Kevk20 Posted January 19 Share Posted January 19 Hi All, I am in the fortunate position that I will shortly be buying a new J45. However I am torn between the Standard and the rather nice J45 Red Spruce Tri-Burst. The latter is listed as a Gibson Custom Shop offering on Gibson’s European website. It has the standard nitrocellulose gloss finish. The Red Spruce version is approx €700 more. My question is simple: is the Red Spruce Tri-Burst worth the upcharge given users’ experiences? Thanks Kevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave F Posted January 19 Share Posted January 19 The number one thing I love about Gibson’s are their Standard sunburst. The darker the better. So I am not a good person to ask. I’ve had the triburst but personally I would prefer it on a Les Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAMELEYE Posted January 19 Share Posted January 19 I like the tone produced by the standard's regular sitka top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buc McMaster Posted January 19 Share Posted January 19 Acoustic guitars are such individuals (as are players) it is near impossible to point out one as better than another without making an in-person, hands-on assessment. In general a red spruce top is considered an upgrade in top wood, as is thermally treated spruce. But these are not hard and fast rules and are very subjective. If you could sit with both and play them it should be easy to say one suits your style and ear better than the other but it can not be logically said that the Red Spruce Tri-Color is definitively the better instrument. Viva la difference! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J185cat Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 The general thought is that Adi has much more dynamic range with very clear individual notes with separation. It was the wood used on most of the pre-war “golden era guitars.” Like others have said, each guitar is unique unto itself so listening would be best. I can say that my favorite guitar that I own is ab AJ with Adi top. Is that because of the Adi? Hard to say. I’ve got some Sitka topped that are special also. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
62burst Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 Another vote here for Sitka, as in the Standard you're considering. Maybe if you wanted to do some hard punchy bluegrass runs, then Adi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red 333 Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 If I could not audition them myself, and the choice was between Sitka and Adirondack spruce, all other things being equal, I'd choose Adirondack every time. Red 333 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 18 hours ago, Buc McMaster said: Acoustic guitars are such individuals (as are players) it is near impossible to point out one as better than another without making an in-person, hands-on assessment. I'm with Buc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortyearspickn Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 Assuming the price difference is not part of your consideration, and not knowing if this is going to be your one and only, "forever' guitar - or just one you'll likely move on later, hoping to not lose money .... I would go with the Custom Shop. I would guess there are 100 'standards out there for every CS - and that there is a little more attention to detail when they are building them. Full Disclosure - I have a J45CS and absolutely love it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 (edited) I have heard it said that spruce is spruce, get over it. What all are reacting to more than likely has less to do with the species of spruce than the fact Bozeman goes with two different bracing footprints. What they call their "AJ" or "Vintage" bracing found in most CS guitars sports a wider angle than that which they go with in their Standard models." Plus, CS guitars often have nuked tops which results in a rather hefty upcharge much the same way farm grown red spruce did when it first started re-appearing. Edited January 20 by zombywoof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrairieDog Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 (edited) 1 hour ago, fortyearspickn said: Assuming the price difference is not part of your consideration, and not knowing if this is going to be your one and only, "forever' guitar - or just one you'll likely move on later, hoping to not lose money .... I would go with the Custom Shop. I would guess there are 100 'standards out there for every CS - and that there is a little more attention to detail when they are building them. Full Disclosure - I have a J45CS and absolutely love it. I agree. It’s a great guitar. Sure, it’s always best to play, but really, look how many folks end up perfectly happy with what gets delivered. It’s not like every other j45 gets returned. So the odds say either one will be great, but the rarer one will hold more value for you, even if you never intend to sell, your heirs might appreciate it. And be sure to let it settle in for a week or two, even if you think there might be a problem. I was ready to return a guitar I did get to play because when I got it home it sounded completely off. Packed it back up for a couple weeks until I went into town again, then pulled it out to double check and now I can’t believe how close I came to giving back the richest sounding guitar in the group (don’t tell my DIF). It just needed to get re-adjusted to the new digs. On a related note, yesterday in the case at our GC there was a sparkly, new 5K guitar. Not the usual fare for our shop. Our guy told us the story: A fellow ordered it to upgrade from his entry level 100.00 type starter. Got it delivered and was horrified. The next day he was back in the shop to return it, bringing along his old one to prove it sounded better, and have everyone else confirm it. I don’t think the guy had it for 24 hours. The poor thing was probably still suffering from jet lag and whiplash from being yanked all over the place. No wonder it sounded like crap. Edited January 20 by PrairieDog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsongs Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 I think I’d go with the CS if it sounds equally as good & it’s price is in the same ballpark… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevk20 Posted January 20 Author Share Posted January 20 5 hours ago, fortyearspickn said: Assuming the price difference is not part of your consideration, and not knowing if this is going to be your one and only, "forever' guitar - or just one you'll likely move on later, hoping to not lose money .... I would go with the Custom Shop. I would guess there are 100 'standards out there for every CS - and that there is a little more attention to detail when they are building them. Full Disclosure - I have a J45CS and absolutely love it. Hi - thanks for the input. Correct - price difference is not an issue. I intend to hang onto this guitar indefinitely so it’s important to me that I’m getting the best of Bozeman. I would like to re-frame my question: as I’m likely getting a Custom Shop Red Spruce build, my question is now a very simple one - traditional vintage sunburst or Tri-Burst? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red 333 Posted January 20 Share Posted January 20 (edited) 23 hours ago, zombywoof said: I have heard it said that spruce is spruce, get over it. What all are reacting to more than likely has less to do with the species of spruce than the fact Bozeman goes with two different bracing footprints. What they call their "AJ" or "Vintage" bracing found in most CS guitars sports a wider angle than that which they go with in their Standard models." Plus, CS guitars often have nuked tops which results in a rather hefty upcharge much the same way farm grown red spruce did when it first started re-appearing. I have two True Vintage models, one with Sitka (SJ), and one with Adi (J-45). Both have the Advanced Jumbo style bracing. Both all hog, Both are good, but the J-45 is just more responsive, which I believe is characteristic of Adirondack Spruce. My four favorite acoustics out of the eighteen or so I have currently are Red Spruce topped (and also have AJ bracing). Also among the eighteen guitars are two others that are Sitka topped with AJ bracing, a rosewood and maple AJ, so I definitely think there's something a little extra about Adi. At least something a little extra that appeals to me. YMMV. Red 333 Edited January 21 by Red 333 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livemusic Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 As for color, if you're asking for personal opinion, mine is traditional vintage sunburts, not the tri-color. But beauty is in the eye of the beholder. As for retaining value, I have no idea how the market treats those colors. I just think the old sunburst is stunning when done well. Maybe some exist, but I haven't seen any Gibson not done well. I have lucked up buying some guitars without playing (with a return policy) them first but much prefer playing first. My last two J45s, different models, were bought online and both are awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorrisrownSal Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 Im with Red. ADI on a J45 with advanced bracing works real well. Does the tri burst have advanced bracing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J185cat Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 FWIW, George Gruhn of Gruhn’s Guitars has stated that he believes Adi is more important than back and side woods and the real secret of the pre-war guitars that are so highly esteemed. May be, I certainly don’t have his experience with them to say. I just know I love the two I have with Adi. Every guitar is its own unique creation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zombywoof Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 Here is a question for ya'll. Why is it that Gibson never went with red spruce bracing from the 1920s up to the end of WWII. I know that modern luthiers such as John Greven swore by it when it came to voicing guitars with red spruce tops. My guess though is that is that despite all the hoopla attached to pre-War Gibsons, "tone crafting" was not the highest thing on their priority list. In the years after WWI surplus quartersawn Sitka aircraft spruce was cheap and plentiful. But I also believe that Sitka has the advantage of bending before it breaks meaning it would flex more as the guitar top settled in. So basically, it would translate into a low return rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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