capmaster Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 This is on the most striking specific guitar resonance I ever witnessed. It spontaneously appeared and disappeared within a few weeks. My Les Paul Traditional 2013 puts out lots of overtones in general, but something the like I experienced in mid-2015 never happened before and never since. The same string set has been on her for some months before and some months later, and I didn't change any adjustment during the entire period. I was using the bridge pickup at a clean "no-amp" setting of the emulating device via headphones. As I always do, I compared the 2nd harmonic of the D4th with the fretted note of the G3rd at the 7th fret. To my big surprise the D4th's 2nd harmonic faded very fast and transmogrified into the 4th harmonic rapidly growing louder. It sounded close to a feedback but definitely wasn't one. To avoid the 4th harmonic and just get the 2nd, I picked the D4th exactly at it's 2nd octave point where the 2nd harmonic has its maximum and the 4th harmonic has a node. Alone it wasn't of help – the 4th harmonic came up again at a terrifying intensity. Then I switched to the neck pickup not transducing the 4th harmonic due to its node there, and guess what happened – the string sound went dead very fast because of the quickly dying 2nd harmonic. :blink: I admit that shivers were running down my spine. Playing the open D4th using bridge pickup or both pickups led to a 4th harmonic much louder than the fundamental within two to three seconds. Some weeks later the spooky behaviour went away as it had come, and without any change done to the guitar as mentioned above. Guitars seem to undergo unpredictable changes with time... :unsure: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayinLA Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 This is on the most striking specific guitar resonance I ever witnessed. It spontaneously appeared and disappeared within a few weeks. My Les Paul Traditional 2013 puts out lots of overtones in general, but something the like I experienced in mid-2015 never happened before and never since. The same string set has been on her for some months before and some months later, and I didn't change any adjustment during the entire period. I was using the bridge pickup at a clean "no-amp" setting of the emulating device via headphones. As I always do, I compared the 2nd harmonic of the D4th with the fretted note of the G3rd at the 7th fret. To my big surprise the D4th's 2nd harmonic faded very fast and transmogrified into the 4th harmonic rapidly growi I admit that shivers were running down my spine. Some weeks later the spooky behaviour went away as it had come, and without any change done to the guitar as mentioned above. Guitars seem to undergo unpredictable changes with time... :unsure: Ok..Ok..Ok...Dude. I can help. Chill out. I have seen this before. I knew the problem as soon as I got to Transmorgified. Your guitar was the temperory home of outer-steller, 11th dimension entity. Over the centuries their has been many names for this Poltragiest. KAKA in ancient Babylon, LOKI in Nordic Lore, and more recently in US in the 21st century Nickel-Backes-Suckus-Hardus (in Latin). Now this entity makes your playin sound crappy and demonic even though you played polo in high school, like some sort of frat guy bad boy. Don't Worry! It's not the guitar. The instrument has been possessed. There is a simple remedy. I don't know if you remember the part in Spinal Tap where the guitar just sustains on it's own? Same thing. What you have to do is do 11 shots of Vodka whilst standing on your head (may require help from a friend, or better yet a cute bimbo who digs guitar guys). One shot for each deminsion of this entity. Then play the Hendrix, Voodoo Child (Most Preferably). You will then let the entity know that you fear no feedback.... it will vanish, and you my friend, might get lucky. :D/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 Should I have said "transformed" or "converted" instead of "transmogrified"? I really love the latter word since Jon Lord used it in the description of his Concerto for Group and Orchestra No possession at all, no witchcraft, it has to be some sort of interference within (!) the entire instrument. The particular note, D5, seems to be something special for lots of guitars anyway. When picking the open G3rd, some guitars put out a very loud 3rd harmonic, making an Eminor chord an Eminor7. Picking the open G3rd at the 12th fret would create odd-order harmonics only with a clearly audible D5. Picking the open G3rd at the 7th or 19th fret should exclude the 3rd harmonic and all its integer multiples. However, the latter doesn't work on some guitars of mine. The G3rd's 3rd harmonic D5 will come up although it shouldn't. I'm sure some vibration energy is transformed, converted or transmogrified into creating a harmonic that cannot be excited by picking at the given attack position. Anyway, I think it all happens within the Gibson L6Ses, Les Paul guitars and the Ibanez Artist showing this phenomenon. I don't assume any transcendental impacts at all. I hope you're not too disappointed about my incredulousness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayinLA Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 You are a true guitar theory Wizard. The force is strong with this one. But even the most talented Wizard of the Axe somtimes forgets the universal sacred geometry of the Ocatave and therefore the building blocks of all creation, or "self-organization" depending on your upbringing, or religion. "In the Beginning was the WORD..of God. That is to say that sound and resonance are what create all fractalizing coherences that allow all "matter" in the universe to become self-aware. So to your point, it is possession, of the highest order. In fact Dr. Hans Jenny discovered what he calls Cymatics where when opera singers hit dominant notes in relation to the background noise it cuts through all interference waves, and sand on a table forms ancient sacred symbols, like the Star of David. Gibson is strong with the force as is high-end Ibanez and most ESP (interesting name for a guitar). The force is weak often with Fender. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KU84ckD1AcA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 Gibson is strong with the force as is high-end Ibanez and most ESP (interesting name for a guitar). The force is weak often with Fender. The Ibanez Artist of mine is made in PRC and has to pay with a dull G4. However, the L6Ses do the same, too. Perhaps Les Paul guitars are more spiritual. ;) One of my Fenders, an American Deluxe Telecaster Ash with one-piece maple neck sadly discontinued recently, also has a very lively resonance behaviour. She's the only MIA Fender of mine and some sort of a vibration transformer, too. :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KU84ckD1AcA Looks to me like Chladni figures on drumheads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 I was using the bridge pickup at a clean "no-amp" setting of the emulating device via headphones. Headphone wire between you and the guitar? Can cause funny resonances, note sympathetic with the teenie speaker in there and the wire. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Is the headphone wire curly or straight? Makes all the difference :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 Headphone wire between you and the guitar? Can cause funny resonances, note sympathetic with the teenie speaker in there and the wire. rct In 2001 I once caused a magnetic feedback when the filament coiled cord of my Beyerdynamic DT 880 S accidentally came too close to a single-coil pickup with the emulator set to high gain. A bad experience I will never forget. Since then I always run the headphone cable across my back, also much more comfortable for playing. Moreover, the Beyerdynamic DT 770 Pro 250 I use now doesn't have a filament cable, so no problem here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 Is the headphone wire curly or straight? Makes all the difference :P Curly, but it's not a problem. On the other hand, please refer to the reply to Rct on filament cables I posted above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 It's just aliens, messing with you! CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 It's just aliens, messing with you! CB Do you think playing a different guitar might help to baffle them? :blink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dub-T-123 Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Do you think playing a different guitar might help to baffle them? :blink: More likely, they'd just figure out another way to baffle you! CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 More likely, they'd just figure out another way to baffle you! CB Perhaps they make me play all the wrong notes? I always thought I was to blame for them myself! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Perhaps they make me play all the wrong notes? I always thought I was to blame for them myself! ;) Hmmm, that's a good excuse! I may borrow that, from you. CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 Hmmm, that's a good excuse! I may borrow that, from you. CB No problem as long as you keep a secret that I suggested it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 No problem as long as you keep a secret that I suggested it! You got it! CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 I think the clue is in the words "emulating device". A digital glitch is the reasonable explanation? :-k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveFord Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Try changing the TONE knobs to exorcise the demon within. They're drawn to the witch hats but hate the speed knobs. Also, put on Brian Eno/David Byrne's The Jezebel Spirit REALLY LOUD and twirl the guitar over your head three times and then hang the guitar, out of the case, over your front door during the next full moon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badbluesplayer Posted March 29, 2016 Share Posted March 29, 2016 This will cure that - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveFord Posted March 29, 2016 Share Posted March 29, 2016 Now we're talkin'! That's the kind of thing you do NOT want to be standing in front of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tman Posted March 29, 2016 Share Posted March 29, 2016 Was it Chiral (stereogenic) transmogrification or achiral? Enquiring minds want to know. Just joshing of course Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 30, 2016 Author Share Posted March 30, 2016 Was it Chiral (stereogenic) transmogrification or achiral? Enquiring minds want to know. Just joshing of course Well, not chiral in its strict sense but probably asymmetric in a spatial sense. Here's why. There are the strings' speeds of sound for transversal waves defined by tunings, and the longitudinal speeds of sound given by materials, designs and constructions of strings and guitar as well. For wound strings there are several different ones of the latter, and they even are dispersive, that is depending on frequency. The resulting non-linear phase delays massively affect string tone. Therefore strings produce a bunch of frequencies including side bands, and into the bargain there are different ones vertical, lateral, and torsional, and for wound strings also longitudinal. Now to the asymmetric point. Wound strings include winding pitches and the winding's sense of rotation. All strings I ever encountered were wound clockwise. This is likely to affect the basic string vibration modes. Finally, only an acoustic guitar and pickups located exactly at the bridge or bridge saddles, usually piezos, will transduce the sum of all string vibration modes. Magnetic pickups are limited to capturing just a fraction of the entire string tone. Lateral modes won't be transduced at all, only their interferences with vertical and torsional modes may appear. This will attenuate most of the string's sound spectrum and this way bring up shares of vibration that partly are desired, partly unwanted. Anyway, the buildup of the 4th harmonic I described in my first post was clearly audible acoustically, too, so the limitations of the latter effect are insignificant here, at least when listening to the bridge pickup sound. Of course, at the neck pickup's position the D4th's 4th harmonic D5 is canceled out and thus won't appear. By the way, this particular frequency will be missing in any fretted note of the D4th, too, but that's a principal deficit of any magnetic pickup depending on position and the strings' tuning pitches. When acoustic guitars or piezo bridge tones are concerned, the transfer function is only limited by the selected attack position and otherwise complete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stein Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 I think the most "cryptic" thing about this thread is trying to understand your post. It's good stuff, just requires either being highly educated, or GETTING highly educated. I can grasp most of it, but I sure can't retain it. I can't even retain it long enough to get to the bottom of the post. I am deciding that THIS is going to be what I consider "String Theory". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capmaster Posted March 30, 2016 Author Share Posted March 30, 2016 ... I am deciding that THIS is going to be what I consider "String Theory". It's just why different string makes sound different. Moreover, not every string of a certain make will sound exactly the same on the same instrument. In the end it all comes down to taste anyway. My personal take on the effect I witnessed is a random coincidence of transient string properties combined with the resonant structure of the specific guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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