Jump to content
Gibson Brands Forums

Gibson: Afraid of the truth?

freak show

By freak show
in The Gibson Lounge

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 60
  • Created
  • Last Reply
Laaz

Laaz

Posted
Posted

All valid points here. I buy guitars to play point blank. If someone wants to spend a fortune on a guitar to hang on a wall so be it. It's the way of the world and nothing anyone here says is going to change that. Hell I don't see anyone complaining about a collector spending millions on a Van Gogh to hang on their wall, and what is that but a piece of canvas with some paint thrown at it... To each their own.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
saturn

saturn

Posted
Posted

People can spend their money however they want. I have no problem with that. If someone wants and is willing to pay for the absolute, top-of-the-line item, more power to 'em.

 

I just won't be convinced that the quality of a $15,000 guitar will be that much better than a $1000-$3000 guitar. Now if it's really important for someone to have a special guitar and they pay $15,000 for it, I don't get angry. But, I can't help but thinking to myself "hmm?.." [biggrin]

Link to comment
Share on other sites
freak show

freak show

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Thanks for all of the responses, guys! Some of your posts were actually quite amusing. Unfortunately, some members don't seem to have gotten my "point". Perhaps I wasn't clear in expressing it.

 

I don't get the hate people have towards items they can't afford. Why make that comment in the first place? Just shows your immaturity. I'll never own a Lamborghini Murcielago but I don't go around saying they're overpriced and only lawyers can afford them.

 

I don't "hate" this guitar at all' date=' and I'm not sure how you could have received that impression. You asked "why I would make the comment?" Because Gibson "asked" for my opinion by giving me the opportunity to post. And what exactly is "immature" about my statement? Do you really believe that the only "mature" opinion would be: "Oh gosh, I love this thing, and I'm gonna buy it"?

 

All I was trying to say with my harmless little bon mot was that -- in my opinion -- this guitar has nothing to do with Page's "sonic vision" or with making music at all. It was made to sit in its case and trade hands for profit. You seem to agree:

 

Gibson would be stupid to sell these Page reissues for anything less than what they actually selling for. Why?...because people would just buy them and flip them for a profit. People are going to flip them for a profit even at the current prices. I won't be surprised to see a Page No. 2 VOS sell for $15' date='000 on eBay in the next 5 years. It's not Gibson's fault, it's the customers.[/quote']

 

I'm sure you're right. But between "flipping them for a profit" I suspect the owners will keep the guitars in their cases (or in display cases), and there really is something absurd about guitars being made NOT to be played. That's all I wanted to say on the Gibson website with my "dentist wall"-comment. No hate, no envy. To me it was just a joke with some truth in it.

 

But I digress. You see, I didn't intend for this thread to become a discussion of Gibson's pricing policy on this model. We already have a thread on that in the Les Paul section. I told my story, because I thought it was amusing that Gibson would delete my innocuous, funny, accurate remark while letting totally vulgar, asinine statements remain.

 

I guess I was just expecting more of a sense of humor from the guys who brought us the Hendrix piano...

 

[biggrin]

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Hector Arcadius

Hector Arcadius

Posted
Posted

What I find partly amusing - partly infuriating (depending on my stand-point at the moment) is the moral self-explanation that anyoone will happily provide to himself when it comes to buying / owning / re-selling / profiting from such an instrument:

 

''The profit is there to make. People are willing to pay for this and they will. Major corporations cash in the profit first and will keep raising the prices until they meet the highest price people are willing to make. Therefore, I am entitled to do so, in my turn.''

 

Let me get this straight and put it in the context of our capitalised world: ''Fools are out there. They are willing to pay almost anything in order to cover their needs for social demonstration, greed for money, personal dead-ends & insecurity, their fear of old age & eventually dying, by owning a ''never-dying'' piece of craftmanship. Well, all am I doing, is taking advantage of it. Is there anything wrong with that...?''

 

In my opinion, the whole issue comes down to these questions:

 

Do you care for the fact the you are taken advantage by (and do take advantage of someone)?

Obviously not.

 

Do you care with the alternative uses that your money could have possibly have?

Obviously not.

 

But, really, just SAVE US from the moral self-justification of your ''I'm buying what I can - period'' attitude. Whatever keeps you sleeping at nights mate...[-(

 

By the way: Buying a Jimmy Page / Billy Gibbons freakingly overpriced instrument will NEVER get you even close to sounding anything like them. Probably they would do it with your medium priced Les Paul Studio.

 

 

And Freakshow's story proves that they can't even take a joke!!! Lowdown has a signature about that I think...:-

Link to comment
Share on other sites
FennRx

FennRx

Posted
Posted
What I find partly amusing - partly infuriating (depending on my stand-point at the moment) is the moral self-explanation that anyoone will happily provide to himself when it comes to buying / owning / re-selling / profiting from such an instrument:

 

''The profit is there to make. People are willing to pay for this and they will. Major corporations cash in the profit first and will keep raising the prices until they meet the highest price people are willing to make. Therefore' date=' I am entitled to do so, in my turn.''

 

Let me get this straight and put it in the context of our capitalised world: ''Fools are out there. They are willing to pay almost anything in order to cover their needs for social demonstration, greed for money, personal dead-ends & insecurity, their fear of old age & eventually dying, by owning a ''never-dying'' piece of craftmanship. Well, all am I doing, is taking advantage of it. Is there anything wrong with that...?''

 

In my opinion, the whole issue comes down to these questions:

 

Do you care for the fact the you are taken advantage by (and do take advantage of someone)?

Obviously not.

 

Do you care with the alternative uses that your money could have possibly have?

Obviously not.

 

But, really, just SAVE US from the moral self-justification of your ''I'm buying what I can - period'' attitude. Whatever keeps you sleeping at nights mate...[-(

 

By the way: Buying a Jimmy Page / Billy Gibbons freakingly overpriced instrument will NEVER get you even close to sounding anything like them. Probably they would do it with your medium priced Les Paul Studio.

 

 

And Freakshow's story proves that they can't even take a joke!!! Lowdown has a signature about that I think...:-

[/quote']

 

the better question is, why does the person who wants and can afford a collector's piece have to justify himself at all? i dont think he does, especially to a bunch of guys whining on the internet? Why can't a guy just get what he wants? sure gibson is cranking out another ultra-expensive model, but they still make all the other ones too. you guys act as if gibson stopped making standards and studios and now none of you can get a new LP.

 

for every "you cant buy talent, it's not worth it, it's stupid, etc" argument, there is the guy who bashes it simply because he is jealous. happens with cars all the time. i wouldnt buy a Bentley even if i could afford it. yeah...right.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
FennRx

FennRx

Posted
Posted
People can spend their money however they want. I have no problem with that. If someone wants and is willing to pay for the absolute' date=' top-of-the-line item, more power to 'em.

 

I just won't be convinced that the quality of a $15,000 guitar will be that much better than a $1000-$3000 guitar. Now if it's really important for someone to have a special guitar and they pay $15,000 for it, I don't get angry. But, I can't help but thinking to myself "hmm?.." :- [/quote']

 

like other luxuries, the price increments go up at larger intervals for smaller changes. thats why buying used is an excellent way to go. Of course you can't really do that with the JP guitars, since the demand is pretty high.

 

saturj, i'm not trying to be a jerk or call you out, but just as a matter of curiosity, do you scratch your head when you see someone driving a Lotus or Ferrari? Or do you say "Wow, that's sweet!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites
saturn

saturn

Posted
Posted
like other luxuries' date=' the price increments go up at larger intervals for smaller changes. thats why buying used is an excellent way to go. Of course you can't really do that with the JP guitars, since the demand is pretty high.

 

saturj, i'm not trying to be a jerk or call you out, but just as a matter of curiosity, do you scratch your head when you see someone driving a Lotus or Ferrari? Or do you say "Wow, that's sweet!"[/quote']

 

I guess I don't. Maybe it's just my perception, but the differences between a Lotus and my car seem a whole lot bigger than any differences between quality guitars. I mean, once a guitar, looks, plays and sounds really good, how much better can it get?

 

Of course, I do understand some guitars (and other items for that matter) are collectible and rare and it is kind of cool to be one of the few people to own something like that.

 

Hell, this is a little off topic but to illustrate how crazy collectible value can be, I recently listed some old paper menu's on Ebay and like a fool I just put a BIN price of $8.00. They sold like hotcakes. Well, I just saw yesterday that one of the guys who bought 3 of them from me, turned around and listed one of them as an auction and the damn thing went up to $368.01 [crying] hmmm? [biggrin]

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Riffster

Riffster

Posted
Posted

Seriously, explain this to me:

 

1-Why the assumption that a person with a dregree such a Dentist would not play an expensive guitar well, perhaps even better than you? I know people that play really well and are not professional musicians. and I have seen some bands that flat out sucked.

 

2-Why is there such a hard line between collectiong and playing in some people's mind? can you not collect and play the hell out of guitars? countless Professional guitar players have guitar collections.

 

3-Why having an expensive guitar makes you a poser? maybe all of us that own any guitar over $1,000 would be called posers at the Squier forums. i mean you don't even need a LP Studio to play guitar.

 

4-Yes cheap gear can sound great, at that moment, with a given rig. How versatile is cheap gear? how well will it perform and hold over time?

 

5-Why do always comaprison with cheap gear involve an amazing player and the expensive guitar involves a sort of poser? can you imagine if you swapped the players? the Universe would collapse under its own weight and chaos.

 

Serioulsy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Poppy

Poppy

Posted
Posted

Question, Freakshow?

 

 

 

 

But I digress. You see, I didn't intend for this thread to become a discussion of Gibson's pricing policy on this model. We already have a thread on that in the Les Paul section. I told my story, because I thought it was amusing that Gibson would delete my innocuous, funny, accurate remark while letting totally vulgar, asinine statements remain.

 

How is your remark accurate, did you take the guitar off a dentist's wall and play it. I like the look of the guitar. I like Jimmy Page and would like to own one. I just started playing the guitar, so what does that make me. A collecter or a player, or a dentist? Just asking straight out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
freak show

freak show

Posted
  • Author
Posted

OK, I'm going to resuscitate this thread, but only because I was asked direct questions.

 

The reason they deleted your "Player's review" was because you aren't a player and your's wasn't a review.

 

Funny' date=' but not entirely true... Here are a few other "Player's reviews", which Gibson didn't delete:

 

"wow this thing is sexy...wish i could afford one"

 

"OMG!!! I WANT ONE, PLEASE GIBSON DON'T STOP MAKING THIS GUITAR!! JIMMY PAGE IS MY HERO! I'D BUY ONE FOR SURE!"

 

"How about lick my tick infested moose balls Gibson! Quit trying to rip people off."

 

"Henry has made it known without shame his target demoigraphic is professionals with huge disposable incomes. We know that means dr.s, laywers, dentists etc. Why would he give a crap about actual users of th eintrument? We gots no money. if they made it more affordable they'd sell a billion."

 

"Wow this is stupid... it's obviously to hang on a wall because if it was a players guitar gibson would make it at a price players could afford. This guitar will end up on some rich guys wall that cant even play the dang guitar. GIBSON MAKE AFFORDABLE GUITARS, PLEASE!!!!"

 

"I would literally kill someone 4 this guitar JIMMY PAGEis my G-d plz never stop making ths guitar its 1 of my main life goals 2 get it and im only 14 I <3 you JIMMY PAGE OF LED ZEPPELIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" (((The exclamation marks are from the original poster.)))

 

[b']That's a small sample, but fairly representative of the remarks being made. Not really very insightful "reviews", wouldn't you agree? Nevertheless they've been there for weeks.[/b]

 

Question' date=' Freakshow?

 

How is your remark accurate, did you take the guitar off a dentist's wall and play it. I like the look of the guitar. I like Jimmy Page and would like to own one. I just started playing the guitar, so what does that make me. A collecter or a player, or a dentist? Just asking straight out.[/quote']

 

Nobody has played this guitar yet. The people who are praising it haven't, and neither have the people who are trashing it.

 

I didn't do either of these things!!! I didn't say the guitar sucks, and I didn't say it's great.

 

I made a joke, and evidently many found it funny, since it got almost 300 positive reactions before Gibson deleted it.

 

I didn't insult collectors, and I didn't insult dentists! LOL! My joke just implied this guitar is for yuppy players/collectors, who are looking for a "fun, hip" investment. You people can pick my 10 words apart as much as you like, but we all know it's the truth. As "are nine" wrote, this guitar is going to be "flipped for a profit" over and over.

 

And I don't even have a problem with it. I "like" the pictures of the guitar too! And I also "like" Page's music. And if the guitar were priced more realistically, I would probably even think about trying one out.

 

Seriously' date=' explain this to me:

 

1-Why the assumption that a person with a dregree such a Dentist would not play an expensive guitar well, perhaps even better than you? I know people that play really well and are not professional musicians. and I have seen some bands that flat out sucked.

 

2-Why is there such a hard line between collectiong and playing in some people's mind? can you not collect and play the hell out of guitars? countless Professional guitar players have guitar collections.

 

3-Why having an expensive guitar makes you a poser? maybe all of us that own any guitar over $1,000 would be called posers at the Squier forums. i mean you don't even need a LP Studio to play guitar.

 

4-Yes cheap gear can sound great, at that moment, with a given rig. How versatile is cheap gear? how well will it perform and hold over time?

 

5-Why do always comaprison with cheap gear involve an amazing player and the expensive guitar involves a sort of poser? can you imagine if you swapped the players? the Universe would collapse under its own weight and chaos.

 

Seriously.[/quote']

 

Look, I've got nothing against people with graduate degrees. The funny thing about this whole situation is that although I'm not a dentist, I pretty much fit into the stereotype I was joking about with my little quip: Most of my guitars are definitely better than my playing, and they would probably be put to better use by "real" musicians. I don't have a problem admitting that, and I don't have a problem making jokes about it.

 

I don't think having expensive guitars makes one a "poser", and in none of my previous posts have I condoned buying or playing "cheap gear". These questions of yours are all valid, but they are really directed towards 16 year old kids who play cheap guitars and say things like: "I sound better with my Epiphone than "Dr. freak show" (and yes, it is "Dr. freak show") sounds on his Gibson Les Paul. What a jerk!"

 

Actually I had no intention of starting a debate here. I just found it lame and amusing that Gibson would strike my remark from the records for the sole reason that too many people were agreeing with it.

 

And if they send me the guitar, as I requested in my first post, you can be sure that I'll be hanging it on my wall: I wouldn't want it to depreciate in value!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Poppy

Poppy

Posted
Posted

Hi Freak Show,

Thanks for answering my question, I am not happy with all of what you said, but glad you answered it.

I think I understand your post, you are upset that Gibson removed your post and not the others and you were

looking for some back-up, sorry I am not able to do that. I look forward to to talk with you in the forums again.

Buy the way, I saw your post on the site the day it went up, I believe yours was the first one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Riffster

Riffster

Posted
Posted

Hey Freak Show, we too are joking, it does not matter what you and I think the guitar market is what it is.

 

The reason you are getting some of these reactions is that your comments or reviews are very cliché, when the pic of a yawning Lion came up that about summed it up.

 

Here is a funny story that you will appreciate:

 

I recently sold a tube amp on craigslist, the guy that bought it runs his own business, he asked me to drop the amp at his business place so I agreed. I got there and the guy is busy as hell, seems a successful business he runs, so I had to wait for like 20 minutes.

 

Amp is warm by now, he comes out (suit and tie) with a Gretsch White Falcon and proceeds to plug in and play some tasty licks. The guy can play!

 

Turns out he wanted a decent tube amp to keep at his office to play guitar when business is slow, he keeps his Gretcsh there most of the time hanging on the wall, all he needed was an amp so he would not have to carry one around since they are heavy. Go figure.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
FennRx

FennRx

Posted
Posted
who would say you are an idiot if you think tone and EMGs can be found in the same sentence.

 

it ain't my problem that there are idiots out there who are tone deaf and can't tell differences in pitch....

 

glad to see you understood my post.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...