Will NEVER buy another Gibson

[Welshman]

If you look at my signature, you will see that I have been a long-term lover of Gibson guitars, but my recent dealings with this once great company have turned me away for good.

 

I bought one of the Darkfires - on paper, a truly astounding instrument. The purchasing process was a nightmare. The dealer was totally kept in the dark, the guitar finally arrived SEVEN MONTHS LATE and the build quality of the elctrics is APPALLING! I have one of the better ones, but the wiring on the jack frequently shorts out which affects the output and also prevents the guitar from charging. The pickup selector also develops intermittent faults which affect the neck pickup in particular.

The promised updates to the firmware etc has also been abandoned. The Rip to hex lead is virtually impossible to get hold of (especially in the UK) and promised spares such as the RIPS themselves are still unavailable. This being said, when it works, it ALMOST lives up to the hype.

 

Despite all of the issues, I foolishly decided to place an order for the 2010 Ltd - the thought of having improved Darkfire functionality in a "Standard" Les Paul was just too tempting.

The guitar was due in August, but a delay was announced (blamed on the flooding) and I was informed that it would be available early October. Spoke to the dealer today (1st November) and was told that it would be AT LEAST December, but most probably January before I would see the guitar. I can still also get no firm information about when the RIP for this guitar will become available (the DF RIP will damage the low Z circuit if it attempts to charge the guitar).

 

What sort of tin pot organisation has Gibson become?

We've had this huge announcement about the future of guitars, Gibson can't even manufacture the current generation, let alone the next generation.

If they can't build the current "Robot" guitars to any sort of reliable standard, how are they going to produce the Firebird X which has Bluetooth and Effects on top of the "Robot" elements?

 

I have now had enough of this farce and am cancelling my order for the 2010 Ltd

 

I would urge anyone considering purchasing the Firebird X to think long and hard before handing over any of their hard earned cash.

 

Anyone thinking that I am just a one off disgruntled customer should check out the Futureguitarnow website and see what other Darkfire customers think about Gibson and their products.

[dem00n]

Cool story bro.

[dem00n]

When did you buy the DF?

Mind you, Gibson had a bunch of guitars to make due to the flood and also they lost hundreds due to the flood, so add on that to replace and you have alot to do.

It was delayed, oh big deal! Be patient like everyone else.

[damian]

That's too bad.......The Darkfire looks intriuging........Seems that those who own the robot Gibbies either hate them or love them.......As for quality control at Gibson, I've never had a problem........I think their pricing structure is too high, but I suppose if one chooses a LP and pays $2000.00 to $10,000.00, one has a reason to and/or has the money to spend on one...Since 59 Les Pauls are still being played live shows the quality is there.......Too bad about your Darkfire though.......

[davidl]

Thats a real shame with the DF.

Like someone else mentioned, Robot owners seem to love or hate their guitars. I really like mine. No issues at all and plays like a Gibby should.

I guess I'm fortunate. I'm on my 3rd Gibson this year, all perfect to me. I probably shouldn't say fortunate because it should just be that way.

 

Dave

[Welshman]

That's too bad.......The Darkfire looks intriuging........Seems that those who own the robot Gibbies either hate them or love them.......As for quality control at Gibson, I've never had a problem........I think their pricing structure is too high, but I suppose if one chooses a LP and pays $2000.00 to $10,000.00, one has a reason to and/or has the money to spend on one...Since 59 Les Pauls are still being played live shows the quality is there.......Too bad about your Darkfire though.......

 

Damian, if you look at my signature, you'll see that I own a number of Gibsons, all of which I am happy with.

 

It is specifically the Darkfire that my QC issues are with. The build of the guitar itself is fine, but it is painfully obvious that, when it came to the electrics, it was a case of "These guitars are late, let's throw then together and get the things out". If you check out the futureguitarnow website, you will see that this is far from unusual with the DFs. My output jack has issues, but some of the photos on the website of the electrics inside some examples are truly appalling.

Whoever built these guitars either has no pride whatsoever in the quality of their work or was under extreme pressure to get them out as soon as possible.

 

Now I realise that some delay due to the floods was inevitable, hence the fact that I have waited for the last two months with no comment, but to be told now that it will be AT LEAST another two months is in no way unacceptable.

 

Gibson's attitude to the dealers is also appalling, one of them told me that when the enquired when a guitar would be delivered, they were told "You'll get it when it arrives" - in this age when there are so many alternatives available, how long is Gibson going to last with this performance?

[Artie Owl]

That is unfortunate.

 

However, how much research did you do prior to purchasing the first DarkFire? Are you someone who typically adopts early?

 

If you are then this is par for the course for any company. Especially when extensive amounts of manufacturing are involved.

 

Working with new technology is almost always difficult.

 

Bottom line, Gibson still makes amazing classic guitars, their new electronic division for these new guitars is still in basically its infancy, especially given how much it costs. Programs like this need lots of user feed back and testing before they can streamline everything, and since their guitars are in the multiples of thousands of dollars that's not happening right now.

 

In time it might be an industry standard, who knows?

 

If you're done with them does that mean you'll be selling your guitars on the cheap? I'm interested if so, I'm familiar with the risks involved in new technology and am willing to give it a try.

 

As for the manufacturing delays, well, no one controls the weather.

 

Cheers,

[daveinspain]

Thats a real shame with the DF.

Like someone else mentioned, Robot owners seem to love or hate their guitars. I really like mine. No issues at all and plays like a Gibby should.

I guess I'm fortunate. I'm on my 3rd Gibson this year, all perfect to me. I probably shouldn't say fortunate because it should just be that way.

 

Dave

 

I have to agree with Dave, I love my first addition Robot. Never had a problem works great, sounds great, plays like a dream... Sorry you have had such bad luck...

[BigKahune]

I've got a Robot - the SG LTD - no problems.

 

I've been wanting to get into the sound/tone tech, but the DF problems have got me holding back. I noticed problems right from the DF start - late delivery, missing parts, parts on back order, questionable QC, etc. Sorry to hear you got caught up in that mess. Unfortunately, these problems haven't improved with the ensuing models.

[Tim Plains]

With all due respect, you can't exactly blame Gibson for the delay of your Standard. They were devastated by mother nature and you're complaining about having to wait as a result? Get real. Be thankful they're still in business after what they just went through. Another forum member here, rocketman, ordered a 25th anniversary PRS and I think was told wait would be around two months...but turned out being closer to six months (if not more); so, it's not just Gibson. The Dark Fire - well, what did you expect? People were questioning their reliability before they even came out and here you just bought one because they look good on paper? Untested technology and you are the tester.

 

Go out and buy a Les Paul '58 reissue. If you like slimmer necks, get a '60. You'll never complain about Gibson again.

[Welshman]

With all due respect, you can't exactly blame Gibson for the delay of your Standard. They were devastated by mother nature and you're complaining about having to wait as a result? Get real. Be thankful they're still in business after what they just went through. Another forum member here, rocketman, ordered a 25th anniversary PRS and I think was told wait would be around two months...but turned out being closer to six months (if not more); so, it's not just Gibson. The Dark Fire - well, what did you expect? People were questioning their reliability before they even came out and here you just bought one because they look good on paper? Untested technology and you are the tester.

 

Go out and buy a Les Paul '58 reissue. If you like slimmer necks, get a '60. You'll never complain about Gibson again.

It's not the technology that has the issue, if you read my post, you'll see that the issues are mechanical ones caused by the way it was thrown together. The switch issue is due to cheap materials oxidising and the socket is due to the worst soldering I have ever seen.

 

As for the DF reliability issues, these came to light AFTER my order was placed and were aimed at the initial output - mine was one of the later batches that were supposedly fixed.

As I have already said - look at my signature I own several QUALITY Gibsons all of which I love. My issues are with what they are doing with the Robot guitars (my Slash LP was made THIS YEAR and plays like a dream).

 

With regards to the flooding causing delays, 2-3 months yes, anything more - no chance not in this day and age. Also, why keep everyone in the dark - people only get annoyed when they feel fobbed off.

[jnastynebr]

I understand your frustration. Its ironic that a certain CEO will blast consumers for being unwilling to embrace new technology when his company is unable to fill orders for it. It seems silly to countdown the days until the release of the new robot model when people are still waiting for the last one.

Screw being patient. You should not have to wait for months and months for a product that's plastered all over the company's website. If I want a new guitar or amp and it ends up being unavailable for god knows how long, I dump it, cancel my order and move on. There are too many companies making great guitars to have thousands of dollars invested in an instrument that you wont get your mitts on for six months.

[Riverside]

I understand your frustration. Its ironic that a certain CEO will blast consumers for being unwilling to embrace new technology when his company is unable to fill orders for it. It seems silly to countdown the days until the release of the new robot model when people are still waiting for the last one.

Screw being patient...

 

For me, that's it exactly. And my orders HAVE been cancelled.

 

This outfit seems to be unable or unwilling to take care of the customers they already have (make that "had") - and it seems even weaker to me that no one there will stand up and explain their thoughts.

 

They seem all too willing to rely upon their many apologists to make excuses for them.

 

What will be the excuse next year?

 

For me, it doesn't matter. There won't be a next year as far as goes purchases of new guitars.

 

My money is going (gone) somewhere else.

[MrNylon]

That's a bad break of luck. i was waiting for a replacement SG Std. Bass to come in to replace the floor model is was using. It had a good size ding in the body. Gibson told the sales rep. at Sam Ash four months for the new one to ship. A new one showed up on Friday the 29th. Three weeks instead of Four months. It came through flawless. I've had the same thing happen with orders from Fender and G&L. Do what you need to do, but manufacturing doesn't always follow a set path. The flood didn't help any either. Good luck man.

[Silenced Fred]

Cool story bro

[Surveyor]

Gibson is going to milk the flood as long as possible. "Remember, the '09 flood fifty years ago?"

 

Other than that, it's Gibson's arrogance that will continue to get in the way. Apparently, they still don't feel the need to communicate with anyone, especially customers.

[damian]

Damian, if you look at my signature, you'll see that I own a number of Gibsons, all of which I am happy with.

 

It is specifically the Darkfire that my QC issues are with. The build of the guitar itself is fine, but it is painfully obvious that, when it came to the electrics, it was a case of "These guitars are late, let's throw then together and get the things out". If you check out the futureguitarnow website, you will see that this is far from unusual with the DFs. My output jack has issues, but some of the photos on the website of the electrics inside some examples are truly appalling.

Whoever built these guitars either has no pride whatsoever in the quality of their work or was under extreme pressure to get them out as soon as possible.

 

Now I realise that some delay due to the floods was inevitable, hence the fact that I have waited for the last two months with no comment, but to be told now that it will be AT LEAST another two months is in no way unacceptable.

 

Gibson's attitude to the dealers is also appalling, one of them told me that when the enquired when a guitar would be delivered, they were told "You'll get it when it arrives" - in this age when there are so many alternatives available, how long is Gibson going to last with this performance?

 

Yes; read your signature again...will check that website out...Many good comment by the others...Keep us updated on how you move foward ...in regards to your thread..My understanding was that the Darkfire would be a limited edition and that Gibson was pushing sales of them...I thought about getting one, won't now, although I'm sorry my decision is due to your experience.......Love those Mark Vs, just a comment and is not meant to have anything to due with the price of tea...

[dem00n]

Gibson is going to milk the flood as long as possible. "Remember, the '09 flood fifty years ago?"

 

Other than that, it's Gibson's arrogance that will continue to get in the way. Apparently, they still don't feel the need to communicate with anyone, especially customers.

Dude they had to replace all the machinery, also all the guitars that they were currently working on were destroyed and the ones due equals alot of work.

 

You also forget the fact about how many guitars and different kind of guitars they make. They have mass orders due for big companies and etc.

 

Im seriously starting to think people want to much.

[Artie Owl]

Dude they had to replace all the machinery, also all the guitars that they were currently working on were destroyed and the ones due equals alot of work.

 

You also forget the fact about how many guitars and different kind of guitars they make. They have mass orders due for big companies and etc.

 

Im seriously starting to think people want to much.

Yep. I wonder if all these people will sell their shares and stocks in the company from their utter displeasure?

[Riverside]

Dude they had to replace all the machinery, also all the guitars that they were currently working on were destroyed and the ones due equals alot of work.

 

You also forget the fact about how many guitars and different kind of guitars they make. They have mass orders due for big companies and etc.

 

Im seriously starting to think people want to much.

 

Tell us about the production guitars they lost.

 

Tell us what you know about how long it takes to replace machinery.

 

Tell us what you know about the number of units they've shipped since the flood.

 

Sometimes I think you spout off without having any facts what-so-ever.

 

Even if production were still halted (which it is not), there's no reason why someone there can't talk to their customers.

 

But they don't have to - they have you to "protect" them.

[MrNylon]

You mention the machinery damaged. What about the woods used in the manufacturing. How long may it take to resupply any of that lost to water damage?

[Riverside]

You mention the machinery damaged. What about the woods used in the manufacturing. How long may it take to resupply any of that lost to water damage?

 

Tell us what you know about wood lost in the flood.

[jnastynebr]

No one knows how much damage was done during the flood, and its pointless to speculate. I am sympathetic to their situation, but I wont wait 6+ months for a guitar from Fender, PRS, or Gibson. I bought my last Gibson back in 2008, and have canceled 2 orders for new Gibsons since then (one before the flood, and one during the flood). If I'm going to fork out 2 grand plus for anything, I need a rough idea of when I can expect to receive the item, not "we'll call you when it comes in."

My guy at Sweetwater knows to drop me a line if the situation improves, but for now, if I see the item, I'm buying used. Its frustrating to cancel two orders because of production delays and have the company announce a huge campaign for a new model. Im not saying that I wont ever buy another Gibson again, but they could have easily sold me another guitar or two over the last 30 months if I could have got some strait answers.

[MojoRedFoot]

@ Welshman...would you buy used? Hopefully all the kinks should be worked out of a used guitar.

[Shnate McDuanus]

In this case, Welshman, I really think you do have a right to be upset with Gibson. Flood business aside, it's simply unacceptable for a product to reach an end user in a poorly-finished or defective state, as it seems to have been in your case. I implore you, however, to not condemn Gibson simply on the basis of one defective instrument. The Dark Fire line? Well, it's altogether possible that there are intrinsic issues with the model itself, with the team working on the models, what have you. I don't know, and it isn't my place to make assumptions about their operational dynamics. That's not what I'm talking about. You say you also got a great new AFD model recently, and that this was a new model that had none of the issues of the DF you purchased? Perhaps, then, your guitar purchasing method ought to simply involve a more painstaking selection process. I'm personally wary of ordering a model directly from a company--because of the uncertainty of not being able to try it.

 

Also, this isn't me trying to apologize for Gibson--what they put out in your case was not really kosher, and you should be upset. All I'm saying is that, maybe, this issue isn't an all-or-nothing affair? You know...shades of gray.