Have you ever played a Epiphone that plays better than a Gibson?

[lucille64]

My point of view is..... if you have the true talent to really play a guitar then as long as the instrument your playing is of decent quality build and set up you can make good music on it no matter what it says on the headstock.

 

Residual value down the road, well that's ok for those that are looking for that in their instrument.

 

If a player finds any particular guitar that "speaks to him personally" then play the crap out of it and make great music.

I own both name brand guitars and some non- name brand ones. Some play and sound better than the others regardless of which one says what on the headstock. Certain one's for different styles of music as well.

 

I always pick my Lucille up first for almost everything I play. But that's me.

 

Of course it has been completely redone by Forrester Kustom Guitars with every component being either Factory Gibson or Switchcraft, CTS, Jensen and Golden Age Parson's Street PAF humbuckers as well as a beautifully hand made and polished vintage bone nut by Mike Forrester.

 

Just so it's clear it isn't a stock Epiphone any longer by any means.

 

 

My two cents :)

[milod]

I think Lucille makes a good point. Some guitars simply speak to you.

 

I also think that each of us will get better "music" out of some guitars than others - which is one reason I have really mixed personal emotions on the concept of different guitars for different playing styles.

 

It's interesting.

 

There is a different geometry, literally, between the player and the guitar that's of different size, shape, scale, fretboard radius and balance. The ES175 and its clones, and a couple of small body flattops I have, seem to give me better "music" all-around than other guitars - and I have a few.

 

My quandry is twofold. First I prefer taking a semihollow or a flattop "out" in the winter; winter's part one, part two is that I simply don't play them with the degree of "flow" I get from a different shape of guitar, even with the same scale. I have two semis, both are nice and sound quite nice the way I play - but neither quite flows.

 

That's not the guitar, it's me.

 

So... should one take the guitar(s) that fit best for the player, or should one take the guitar that works best under weather conditions or "style" of music? The semi or SG type certainly are less likely to feed back; the AEs seem to work quite well for rhythm/old time, the big bodies, and the small bodies work very nicely for about any solo work.

 

<grin> Life's interesting.

 

m

[capmaster]

...

If a player finds any particular guitar that "speaks to him personally" then play the crap out of it and make great music.

...

[thumbup]

 

...

 

...

I always pick my Lucille up first for almost everything I play. But that's me.

 

Of course it has been completely redone by Forrester Kustom Guitars with every component being either Factory Gibson or Switchcraft, CTS, Jensen and Golden Age Parson's Street PAF humbuckers as well as a beautifully hand made and polished vintage bone nut by Mike Forrester.

 

Just so it's clear it isn't a stock Epiphone any longer by any means.

...

My two cents :)

Basically they are nice from the factory, too. I even considered buying one and checked out three of these, but sadly the varitone switch tended to becoming loose no matter how hard the shop service tried to fix that... :(

 

 

I think Lucille makes a good point. Some guitars simply speak to you.

 

I also think that each of us will get better "music" out of some guitars than others - which is one reason I have really mixed personal emotions on the concept of different guitars for different playing styles.

 

It's interesting.

 

There is a different geometry, literally, between the player and the guitar that's of different size, shape, scale, fretboard radius and balance. The ES175 and its clones, and a couple of small body flattops I have, seem to give me better "music" all-around than other guitars - and I have a few.

 

My quandry is twofold. First I prefer taking a semihollow or a flattop "out" in the winter; winter's part one, part two is that I simply don't play them with the degree of "flow" I get from a different shape of guitar, even with the same scale. I have two semis, both are nice and sound quite nice the way I play - but neither quite flows.

 

That's not the guitar, it's me.

 

So... should one take the guitar(s) that fit best for the player, or should one take the guitar that works best under weather conditions or "style" of music? The semi or SG type certainly are less likely to feed back; the AEs seem to work quite well for rhythm/old time, the big bodies, and the small bodies work very nicely for about any solo work.

 

<grin> Life's interesting.

 

m

As I posted yesterday into another thread in a different context, I am seeking for tone as a singer and songwriter. There are songs requiring piezos for acoustic tones, vibratos, single coils, humbuckers, or more of these points. So I will have to deal with the particular playability of the instruments providing the required features. My music rules, and it's worth to me getting acquainted with different idiosyncrasies of different guitars. ;)

[Scott0]

what does it mean to have a guitar speak to you?

 

I'm not sure I've had that experience, especially with a guitar straight off the wall/out the box. I'm on 15 guitars now. Certainly, after getting them squared away, set-up, dialed-in, I enjoy them and they mean a lot to me but I can't recall having 1 speak to me.

[lucille64]

Basically they are nice from the factory, too. I even considered buying one and checked out three of these, but sadly the varitone switch tended to becoming loose no matter how hard the shop service tried to fix that... :(

 

I experienced that also on the original Varitone so I had it replaced with an original Gibson ES355 one. Hasn't happened again as of yet.

 

As to having an instrument "speak to one self" it's merely a matter of a term to described becoming one with the instrument and that particular instrument becoming one's favorite conduit to expressing what your musical soul is pouring out.

[Jayyj]

I've worked in repair shops and in retail, so played 100s of each brand over the years. My opinion is that many Epis are a lot of guitar for the money, and many Gibsons rather underwhelming at the amount they cost, and I think this fact biases our opinion towards them more than we reason. We also form emotional attachments to our own instruments, which gives them the upper hand when comparing to other instruments.

 

When it comes down to it if I pick up an Epiphone with upgraded pickups, fret dress and pro set up, and a equivalent Gibson model also set up correctly and price is not part of the equasion, I still expect the Gibson to perform better than the Epi. I've played Epis I thought were exceptional, and Gibsons I've not liked at all, and I'm sure every now and then I'd find the odd specific pairing where I prefer the Epi, but by law of averages I'd consider Gibson to be the better instruments regardless of hardware and setup. Last year I picked up an old Samick Sheraton that had a neck profile I loved, and fitted it out with handmade pickups, Bigsby, Grovers, vintage caps etc. It's a beautiful guitar and I had a blast with it for a few months... then one day I picked up my old Gibson ES355 for a few minutes and now the Epi is relegated to wall hanging status. I'd love it to be true the Epis are as good, and I have no love for Gibson as a company, but I can see a consistant difference between the two and it's significant enough that I'll keep my money tied up in the US versions.

 

Japanese and vintage Epis are a whole other ballgame.

[Drog]

Ok, to answer the question, " have You ever played a Epiphone that plays better than a Gibson"? Yes

 

A properly setup instrument should be a good player, no matter the make. Now, with that said. Less expensive guitars will take a lot more to make them proper and perhaps more money put into it. But, you can make them good playing instruments.

 

Personally, I would still take a Gibson over any Epiphone, but I don't automatically like every Gibson I play either. But this is my choice.

 

Find a guitar that feels good to YOU, get a quality setup and if needed replace any inadequate parts, then enjoy playing that instrument.

[Thomse]

What's the difference, just hand me a guitar and let's jam!

Great plan ScottO . All guitars are what you make of them.

[capmaster]

what does it mean to have a guitar speak to you?

 

I'm not sure I've had that experience, especially with a guitar straight off the wall/out the box. I'm on 15 guitars now. Certainly, after getting them squared away, set-up, dialed-in, I enjoy them and they mean a lot to me but I can't recall having 1 speak to me.

To my feel, a guitar speaks to me when I tend to change unwittingly from a player to a listener, beyond the attitude to control my own playing, just enjoying. I think this happens when an instrument does more than I thought I could make it do. This happens fairly often to me, in particular when listening to the pure tone, without EQing, just amped up in a HiFi manner, regardless if using magnetic or piezo pickups, e. g. through a full range acoustic amplification system. Even my own instruments are capable of surprising me again and again.

 

This phenomenon may also occur playing an instrument with an inferior setup to my experience. I also feel it when a guitar is strung apart from my desire with respect to string make, material and gauges. It's a thing of feeling how the instrument as such supports my playing if I may say so.

[Scott0]

Hey, I appreciate the replies on what it means to have a guitar speak to you, I think I can see where you are coming from better.

 

I can certainly point to 2 guitars that did NOT speak to me lol I knew pretty much within days that they were not for me. Other guitars were fantastic but for various reasons I could not play as I wanted, like the Sorrento reissue. SUper fantastic guitar but not for me at this stage of my ability and the songs I play, I need a lot of access to the higher frets.

 

But as for keepers, there are many I've played and tried out that came home with me/didn't get returned. SOme of those work perfectly for me completely stock- my Epi LP tribute plus, Gibson LP Signature T, or Fender Highway One Strat, for instance, all totally stock and never setup other than my adjusting the action a bit and I love those guitars too!

 

On the other hand, I love my Casinos. But when I first got them I didn't, I had to change absolutely everything on them, the only original parts left on em is the body. Now I love them. Same with my Epi '56 goldtop LP reissue, a killer killer killer guitar, but only after I changed everything on it.

[Bender 4 Life]

My old GLP plays great, but has a few badly worn frets

My SG Std. is wonderful....issue free

Flying-V.....plays great, but as ergonomically effed up as a square wheeled bicycle

 

other GREAT guitars

 

Guild Newark St Savoy, plays great sounds great, but it's like dancing w/a fat woman.......

Epi. '62/50 Sheraton, WONDERFUL guitar.....no issues

American Deluxe Strat....GREAT guitar....but weighs more than most of my LPs

 

the guitar i've been grabbing most lately is a Classic Player '60s Strat, or a Standard Mexican "Fat Strat"(humbucker bridge)......both handle like a Porsche, sound like Gabriels Horn, don't weigh too much, and are inexpensive enough to not worry about marking.

[capmaster]

...

American Deluxe Strat....GREAT guitar....but weighs more than most of my LPs.

...

Wow! Seems to be a rare beast in my opinion. Except for a single very heavy one, the Strats I know including the four of mine vary fairly much in weight but are within the typical SG weight range.

[Alan7140]

In the 1980's I bought a Gibson Gold Top reissue - it was one of the more expensive regular Gibson models at the time and the thing was an absolute pig. Too heavy, the neck wasn't straight, and the intonation was way up the phutz as a result. Cost me quite a premium to have everything straightened out and set up, but it wasn't ever a guitar I grew to like.

 

I now have a 11/2011-made Epi ES-345 that I've completely rebuilt hardware-wise, but the chassis itself was as good as they come and the thing plays like a dream. Best value guitar I've ever had, and that's still the case after all the TV Jones, CTS, Switchcraft, Klusons, Chet Bigsby handle etc etc bits were swapped in, and which cost in total with the guitar substantially over two grand less than a new standard dot Gibson ES-335.

 

So I can't speak for Epi vs Gibson in general, but with the two guitars I have played, the Epi ran rings around the Gibson.

[Bender 4 Life]

Wow! Seems to be a rare beast in my opinion. Except for a single very heavy one, the Strats I know including the four of mine vary fairly much in weight but are within the typical SG weight range.

 

Lord I Wish !!!

5 Strats here....the only 2 even close to my ('10) SG Std. are the 2 Asian Paulowana bodied models.

[Thomse]

Yes i have . And i am sure you all have

[bigneil]

Gibsons in general are better made with more attention to detail and are built from much higher quality materials, but that does not guarantee that they will play any better than an Epiphone or any other cheaper brand guitar. I think it probably means that a Gibson is less likely to be a lemon but there are still plenty of them out there. I tried out a series of both Epiphones and Gibson in the Guitar store in Glasgow a couple of years ago and every single Epiphone felt horrible (largely due to setup issues) several of the Gibsons were the same (high action, fret buzz, poor nut cut etc) ... but there was one, a sort of Tobacco burst 335 dot, everything about it was simply perfection: the body shape, the sound, the set up, the neck width/shape, the size of the frets and the fretboard radius.

 

Everything was perfect except the bloody price tag !

 

This experience eventually led me to look for a nice 335 style guitar that I could actually afford, eventually found a second hand washburn one that just seemed to fit me.

[Scott Marlowe]

Reminds of the fact that every time I play test guitars at GC, the used ones play better than the new ones. They're always better setup, no matter if it's a Gibson, Fender, Epi, PRS etc etc. The used ones had someone do something on them and most the time that something made them play better. My MiM Jazz bass was setup beautifully when I bought it and it was half the price of a new MiM Jazz bass. I just can't see buying new if a good used guitar of the same brand and model is sitting there for half the price, and likely better setup anyway.

[valtyr]

Yes, I have played some Epi's that played better than some Gibsons. You can set most decent guitars up to play well. I had a Wildkat that I set up and it played every bit as well as my Gibsons, and better than many I have tried in stores.

 

For me, the biggest diff between the Epiphones and Gibsons I have owned has been that I prefer the electronics in the Gibsons.

[1967AWV]

I can feel a difference between my 2005 epiphone '67 Flying V reissue and my SG. Action ,tone, just a general feel.

 

But I couldn't say it's because its a Gibson or an untouched vintage'69 Gibson SG- P90's etc. I'm still refining my V's setup and It's getting pretty close.

[charlie brown]

Yep!

 

 

 

CB

 

OHHH, Wait!!

 

 

 

CB

[Not-Too-Late]

 

OHHH, Wait!!

 

 

 

CB

 

Of the two, which do you prefer? I'm finding myself leaning towards the Lucille, but haven't had an opportunity to try one as yet. Does it give a nice warm sound suited for jazz? Hopefully one day a store in my area will have one.

 

Cheers

Wayne

[charlie brown]

Of the two, which do you prefer? I'm finding myself leaning towards the Lucille, but haven't had an opportunity to try one as yet. Does it give a nice warm sound suited for jazz? Hopefully one day a store in my area will have one.

 

Cheers

Wayne

 

Both can do "Jazz," or any other style music. I Love both, equally...truly! They have very

different necks, however. So "Lucille's" neck feels very full, after playing the Sheri, which

except for my Ric-12 string, has the thinest '60's style neck of any guiar I own. Tone wise,

their a bit different, due to full size humbuckers vs. Mini-humbuckers. But, it's no big deal,

either way. That's what volume and tone contols are for. And, with no "f" holes,

"Lucille" does have a bit more of an "edge" regarding less feedback.

 

Your best option, is to try both! If you have smaller hands, the AIUSA Sheraton would probably

be the better choice. My hands are "normal size" (whatever that is)...not large, not small, and

I can go back and forth, with relative ease. Besides, all my guitars have a wide variety of

neck shapes, so that's never been an issue, with me, really.

 

Good Luck, hope you find your own preference!

 

CB

[Bender 4 Life]

I can feel a difference between my 2005 epiphone '67 Flying V reissue and my SG. Action ,tone, just a general feel.

 

But I couldn't say it's because its a Gibson or an untouched vintage'69 Gibson SG- P90's etc. I'm still refining my V's setup and It's getting pretty close.

 

the way you're holding the V in your avi.......i've GOT to try that !!!!

might get a LOT more playtime now...........

[Not-Too-Late]

Both can do "Jazz," or any other style music. I Love both, equally...truly! They have very

different necks, however. So "Lucille's" neck feels very full, after playing the Sheri, which

except for my Ric-12 string, has the thinest '60's style neck of any guiar I own. Tone wise,

their a bit different, due to full size humbuckers vs. Mini-humbuckers. But, it's no big deal,

either way. That's what volume and tone contols are for. And, with no "f" holes,

"Lucille" does have a bit more of an "edge" regarding less feedback.

 

Your best option, is to try both! If you have smaller hands, the AIUSA Sheraton would probably

be the better choice. My hands are "normal size" (whatever that is)...not large, not small, and

I can go back and forth, with relative ease. Besides, all my guitars have a wide variety of

neck shapes, so that's never been an issue, with me, really.

 

Good Luck, hope you find your own preference!

 

CB

 

Thanks CB. Just hoping to find one in a store so I can try it. One of the sales staff at GC told me to keep an eye on the used section as a Gibson Lucille came in awhile back, but it was snapped up right away. Get this, he told me that who ever owned it had changed out the original pups for something cheaper - duh! I told him, why would anyone change anything, for that matter, on a Gibson. Don't see the need. I guess he/she preferred the sound from the cheaper pups. Whatever floats your boat I guess.

 

Cheers

Wayne

[charlie brown]

Well, to each his/her own. But, I've only changed pickups, once! In my 2000 LP Classic,

I changed out the Ceramic's for Classic '57 (neck), and '57+ (bridge). "I" much prefer

the '57's to the much hotter Ceramic's. But, that's just me.

 

CB