Has Clapton Lost the Plot?

[Sgt. Pepper]

36 minutes ago, duane v said:

Funny thing is I haven't been sick with anything going on two years since wearing masks in indoor public settings (1.5 years). Either those damn masks really work, or I have become better at washing my hands more often.... or both.

I think after all is said and done, I will continue to wear masks in stores and only use outside seating at restaurants. I now always have a bottle of Purrell whenever I leave the house.

If one thing good has come out of it for me, I have cut down on picking my nose and biting my fingernails. 

 I got the shot but don't wear a mask unless I have to. Some people have no shot and don't mask up and some have never gotten it. So who is to say what works and what doesn't? 4 my relatives have the shot and told me they masked up,  and went down to the cess-poll that is Disneyworld and got it so . . . 

Edited January 26, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper

[Sgt. Pepper]

46 minutes ago, duane v said:

We may never know

You are right. What government would admit that to the world that you unleased this. 

[ksdaddy]

I stopped getting multiple colds (and sometimes flu) every year when I quit drinking in 2003. I can’t remember having a cold (and certainly not flu) since I quit smoking in 2014. I got the JJ jab in April because my employer (USDA) said I wouldn’t have to wear a mask at work. That lasted a month. We have to wear masks at work now, no customers inside the building, and twice in the past two weeks, two of our employees’ wives got the rona and that made us shut the office for 3 days each time. Teleworking sucks. Mind you, we have 5 employees in my field office. 6 if you count the director of a sister agency, co-located in our office who refused the jab and has teleworked ever since. 

[Sgt. Pepper]

3 minutes ago, ksdaddy said:

I stopped getting multiple colds (and sometimes flu) every year when I quit drinking in 2003. I can’t remember having a cold (and certainly not flu) since I quit smoking in 2014. I got the JJ jab in April because my employer (USDA) said I wouldn’t have to wear a mask at work. That lasted a month. We have to wear masks at work now, no customers inside the building, and twice in the past two weeks, two of our employees’ wives got the rona and that made us shut the office for 3 days each time. Teleworking sucks. Mind you, we have 5 employees in my field office. 6 if you count the director of a sister agency, co-located in our office who refused the jab and has teleworked ever since. 

Teleworking was great for me while it lasted. I can play a guitar at home, but its kind of hard to get away with it at work. Same happened at NASA when I was there,  you could unmask two weeks after your second shot. and then back to masks. 

How are our soldiers going to able to fight in a War, excuse me opposing Army you need to have you masks on.

[ksdaddy]

6 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

Teleworking was great for me while it lasted. I can play a guitar at home…..

Fact. I just have trouble with the system we now use for generating the various maps for conservation planning, threatened and endangered species screening, priority areas etc. Our old system worked well, put out a good product, and I could crank out a lot of good quality work from my kitchen. Our new system…. No. 
 

213 calendar days, 149 work days, and about 45 of them might just be used as vacation time. Then I can hermit.

[Sgt. Pepper]

2 minutes ago, ksdaddy said:

Fact. I just have trouble with the system we now use for generating the various maps for conservation planning, threatened and endangered species screening, priority areas etc. Our old system worked well, put out a good product, and I could crank out a lot of good quality work from my kitchen. Our new system…. No. 
 

213 calendar days, 149 work days, and about 45 of them might just be used as vacation time. Then I can hermit.

I was just a dumb maintenance electrician that went home with my desk top computer. One thing I will never miss is all out fun Teams or Zoom or whatever video thing you use for tele-meetings.

[ksdaddy]

With one solitary exception, I have dodged the Teams meetings. 
 

Thank you Jesus. 

[Sgt. Pepper]

40 minutes ago, ksdaddy said:

With one solitary exception, I have dodged the Teams meetings. 
 

Thank you Jesus. 

We have one every morning at 6:45 am till whenever it ended. Same stuff. We're still at Stage 3 here at NASA which means mado-mask and teleworking if you can. Then blah blah blah for about 45 more mins about useless stuff. We still had f-in Teams meeting when we returned to work even though the 30 or so employees I would be around after the meeting working in close proximity till it was time to go home. What a joke.

Edited January 26, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper

[sparquelito]

22 hours ago, zigzag said:

Numbers don't lie, sparky. Just because you don't like it or are confused by it doesn't make it a lie. While everyone may have an agenda, not everyone stands to profit, and there are many who are just trying to do the right thing with the information they have. Just ask the doctors and nurses on the front lines. We are in big trouble if no one is credible.

The problems started when it became political. Politics screws up everything. When the polio vaccine came out, people lined up without their political BS, got the vaccination, and polio was virtually wiped out. Thank you science.

Though we may be dealing with covid now like we deal with the flu, there is plenty of  evidence that the vaccine is working to significantly reduce the severity. The data proves that people are better off by just shutting TFU, and getting the vaccine. Try to be part of the solution instead of part of the problem.

 

I understand the 'numbers' just fine, friend zigzag. 

My foundation concern is with:
* trusting the source of 'the numbers'
* the ever evolving changing, conflicting nature of 'the numbers'
and,
* the very real fact that politicians and news media have been cavalierly tossing out 'the numbers' since day one, with little-to-no scientific foundation for their politically-driven, self-serving, power-aggrandizing 'numbers'. 

It's important to point out to you that my entire gripe is with the government and the media expecting people to blindly toe the line to serve their power-grabbing political agenda. 

I'm not an anti-vaxxer, friend zigzag. 
I have taken the vaccination. 
I took it back in April. 

I'm not opposed to people, of their own free will, taking the booster shot.
I have taken the booster. 
I took it a month and a half ago. 

I'm not opposed to people, of their own free will, wearing the mask. 
If they believe the mask will serve some purpose. 

I'm not blind to the very real problems with this family of viruses. 
I've been infected with covid at least twice. 
Early on in the first days of the thing, and then again two weeks ago. 
(Survived it just fine, and thank you for asking.)
I have lost friends to complications from covid. 
I'm not an idiot.   I don't disbelieve the notion of the dangers of this family of viruses. 
It's just that I absolutely don't trust politicians or TV talking heads when they open their insincere mouths about it. 

As far as being a part of the solution instead of part of the problem,  perhaps you and I could discuss, offline or on the open boards, exactly what the problem even is. 
And what in God's creation the solution could even possibly be. 

😶
 

[Sgt. Pepper]

1 hour ago, sparquelito said:

I understand the 'numbers' just fine, friend zigzag. 

My foundation concern is with:
* trusting the source of 'the numbers'
* the ever evolving changing, conflicting nature of 'the numbers'
and,
* the very real fact that politicians and news media have been cavalierly tossing out 'the numbers' since day one, with little-to-no scientific foundation for their politically-driven, self-serving, power-aggrandizing 'numbers'. 

It's important to point out to you that my entire gripe is with the government and the media expecting people to blindly toe the line to serve their power-grabbing political agenda. 

I'm not an anti-vaxxer, friend zigzag. 
I have taken the vaccination. 
I took it back in April. 

I'm not opposed to people, of their own free will, taking the booster shot.
I have taken the booster. 
I took it a month and a half ago. 

I'm not opposed to people, of their own free will, wearing the mask. 
If they believe the mask will serve some purpose. 

I'm not blind to the very real problems with this family of viruses. 
I've been infected with covid at least twice. 
Early on in the first days of the thing, and then again two weeks ago. 
(Survived it just fine, and thank you for asking.)
I have lost friends to complications from covid. 
I'm not an idiot.   I don't disbelieve the notion of the dangers of this family of viruses. 
It's just that I absolutely don't trust politicians or TV talking heads when they open their insincere mouths about it. 

As far as being a part of the solution instead of part of the problem,  perhaps you and I could discuss, offline or on the open boards, exactly what the problem even is. 
And what in God's creation the solution could even possibly be. 

😶
 

I think even smart people with big fancy degrees don’t understand it. The best we came up with is a mask and a vax they was pushed through faster than Miley Cyrus can twerk on Robin Thicke’s man meat and shoved down our throats. Was it approved before people were getting it. Nope.

So many were Guinea Pigs.

Edited January 27, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper

[sparquelito]

58 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

I think even smart people with big fancy degrees don’t understand it. The best we came up with is a mask and a vax they was pushed through faster than Miley Cyrus can twerk on Robin Thicke’s man meat and shoved down our throats. Was it approved before people were getting it.

You hit the nail on the head, Sgt. Pepper. 

The mistake that most pin-heads in government make is assuming that when a problem arises (or is invented and foisted upon us)  that they must do something. 

Throughout the entire covid debacle, nobody needed the US government to do anything except behave responsibly in a non-partisan fashion, take the time to collect valid, verifiable facts, and then offer good and sage advice. 

They have demonstrated time and time again that they are incapable of doing any of those things. 

They did, by every standard and metric, the exact opposite. 
They used this crisis to destroy their political enemies. 
They used this crisis to destroy businesses and harm a stellar economy. 
They used this crisis to sway an election. 
They use this endless crisis to control the masses and keep them cowed and fearful. Timid, even. 
And they continue to perpetuate and milk this crisis to build and grow their power and their personal wealth. 

It's unconscionable. 
😕

Edited January 27, 2022 by sparquelito

[Sgt. Pepper]

1 minute ago, sparquelito said:

You hit the nail on the head, Sgt. Pepper. 

The mistake that most pin-heads in government make is assuming that when a problem arises (or is invented and foisted upon us)  that they must do something. 

Throughout the entire covid debacle, nobody needed the US government to do anything except behave responsibly in a non-partisan fashion, take the time to collect valid, verifiable facts, and then offer good and sage advice. 

They have demonstrated time and time again that they are incapable of doing any of those things. 

They did, by every standard and metric, the exact opposite. 
They used this crisis to destroy their political enemies. 
They used this crisis to destroy businesses and harm a stellar economy. 
They used this crisis to sway an election. 
And they continue to perpetuate and milk this crisis to build and grow their power and their personal wealth. 

It's unconscionable. 
😕

Sometimes I am not just that a-hole that doesn't own any Gibson's and listens to that Zappa guy.

[zigzag]

I stand by everything I said in all of my posts and the numbers, sparky, and I disagree with your opinions on the motives of the all-inclusive  "media" and  "government." I just don't happen to be as cynical. But, my beef is not with you. My problem is with anti-vacciners. I realize that they have their rights and their personal freedoms. But, IMO, the overwhelming majority them are not acting in their own best interests or the interests of others. I have no sympathy for them. I believe if everyone had acted more responsibly early, this pandemic might not have been as devastating and deaths could have been prevented. And I don't need a scientist or data to back me on this (even though they do), just my own common sense. I find it interesting that those in the highest offices in the state and federal levels (and there is little doubt whom I'm referring to) were speaking out against vaccines publicly, but privately, they were getting them, all while promoting unsafe and unproven treatments. It's outrageous. Now excuse me while I go drink some bleach; I've got a dentist appointment in the morning, and I want to make sure I'm not contagious.

[Sgt. Pepper]

22 minutes ago, zigzag said:

I stand by everything I said in all of my posts and the numbers, sparky, and I disagree with your opinions on the motives of the all-inclusive  "media" and  "government." I just don't happen to be as cynical. But, my beef is not with you. My problem is with anti-vacciners. I realize that they have their rights and their personal freedoms. But, IMO, the overwhelming majority them are not acting in their own best interests or the interests of others. I have no sympathy for them. I believe if everyone had acted more responsibly early, this pandemic might not have been as devastating and deaths could have been prevented. And I don't need a scientist or data to back me on this (even though they do), just my own common sense. I find it interesting that those in the highest offices in the state and federal levels (and there is little doubt whom I'm referring to) were speaking out against vaccines publicly, but privately, they were getting them, all while promoting unsafe and unproven treatments. It's outrageous. Now excuse me while I go drink some bleach; I've got a dentist appointment in the morning, and I want to make sure I'm not contagious.

This was going to get out of hand no matter what. No one in any country knew what to do about it least of all our elected  so called leaders, and each country did its own thing as to what they thought was best, or did nothing. Is the USA the only country affected by it? The political J-holes in DC on the left or the the right were not going to contain this new disease with mask mandates. Tell a South Carolinian they have to wear a mask. I have a house there and live there part time, ain't happening. You can blame politicians all you want or the people that live in the country that don't do as you want them to, and praise the people that made the new virus in what was record time and used you, me, us as lab rats. Is what we are doing working? Any new disease is going to skyrocket in the beginning in numbers cause no one has immunity to a new disease. It may be a bit better now, but we are far from over this. What is next bubble suits and scuba outfits? Did covid make us s-hit our pants? Must have cause there was a TP shortage a while back.

So do what you think you need to do and stop policing others. Or get elected to an office where you can enforce an Executive Order or law. How did that turn out? 

Edited January 27, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper

[sparquelito]

21 minutes ago, zigzag said:

I stand by everything I said in all of my posts and the numbers, sparky, and I disagree with your opinions on the motives of the all-inclusive  "media" and  "government." I just don't happen to be as cynical. But, my beef is not with you. My problem is with anti-vacciners. I realize that they have their rights and their personal freedoms. But, IMO, the overwhelming majority them are not acting in their own best interests or the interests of others. I have no sympathy for them. I believe if everyone had acted more responsibly early, this pandemic might not have been as devastating and deaths could have been prevented. And I don't need a scientist or data to back me on this (even though they do), just my own common sense. I find it interesting that those in the highest offices in the state and federal levels (and there is little doubt whom I'm referring to) were speaking out against vaccines publicly, but privately, they were getting them, all while promoting unsafe and unproven treatments. It's outrageous. Now excuse me while I go drink some bleach; I've got a dentist appointment in the morning, and I want to make sure I'm not contagious.

You speak brilliantly, good sir, volumes about all the problems that arise when imperfect politicians presume to lead imperfect but decidedly free citizens. 

Just imagine how much dissention and conjecture was at play during the days of the Spanish Flu or the Great Plague. 

😶

 

 

[Tman]

4 minutes ago, zigzag said:

I stand by everything I said in all of my posts and the numbers, sparky, and I disagree with your opinions on the motives of the all-inclusive  "media" and  "government." I just don't happen to be as cynical. But, my beef is not with you. My problem is with anti-vacciners. I realize that they have their rights and their personal freedoms. But, IMO, the overwhelming majority them are not acting in their own best interests or the interests of others. I have no sympathy for them. I believe if everyone had acted more responsibly early, this pandemic might not have been as devastating and deaths could have been prevented. And I don't need a scientist or data to back me on this (even though they do), just my own common sense. I find it interesting that those in the highest offices in the state and federal levels (and there is little doubt whom I'm referring to) were speaking out against vaccines publicly, but privately, they were getting them, all while promoting unsafe and unproven treatments. It's outrageous. Now excuse me while I go drink some bleach; I've got a dentist appointment in the morning, and I want to make sure I'm not contagious.

I think the narrative has changed since the last election, of course for political gain. It was the previous conservative administration that developed the vaccine with emergency powers. Remember when our current president and V.P. during their campaign were against the vaccine because Trump was behind development? I do. Now if you in anyway criticize the vaccine or government mandates surrounding the pandemic, you are a Trump supporter. How did that happen? It has become political precisely because of what Sparky said using his generalities the preserve and enhance political power.

As a physician looking at it from an apolitical standpoint I see the need for masks and vaccines. I got it the second day in California as a frontline worker. I was boosted before it was generally available. It's a respiratory virus. SARS stands for severe acute respiratory syndrome. It is spread by the respiratory system with 2 primary ways to enter and exit the body - the mouth and the nose. That's why masks work. Always work - no. People don't always use them correctly. There is a German word for wearing it only over your mouth and not your nose - maskentrottle synonymous with stupid. The virus is so much more than just respiratory. My best friend from my training days died suddenly from Covid. He isolated and was getting much better with Delta variant a year ago. Felt well enough to go to work. Was adjusting his tie in front of the breakfast table and said to his college aged daughter, "I don't feel good, I think you need to take me to the hospital". He collapsed and died from a pulmonary thromboembolism. 59 years old. He was unvaccinated because he wanted to wait after a few weeks after just having received the shingles vaccines. I personally believe it is darwinian risk taking not to get it (vaccine) if you can. To agree with Zigzag's point, the unvaccinated are weighing down the healthcare system. Clogging up the resources for what, to make a political point? 

[Sgt. Pepper]

2 minutes ago, sparquelito said:

You speak brilliantly, good sir, volumes about all the problems that arise when imperfect politicians presume to lead imperfect but decidedly free citizens. 

Just imagine how much dissention and conjecture was at play during the days of the Spanish Flu or the Great Plague. 

😶

 

 

Yep and there are more people on this planet now than has ever been, we should be extinct but were not.

[Sgt. Pepper]

7 minutes ago, Tman said:

I think the narrative has changed since the last election, of course for political gain. It was the previous conservative administration that developed the vaccine with emergency powers. Remember when our current president and V.P. during their campaign were against the vaccine because Trump was behind development? I do. Now if you in anyway criticize the vaccine or government mandates surrounding the pandemic, you are a Trump supporter. How did that happen? It has become political precisely because of what Sparky said using his generalities the preserve and enhance political power.

As a physician looking at it from an apolitical standpoint I see the need for masks and vaccines. I got it the second day in California as a frontline worker. I was boosted before it was generally available. It's a respiratory virus. SARS stands for severe acute respiratory syndrome. It is spread by the respiratory system with 2 primary ways to enter and exit the body - the mouth and the nose. That's why masks work. Always work - no. People don't always use them correctly. There is a German word for wearing it only over your mouth and not your nose - maskentrottle synonymous with stupid. The virus is so much more than just respiratory. My best friend from my training days died suddenly from Covid. He isolated and was getting much better with Delta variant a year ago. Felt well enough to go to work. Was adjusting his tie in front of the breakfast table and said to his college aged daughter, "I don't feel good, I think you need to take me to the hospital". He collapsed and died from a pulmonary thromboembolism. 59 years old. He was unvaccinated because he wanted to wait after a few weeks after just having received the shingles vaccines. I personally believe it is darwinian risk taking not to get it (vaccine) if you can. To agree with Zigzag's point, the unvaccinated are weighing down the healthcare system. Clogging up the resources for what, to make a political point? 

Everyone is making great points pro and con, but the reality is you are not going to tell head strong Americans what they must do. 

Edited January 27, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper

[zigzag]

1 minute ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

 Tell a South Carolinian they have to wear a mask. I have a house there and live there part time, ain't happening. 

So do what you think you need to do and stop policing others. Or get elected to an office where you can enforce an Executive Order or law. How did that turn out? 

I live in SC, and I know what you're talking about. But look at Australia to see how they handles the pandemic. They went weeks with only several cases while we were peaking here.

I've seen where some insurance companies are considering not covering hospital bills for those not vaccinated. Not a bad idea perhaps. That would scare me into getting a vaccination.

Unfortunately, you can't police others. You can lead a horse to water.... You just have to take personal responsibility to protect yourself and wait for this thing to die down or mutate into something less devastating. 

One positive thing, though. Immunologists are using this RNA technology to develop vaccinations for ALL viruses and say any new vaccine could be ready for mass consumption in less than six months.

[Sgt. Pepper]

11 minutes ago, zigzag said:

I live in SC, and I know what you're talking about. But look at Australia to see how they handles the pandemic. They went weeks with only several cases while we were peaking here.

I've seen where some insurance companies are considering not covering hospital bills for those not vaccinated. Not a bad idea perhaps. That would scare me into getting a vaccination.

Unfortunately, you can't police others. You can lead a horse to water.... You just have to take personal responsibility to protect yourself and wait for this thing to die down or mutate into something less devastating. 

One positive thing, though. Immunologists are using this RNA technology to develop vaccinations for ALL viruses and say any new vaccine could be ready for mass consumption in less than six months.

Maybe Biden should call Oz and find out what they did to have that kind of luck.

Lets see how many people sue insurance companies and clog up the justice system if that happens.

Your right we can only do what we do and can't force other to abide. I can't control you and you can control me. People need to use common sense, but they don't always do including our politicians who are in it mostly for themselves. 

And great I hope the vax's work, is this one?  I have family members who got the shot and got Covid as well. Tell them it works.

Edited January 27, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper

[zigzag]

2 minutes ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

And great I hope the vax's work, is this one?  I have family members who got the shot and got Covid as well. Tell them it works.

I might be wrong, but I believe that when Moderna and Pfizer vaccines first came out, they were promoted to be around 90-95% effective. J&J less so.  Not sure what "effective" meant, but early on, they were highly effective at reducing severity, hospitalizations, and death. Still are. As the virus mutated and vaccine effectiveness was diminished over time (necessitating boosters), those numbers may have dropped slightly, but I haven't seen the data (nor am I really interested).

Look, I've said too much already, and I'm as frustrated by all this as anyone. I just wish everyone would do their parts to protect themselves and others. I'm sick (see what I did there) of the politicization and the rebelliousness of those who feel they possess some moral high ground against taking vaccines or inconvenient behavior modification for the common good.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

11 minutes ago, zigzag said:

I might be wrong, but I believe that when Moderna and Pfizer vaccines first came out, they were promoted to be around 90-95% effective. J&J less so.  Not sure what "effective" meant, but early on, they were highly effective at reducing severity, hospitalizations, and death. Still are. As the virus mutated and vaccine effectiveness was diminished over time (necessitating boosters), those numbers may have dropped slightly, but I haven't seen the data (nor am I really interested).

Look, I've said too much already, and I'm as frustrated by all this as anyone. I just wish everyone would do their parts to protect themselves and others. I'm sick (see what I did there) of the politicization and the rebelliousness of those who feel they possess some moral high ground against taking vaccines or inconvenient behavior modification for the common good.

 

I just looked it up it means it is successful in producing a desired result.

Remember Doctors have a license to practice medicine. I practice the guitar, and I still suck. So doc you are just practicing on me, when are you going to get it right?

Edited January 27, 2022 by Sgt. Pepper

[Pinch]

2 hours ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

I just looked it up it means it is successful in producing a desired result.

😄 

[SteveFord]

To play it safe I telework, wear a mask in public settings, avoid diseased humans, have had three shots, dumped some Ivermectin and Viagra in my Head And Shoulders, never, ever bite the heads off of bats AND threw away my Oozie Oozebourne records.

I'm still here.  

Something's working.

[NighthawkChris]

4 hours ago, Sgt. Pepper said:

I just looked it up it means it is successful in producing a desired result.

Remember Doctors have a license to practice medicine. I practice the guitar, and I still suck. So doc you are just practicing on me, when are you going to get it right?

Don’t get me started with doctors… this thread is already getting back to the state of where the last vaccine thread left off. My feelings are that some people can get MD licenses from Costco like Idiocracy - which is somewhat of a damning movie if you haven’t seen it. I can’t afford to be air lifted to the best hospitals in the nation on taxpayers’ dollars. Instead I get doctors that talk to me about God and all the while I’m afflicted with my problems that aren’t getting better… and they drive home in their BMW with the $400k salary or more. Quacks I tell ya! I have good “employee health benefits” - not insurance as some like to call it. When we live in a for-profit healthcare system, greed dictates who gets what and where. 

I have great disdain for many in this nation and abroad. I have lost faith in humanity. Man just doesn’t do “the right thing”. It’s all relative what that even is TBH. It’s actually bad to rationalize and make something that is bad have some light to it I believe. If you’re dealing with a turd what’s good about it other than it’s not clogging up an intestine somewhere.