shaved_ape Posted November 3, 2010 Author Share Posted November 3, 2010 Were those photos of SGs and Les Pauls with EMG pickups? I just threw up in my mouth. Yeah I usually don't like EMG's in the bridge, I really like the black hardware and colors they did, but I would more than likely pull them out to put some SD's or in there. I at least understand why they don't do full EMG's anymore. If I bought the Zakk Wylde I would probably still put SD's in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmjohnson Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Opinions are like @$$holes, everyone has one. All of this is simply my opinion and I would never expect anyone to agree with me. Everyone has their own tastes. I am a big guy, 6'3" 275 and I LOVE Gibsons because of their weight and sustain. I don't mind change, but why stop doing the SOLID body version of the Les Paul and do a chambered body? ... Ok, in YOUR opinion, why do Traditionals, which are weight-relieved and not chambered, suck? Is it (only) because they are weight-relieved and not solid? Seems typical Traditionals weigh 9#-10#s or more. IF this is the (only) problem you have with them, how much heavier would you like them to be? The historics are solid, and I don't think they weigh much more. (not sure though, but the ones I have tried seemed about the same) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Shaved_Ape what's offensive to me is the presumption that somehow all Gibson customers should feel the way you do and that(and you are not alone) it's an "us against them" attitude about the company. I'm not a part of the "us". What you're proposing may turn out to be for a niche market only; I haven't seen the marketing analysis and I would bet you haven't either although I won't presume. Maybe you're just trying to stir up some feces in which case I took the bait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowdiddley Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 I may be biased but I prefer Chilean wines. Only reds, the dryer, the better. Mojo I was attached to the Embassy in Santiago years back ('87/'88) and I loved the Casa de El Diablo (I think thats spelled correctly) cabs, very good wine. I'll have to say I was rather fond of the Chilean ladies as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigh Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Were those photos of SGs and Les Pauls with EMG pickups? I just threw up in my mouth. +1 Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riffster Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 What an effing thread!! I will never understand people that complain why Gibson or any other company has too many models or variations, just pick the one you like and buy it. If you can't find one you like with as many options as there are then YOU are the problem. When a model is not popular and does not sell the market will sort it out and will get discountinued, in turn they will try out a new model and see if it sells. That simple. Just buy a guitar and play it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRIFTER Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 What the hell happened to Gibson? Henry is what happened to Gibson. For the last 10+ years he has been riding the tide of his claimed success of saving the company from financial ruin. In fact there were vast numbers of corporations that were saved throughout the 90's not by the brilliance and foresight of their over rated CEO's but rather because those CEO's determined to utilize business models that could not fail in the short term and had to fail in the long term. Now that those practices have crashed the U.S. economy those CEO's have been exposed as the mere mortals they are. Mediocre men with huge egos that were nothing more than legends in their own minds. Ask yourself this question. Does history make the man or does the man make history. The answer of course is both. Some great men see the events happening around them and are able to perceive and act on what needs to be done. Others are swept into the limelight by great events and then shattered by them because they cannot see and will not listen. The acid test of Henrys leadership qualities is happening right now. As Gibson customers it is up to you to decide which type Henry is and to react accordingly as you see fit. We can talk all day about which guitar is better, or why the lack of quality and delivery, or technology vs tradition but this is the real deal issue and until it is solved the problem will persist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freak show Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Now that's a pretty guitar! What's the name of this color? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmjohnson Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Now that's a pretty guitar! What's the name of this color? Ummmm...Iverness Green (on an ES335). It's got just a LITTLE...sparkle flake to it in real life...very sharp! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaved_ape Posted November 3, 2010 Author Share Posted November 3, 2010 This is all interesting, but in YOUR opinion, why do Traditionals, which are weight-relieved and not chambered, suck? Is it because they are weight-relieved and not solid? Seems typical Traditionals weigh 9#-10#s or more. IF this is the problem you have with them, how much heavier would you like them to be? The historics are solid, and I don't think they weigh much more. (not sure though) They suck in my opinion just because it's the walking away from the tradition of just having a solid guitar. I like em pretty heavy. If it doesn't do much for weight, then why do a process that simply raises the price just for the sake of parading your technology around? I think the Les Paul is probably the most perfect design for a guitar, solid wood, and solid craftsmanship, why would you make it to where you can't just get a plain old fashioned les paul. I have an affinity for hand crafted guitar, I like PRS but I am really not into figured tops. But they offer solid colors in their traditional styles. I still have a large number of friends at Guitar Center who tell me that Les Pauls aren't selling as well since they did the traditional, people who have been there for 20+ years. Freak show I think it is Pelham Blue, awesome color. And I already stated that I don't expect everyone if anyone to agree, as I am looking at the "NEW" market, it seems like there are crappy options so I will buy used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bill Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 They suck in my opinion just because it's the walking away from the tradition of just having a solid guitar. Dude, Les Pauls where weight relieved years before the Traditional was introduced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dem00n Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Who put EMG's in a Gibson? (Besides you Motto. ) You might as well...ah **** it Ive gotten tired of this BS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damian Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Sweet! Which one would you want him to bring you 1st? I've been thinking more and more about an EVH. I LOVE the Iverness 335, but my primary issue with Gibson is most models I like all have the same 57 classics, so I fear sound too similiar to my LP & 336. jmg257, It would be the Paul Reed Smith L.E. 22 with soapbars; It is a thing of beauty, is built so well, and is a perfect match of beauty and practiciality. The LP Supreme as a second choice, not for practicality, but for it's beauty as well...Yes, I agree that those higher end EVHs are very nice guitars...It is interesting ( and is tied in with various themes here ) that my guitar collection is large enough that I can't count it's number, and I choose not too; point is jmg257, my collection includes many quality imports which play well but do not meet the criteria or standards of ' investment grade 'instruments. There's no need for me to highjak this thread or start a new one, but the concensus seems to be that some have issues with quality control, and some with the pricing stragaties of American made guitars.......May I ask jmg257, the prices you list seem to be the lowest one can find; are you saying that one can find these great guitars at lower prices ?? Thanks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmjohnson Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 I like em pretty heavy. If it doesn't do much for weight, then why do a process that simply raises the price just for the sake of parading your technology around? I think the Les Paul is probably the most perfect design for a guitar, solid wood, and solid craftsmanship, why would you make it to where you can't just get a plain old fashioned les paul. Likely because lighter weight mahogony, which would go into a true solid body guitar, is more expensive and harder to come by. I think people started complaining about the massive weight, so Gibson tried to figure out a way to keep the weight reasonable, keep the tonal qualities, and make use of 'cheaper' heavier mahogony blanks to keep the price reasonable. 1st stop was weight-relieved, next was chambered. The reasonable-weight higher-quality blanks go into the solid Historics (and others?), which also cost more then a Traditional. These would be your old fashioned Les Pauls. My B-I-L has a Norlin era LP, in a purple trans looking color. Must weigh over 11#s, seems like that is exactly what you miss! (which is fine!) I don't mind 8#-9.5# guitars, but 12#+ is a little much! I thought I had 'old man taste' because I was attracted to the solid Ebony and Gold Tops - I like that classic look. Then I started to gravitate to the flame tops, and figured I was getting more hip! Seems the opposite to how you see it! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damian Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Were those photos of SGs and Les Pauls with EMG pickups? I just threw up in my mouth. Yup...I agree Evol...Doesn't seem right...at all...but I'll stop there...and a plus one for you if I have any left...Quite the thread...one for the archives... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmjohnson Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 May I ask jmg257, the prices you list seem to be the lowest one can find; are you saying that one can find these great guitars at lower prices ?? Thanks... Damian, I shop at a store (small local chain) that the typical marked Gibson prices run $400-$1000+ below GC et. al. For instance: Gibson Les Paul Traditional Plus: $1899 (vs. $2,299.00) Gibson Custom ES-335 Satin Finish Electric Guitar $1749 (vs $2,249.00) Gibson CS-137cu $2049 (vs $2799) Gibson CS-137Classic $1499 (vs $2049) Gibson ES-335f $2250 (vs $3149) CS-336f $2625 (vs $3399) Fender Am Stndrd SSB Strat (Ash) $999 (vs $1149) Fender Am Stndrd Tele $879 (vs $1000) Gibsons have a big mark up, so they also have more room to deal; you can get better deals on them (i.e. bigger savings vs say Fender). My bud here at work has a PRS Custom 24 Artist Package something or other - LOVES it! And it is a REAL nice guitar! He got a good deal on it used, but in 100% great shape. Pretty pricey next to Gibson, but I wouldn't mind one either! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinner 13 Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 If Gibson made one of these for $4500 I would go through poverty for years to put it on layaway or find a credit card to buy it. Seriously? that is quite possibly the FUGLIEST LP I have ever seen. I am glad I missed this at 6am. I would have had to call out sick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmjohnson Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Hey, you can always put some of these on there...ya know...just to turn it up a bit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinner 13 Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Hey you can always put some of these on there...ya know...just to turn it up a bit... good god it just keeps getting worse. if this keeps up I may have to call in sick, or possibly dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaved_ape Posted November 3, 2010 Author Share Posted November 3, 2010 Likely because lighter weight mahogony, which would go into a true solid body guitar, is more expensive and harder to come by. I think people started complaining about the massive weight, so Gibson tried to figure out a way to keep the weight reasonable, keep the tonal qualities, and make use of 'cheaper' heavier mahogony blanks to keep the price reasonable. 1st stop was weight-relieved, next was chambered. The reasonable-weight higher-quality blanks go into the solid Historics (and others?), which also cost more then a Traditional. These would be your old fashioned Les Pauls. I don't mind 8#-9.5# guitars, but 12#+ is a little much! I thought I had 'old man taste' because I was attracted to the solid Ebony and Gold Tops - I like that classic look. Then I started to gravitate to the flame tops, and figured I was getting more hip! Seems the opposite to how you see it! :) I call them old man colors because younger people never like them, I have a friend with a gold top and he bought it because he loves led zepplin. I have no problems with the older colors, I just think there are too many black and white lp customs. Personally I think tobacco burst is probably the sexiest burst I have ever seen. I just want to see more solid "colors" in les pauls. I don't like blue trans, red trans, I think black trans is kind of cool. I like when they did manhattan blue burst, I just didn't like the tuners on it which is easily fixable. You don't have "old man taste" because the colors you pick, it's just when I sold those guitars they generally went to older players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryUK Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 Damian, I shop at a store (small local chain) that the typical marked Gibson prices run $400-$1000+ below GC et. al. For instance: Gibson Les Paul Traditional Plus: $1899 (vs. $2,299.00) Gibson Custom ES-335 Satin Finish Electric Guitar $1749 (vs $2,249.00) Gibson CS-137cu $2049 (vs $2799) Gibson CS-137Classic $1499 (vs $2049) Gibson ES-335f $2250 (vs $3149) CS-336f $2625 (vs $3399) Fender Am Stndrd SSB Strat (Ash) $999 (vs $1149) Fender Am Stndrd Tele $879 (vs $1000) We pay those prices in pounds!! Gibsons have a big mark up, so they also have more room to deal; you can get better deals on them (i.e. bigger savings vs say Fender). My bud here at work has a PRS SE 24 Artist Package something or other - LOVES it! And it is a REAL nice guitar! He got a good deal on it used, but in 100% great shape. Pretty pricey next to Gibson, but I wouldn't mind one either! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaved_ape Posted November 3, 2010 Author Share Posted November 3, 2010 Seriously? that is quite possibly the FUGLIEST LP I have ever seen. I am glad I missed this at 6am. I would have had to call out sick. LMAO! You can think that, it's just a color I like and I always wanted to see a color matched headstock. But I didn't just want to put a "Gibson" triangle design on a foreign guitar so I thought I would make it as obnoxious as possible. Why not? If I had put a Gibson logo and such on a Japanese guitar you would have given me the same answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinner 13 Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 LMAO! You can think that, it's just a color I like and I always wanted to see a color matched headstock. But I didn't just want to put a "Gibson" triangle design on a foreign guitar so I thought I would make it as obnoxious as possible. Why not? If I had put a Gibson logo and such on a Japanese guitar you would have given me the same answer. yes, ugly is ugly no matter how you shake it. just cause she has "personality" don't make her pretty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShredAstaire Posted November 3, 2010 Share Posted November 3, 2010 yes, ugly is ugly no matter how you shake it. This. That blue is awful lol!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaved_ape Posted November 3, 2010 Author Share Posted November 3, 2010 It's just a generic blue I picked in photoshop. I am slightly color blind so it looks blue to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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