Waynel Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 I'm new to the site. Years ago I used Les Paul customs, solid and heavy. I'm back to a Les Paul now, it's a chambered Classic. Here's my problem. Years ago, I put Dimarzio Super Distortion in the bridge position. Worked great, because back then (and I mean back in the 70's) we didn't have the extremely high gain amps of today. Back then I played through a Marhsall and a Fender Twin. Nothing like the gain on the OD channels of the Marshall JVM I have now. Anyway, I put an SD in the bridge of this chambered classic and I can't turn up the master volume without the LP actually trembling and here comes the feedback. That SD is rated at 425mv. Is this feedback welling up because that pickup is too hot and and driving the preamp tubes too hard? Is feedback a problem with these chambered LP's? I mean I've turned my cab around facing the back of stage and still getting this feedback. I've tried my Fender Hot Rod Deville and Egnator Renengade. Great clean, but when I hit the distortion channel...here comes the feedback. Even when I turn down the gain and up the channel volume, same problem. This feedback problem is preventing me from getting to band performance volume without keeping a hand on the strings at all times. Is it the Super Distortion pickup or the chambers in the LP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
57classic Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 I can't really speak to the issue of your pickups but I have a goldtop w/p90's. The guitar is chambered and I don't get any unwanted feedback. I would be surprised if the pickups are too hot. Perhaps it is the way they are wired, shielded or grounded. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waynel Posted March 25, 2011 Author Share Posted March 25, 2011 P90's are single coil, unless I'm mistaken. If I hook up my Telecaster (stock) I don't have this prbolem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydra26 Posted March 26, 2011 Share Posted March 26, 2011 This is not in any way scientific, but my robot seemed to give me bad feedback problems during a jam (also pushing through a JVM, in my case mode 2, channel 4, gain around halfway) and I was really scratching my head about why I was having this problem. It was barely controllable. None of my other guitars (except my 339) had ever given me anything even similar to this issue. Wasn't till a couple days after I got home that I started wondering if the chambering might have something to do with it. My Explorers, V, Deluxe, you name it, all well behaved at the same amp settings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketman Posted March 26, 2011 Share Posted March 26, 2011 I have a chambered and a weight relieved Les Paul, and I never had issues with either one. The ES-339 does give me feedback problems but it isn't that bad. The "Dirty Fingers" pickups in my Sonex cause an issue though. It's not too bad though, but there is a difference with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searcy Posted March 26, 2011 Share Posted March 26, 2011 Is the feed back being genorated by the pickups or the strings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydra26 Posted March 27, 2011 Share Posted March 27, 2011 rocketman, i must have much higher gain settings than you in my amp (although I don't have the knob itself up that high). I have been playing much louder in the last year or so than I was even when I was occasionally gigging. Searcy, I don't really know enough to say for sure. I crank up high enough and the 339 creates an ear piercing shriek any time there is not a note being activeply played. That's fine, it still sounds awesome for some of the other stuff I do on lower gain channels. The Robot, I'm not sure. It's really bad in some environments and not bad in others. And it's a different kind of feedback when it happens. It comes on more gradually so it's kind of controllable. I think this latter problem mainly occurs when I get unreasonable with the volume, whereas with a 339, anything with a modern crunch at a volume higher than 2 produces immediate and painful results. It's interesting to me though, how much more tolerant my deluxe (which, when I bought it, drew a lot of comments like "dude, why? they get so much microphonic feedback) or explorers are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketman Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 Well I'm officially perplexed. What kind of room is it? How far are you from the amp? Does it get worse when you face the amp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 My Les Paul Classic (Stock "hot" pickups) will do that, at high gain settings, when too close to the amp! I've had to go back to my LP Deluxe, for tight quartered "bar/small club" gigs, because of it. If there's enough room, however, then...there's no problem, with the Classic. By the way, NONE of my single coil guitars, Gibson or Fender, do that. They might "squeal" (harmonic feedback) in some rare instances, but nothing like you're describing. So...??? If you're talking about your "deluxe" having "microphonic" feedback, is it an older (late '60's, or early to mid 70's) version? If so, you may need to get the pickups wax potted. I thought I'd have to replace mine, but they just potted them, and they now sound fantastic. Better than they did, new, really. My Deluxe, is a '76. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searcy Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 Crank the volume till you get feed back and then take your hand a mute all the strings. You can even press a sock against the strings to help you mute them. If it's still getting feed back and you know the strings arn't the cause then the pickup is microphonic. At this point you can switch the pickup switch to see which one it is. Many times it can be both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydra26 Posted March 28, 2011 Share Posted March 28, 2011 Well to be fair, lately it's a lot of playing through a jvm410h half stack on a 15 x 25 sunroom, usually about 8-10 feet away. Did a feedback test a couple months ago with a pile of guitars when an acquaintance of mine was complaining about how bad his 335 got when he tried to play more modern rock. So we did the 335, my 339, a couple strats, a LP Special, LP Robot, LP Deluxe, Flying V, and a couple Carvins to compare. The two semi's were. like I said, immediate and painful. For anyone with a JVM, this test was done on channel 4 (high gain) mode 2 (middle gain within the channel) with the gain control at about 12:30. Muffling the strings with the hands got us up to about 3 on the master volume before shrieking ensued. The Robot got up to about 4 or 5 before a lower freq feedback started hit and using the deluxe (swiss cheesed, not chambered) We were able to get the thing up pretty much all the way, and when I took my hand away, a gradual feedback would start to build. Couple months prior to that I'd been jamming with some guys in their practice room which had a ton of other electrical devices in it. They wanted to play heavy metal (sabbath, slayer, metallica, that kinda stuff). Once the drummer started bashing away I had to turn up to about 6 (louder than most small gigs around here have required me to play, usually 4 is overkill) although I was playing through one of their cabs at a lower load. and I had the toughest time finding the right direction/spot on the floor where it wouldn't feed back like crazy. I'd packed the robot because they said tune down 1/2 step and i felt like being lazy. Prior to this, I'd been jamming in another dude's basement at a volume of 5 or 6 without much of an issue with the same guitar and amp. Unfortunately, I didn't get the robot (or any newer LP) until I left my last band so my stage exp with the thing is nil. I'd always used explorers or my flying v. That said, we rehearsed in a cramped garage and would usually play our heads at about 3 on the volume turning up to 4 or 5 for gigs in the local bars. So yeah, no oscilliscopes or anything else scientific. The robot seems to be ok at low to low-moderate volumes but seems to be definitely more susceptible to a troubling bit of feedback for whatever reason. I'm thinking the chambering probably doesn't help although it might not be the entire cause. The 339, well, forget anything modern, I guess, unless a noise gate will really do a number on it, but I hate the though of stifling it that way. Oh and on the deluxe, it's an 05. I was warned it would be microphonic as hell, but it's surely not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waynel Posted March 29, 2011 Author Share Posted March 29, 2011 Crank the volume till you get feed back and then take your hand a mute all the strings. You can even press a sock against the strings to help you mute them. If it's still getting feed back and you know the strings arn't the cause then the pickup is microphonic. At this point you can switch the pickup switch to see which one it is. Many times it can be both. Been away for a while. Searcy, I'm usually about 6 feet or more from my JVM210 and 1960 cab in our studio. Probably the same for gigs. But I thought about your suggestion on the pickup. I have an Air Norton in the bridge and a Dimarzio Super Distortion in the bridge. I noticed I didn't get the feedback as quick or as strong when selecting the Norton. Then I researched. The SD is a high output pickup (420mv) and the Norton is (270). So...I replaced the SD with a PAF Pro (medium output at 300mv). The feedback problem has been greatly reduced! It's not totally gone, which is great because the real treat is that I can call it up when I want it. Outstanding advice...at 420mv the Super Distortion was driving the preamp tubes into a frenzy. Nice side benefit is that I get more of the tone from the body of the guitar. Learned a HUGE lesson, let the amp take care of the distortion instead of the pickups. Thanks to all. Waynel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry-guitar Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 I own several LP's and just bought a "chambered", model. Specifically, the Silver Burst Studio. This guitar feeds back so bad at medium/high gain/volume that I cannot use it to play out. In all respects its a beautiful guitar, but I play harder edge Rock, ie Scorpions, Foo Fighters, GnR's.....and I cannot use this LP. Anybody want it? $900.00 and its yours( Or lets trade?? Looking for White Flying V or White Explorer. Its the Ebony neck version before they switched to Rosewood. I a/b'd this guitar against my solid body LP's, all with the same pickups, BB Pro's, same strings, same amp settings, same locations. Maybe not an engineered experiment, but proved out my situation in practical setting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kineman Karma Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 I own several LP's and just bought a "chambered", model. Specifically, the Silver Burst Studio. This guitar feeds back so bad at medium/high gain/volume that I cannot use it to play out. In all respects its a beautiful guitar, but I play harder edge Rock, ie Scorpions, Foo Fighters, GnR's.....and I cannot use this LP. Anybody want it? $900.00 and its yours( Or lets trade?? Looking for White Flying V or White Explorer. Its the Ebony neck version before they switched to Rosewood. I a/b'd this guitar against my solid body LP's, all with the same pickups, BB Pro's, same strings, same amp settings, same locations. Maybe not an engineered experiment, but proved out my situation in practical setting. Lower the pickups :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry-guitar Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 Lower the pickups :) Thank you Kineman Karma, but I have tried that. I know for many people a chambered guitar isn't an issue, but once I loose faith in a design, that's it, it needs to go. Besides, LP's have always been a perfect design in many ways, why mess with it. I know they can be heavy, but that's why they make the "special", and if they wanted a lighter weight carved top, then just "thin" the guitar 1/8-1/4 inch. I'm sure that would be less noticeable while retaining most if not all the LP characteristics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rokkstar 2210 Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 glad to see your problem's solved..I guess the pickups were a bit too hot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry-guitar Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 glad to see your problem's solved..I guess the pickups were a bit too hot ???? Who's problem is solved. Once the guitar is sold, my problem will be solved, and I say that with sadness as a devote Gibson player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigKahune Posted May 23, 2011 Share Posted May 23, 2011 . You've got some powerful gear. Are your pups potted? . . . . . Sounds like they're not. . . CB gave it to you in post #9. B) =>> Potting stabilizes the components of the pickup so that they cannot move relative to each other. This elminates vibration-induced feedback signals that make a pickup microphonic. You can do it yourself - http://www.guitarnuts.com/technical/electrical/index.php Or take it to your local shop and pay them to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antwhi2001 Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 Jerry-guitar, I have one of those silverburst Studios too. The stock pickups are not wax-potted, so you can either remove the covers, or get them potted. That will fix it. The chambering isn't the issue. I've gigged with 3 chambered Gibsons, high gain in small venues, no problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LPguitarman Posted May 24, 2011 Share Posted May 24, 2011 I have no trouble with my chambered LP at high volumes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlashPerryBurst Posted May 26, 2011 Share Posted May 26, 2011 Can't really be much help, but my friend has a vintage dean ml with the same pickups. He had problems with uncontrollable feedback during gigs and rehearsals. At one point, the gain was down at 3 and it was still squealing. I think it might just be the combination of high gain pickups and high gain amps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angellus Posted June 1, 2011 Share Posted June 1, 2011 Problem isn't the chambered les paul. It will be the pickups mixed with your set up (pedals amp). Regain your confidence in Gibson by trying a pickup experiment. Put the stock PUPs back in and see if the problem still occur's if the feedback stops then you know your issue is with the pickups (as suggested before they may need to be potted) too hot shouldnt be an issue as you can regulate that with your amp or by custom wiring your control cavity to get the sweet spot your looking for. I know its added cost but take it down to your local repair shop. get a free 'consultation' they'll tell you what the issue is straight away and take it from there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcooper830 Posted June 6, 2011 Share Posted June 6, 2011 My Standard Faded is chambered (I believe)... and, while it sounds AMAZING, it feeds back like a semi hollow if I have the gain and volume too high. Granted.... it has to be pretty high volume. But it's the resonant type of feedback... not microphonic type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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