a hunch you're likely to see that sort of thing happening. Fore example, very little Doowop is heard nowadays, but 15 years ago it was heard more... The teens of the 1950s are gettin' older. #$%@#%@#$%

 

Let's face it, if a 20-year-old today hears early Beatles, they're thinking of something very, very old - even perhaps older than their own parents' music tastes... in fact, far older than "swing" was to my own ears growing up.

 

m

[rockstar232007]

Classic Rock = Music for music, not music for money

 

So IMHO, Classic Rock (the genre) ended when music became too mainstream (the early '80s).

[Jantha]

Classic Rock will always be 60's and 70's to me.

[milod]

Jantha....

 

Hmmmmm.....

 

Naaaaah....

 

The 60s and 70s stuff is the new material. "Classic" is pre-beatle.

 

I'm about 20 percent kidding and 80 percent serious.

 

It's a matter of age group, I think.

 

I figure the rock I was playing in 61-62 was classic... and heck, a lotta early Beadle stuff was covers of US late 50s and 60s stuff...

 

m

[Jantha]

I think you're right Milod... It does depend on age group. Growing up, the classic rock stations here played 60's & 70's. 50's were "oldies".

 

I have a hard time accepting the 80's as classic rock.. but that's what the stations are playing now. I guess times change hehe.

[sgman]

Classic Rock in my mind includes the 60's and 70's and as said on an earlier post on this thread, it may soon be called Vintage Rock and on some TV music stations it already is being termed as Vintage Rock.

 

But having said that, my dad often used to refer to his early 20th Century Dixieland Jazz as "Classic" Jazz which always struck me that he called it that because it was "old." So perhaps it is true that later in this century and maybe only a few years away at that, as already suggested we may be referring to 90's bands/artists as "Classic Rock" (heaven help us)

 

Classic Rock (to me) though will always be the Beatles era through to 1979 and the last Led Zeppelin album "In Through The Out Door." That time period anyway.

[milod]

All kidding aside...

 

I think it's incredible how "rock" in general became the "pop" of roughly half a century - more than half the time that we have had recorded music available to a large majority of the potential music audience. Again, I'm talking mostly of the Anglophone world, but even then... consider how rock has made interesting headway not only into other European national cultures, but also many Asian national cultures along with European "classical" music.

 

That latter is in large part why I'm frequently harping about the way that if they - other cultures - ain't playing guitar, especially classical, jazz and "rock," they'll likely be darned difficult to comprehend and negotiate with.

 

m

[FirstMeasure]

I believe part of the reason is Rock is so popular is cause anyone can play it. Folk or Scholar, it can be just as easy or just as difficult as the artist wants. Any size group can play it and the folk music element keeps the audience connected.

[milod]

I'm not so sure I'd agree that "anybody can play it."

 

Anybody can play some rock, but some is awfully complex and frankly doesn't lend itself well at all to "covers" or even reinterpretations.

 

Sultans of Swing? Behind the vocals perhaps but beyond?

 

Of course I've gotta admit I make it more difficult on myself doing solo type stuff...

 

m

[FirstMeasure]

That's just it. You can be really easy like the Troggs or early Kinks, or you can be Rush or Kansas and play extremely difficult stuff. It's all still rock.

[myspace.com/jessenoah]

http://www.sirius.com/classicvinyl

 

 

 

Beatles

Rolling Stones

Led Zeppelin

The Who

Creedence Clearwater Revival

Eric Clapton

Eagles

Doors

Crosby Stills Nash & Young

Elton John

 

 

 

http://www.sirius.com/classicrewind

 

Tom Petty

Van Halen

Aerosmith

Cars

Boston

Police

Journey

Genesis

John Mellencamp

AC/DC

 

http://www.sirius.com/boneyard

 

AC/DC

Van Halen

Metallica

Rush

Judas Priest

Aerosmith

Kiss

Guns & Roses

Ozzy Osbourne/Black Sabbath

Iron Maiden

 

 

that might help

[Izzy]

very interesting topic.

To me, oldies include 50s rock and classic rock cradles 60s-70s.

 

something really messed up happened to the 80s: MTV

yes, there are many fun rock songs from that time but the requisite, the need, for voices with acceptable faces, killed what I call rock. that rebellious stand-out rocker thing got killed by the fit-in trendy thing.

I don't think there is enough 80s material free of pretension to earn the title "classic rock". there were genres in the 80s that bypassed Mtv, but they were not rock by my definition. it was all metal and new age and pop.

that's why if any 80s song is a classic, its only because a band formed well before the 80s made it.

 

In the end, I think a song that withstands the test of time isn't classic...it's transcendent.

[pippy]

As a child growing up in the UK during the 1970's the 'current' music was always played on the BBC's "Radio 1" channel. What went before - the likes of the crooners of the 1940's and '50s etc., and the 'Big Band' style popular music of those decades were to be found on BBC's "Radio 2" channel.

 

All the stuff I was listening to on "Radio 1" back then can now be found on "Radio 2".

 

It seems to be an 'era' thing; twenty or thirty years after the music is released it has shifted from 'newbie' to 'venerable'

status.

 

And yes; The Eagles will be heard back-to-back with the Smashing Pumpkins.

[Murph]

I think it's incredible how "rock" in general became the "pop" of roughly half a century - more than half the time that we have had recorded music available to a large majority of the potential music audience.

 

Bingo milod. That's where I was going.....

 

At what point is the format simply too big to be put under one umbrella? And, having said that........

 

At what point will it be in danger of imploding because the opposite ends are actually in contrast with each other?

 

I mean Peace and Anarchy don't really go together.

 

:-

[charlie brown]

IMHO....Musical Catagories, are for those who feel the need to be "cool" or Apart, from the mainstream

(which is also a "catagory"). Catagories, like "religion," are created, to seperate...not bring together.

Music, is music...mostly, although "Rap," is more rhythm, than music...IMHO. But then, some "Rock"

could be classified as more rhythm oriented, than pure music, as well. So...??? "Classical," was the "Rock"

of it's era. As were many other forms of music, specific to their eras. They survive, or even thrive, still...

because they were good/Great Music! Having to catagorize, especially these days, seems like it's "Elitist"

mentality. Which, is also as "human" as anything else, we do. Got to catagorize, to seperate from the crowd,

and know what is "appropriate," for one's place, in society....or, just to be "different," from the others around

you. It's both imposed and self-imposed. ;>)

 

CB

[freak show]

How' date=' and where, is the format/genre going to end?

 

There is a good Classic Rock station in this area that goes from the Beatles to the early '90's. Very large playlist, not like some stations that play the same 40 songs over and over and over and over......

 

[...']

 

As an old radio jock, we always considered 50's stuff "Good Time" rock, ect, and "Classic Rock" pretty much started with the Beatles, but........

 

Where does it end, and another format kick in?

 

And what is it to be called?

 

Well, "Rock" isn't Country, and it isn't Jazz, and it isn't Disco. I think we can all hear a band and immediately know whether it's a rock band or not.

 

What's "Classic Rock"?

 

"Classic" in this context means:

 

"serving as a standard of excellence : of recognized value ("classic literary works")". [From: Miriam Webster]

 

So "Classic Rock" is Rock Music which has established itself as "of recognized value". There is also "Classic Jazz", "Classic Country", "Classic Literature", etc..

 

When the Beatles came out, they weren't Classic Rock, because no one knew whether they were a "flash in the pan" or a band which was going to stand the "test of time". Many thought it was all just a "fad".

 

If people decide that the Smashing Pumpkins or Pavement or Nirvana or .......... have set a "standard of excellence" and deserve to be listened to in the years to come, they too will belong to the category "Classic Rock".

 

The only way that Classic Rock will stop growing, is if great Rock bands stop appearing. I don't see that happening...

[milod]

I'm uncertain in ways at this point the degree to which "rock" is at question rather than "classic."

 

If we go from "Rock around the clock" through Chuck Berry to the Beatles and forward, there are, however, some factors that allow us to consider "rock" one sort of music.

 

1. Emphasis on the combo, even through there may be additional backing from an orchestra or whatever.

 

2. Emphasis on guitar.

 

3. Heavily rhythmic, probably with a back beat.

 

4. Rapidly changing "sounds" among different generations so each has its own "type" to differentiate from their parents' music or <grin> their grandparents'. Some of this is a matter of "covers" or reinterpretations of earlier music.

 

5. Sufficient broad-based appeal that certain pieces from 50 years ago remain popular "standards," such as Johnny B. Goode," Orbison's stuff, early Beatles and Rolling Stones, etc.

 

6. In spite of some crossover, there is usually a differentiation in rhythms and vocal styles from "country" although both have much in common on Numbers 1 through 5 above. Both at more complex musical levels borrow from "jazz."

 

7. Although some is generational, the cream rises to the top and can be cross generational - hence the "Rock Standards" that are as often performed and in as many different styles as the "standards" of "pop" or jazz.

 

m

[brundaddy]

It's a marketing term for radio music consumers. Advertisers want a certain demographic, hence KC & Sunshine Band on the oldies station.