merciful-evans Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Pop music is pop music. What's good for a pop star of the 70s is just as good today. It's the disconnect I can never understand. rct I'm not aware of a disconnect. What is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarryUK Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Bowie was kind of a genius in a lot of aspects, and pretty deep. That's because he was an alien. It's true. I saw the film! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 I'm not aware of a disconnect. What is it? Zeppelin was pop. Hendrix was pop. Billy Gibbons plays pop music. But they are defended by the somehow smarter than everyone else that sees them as Rock And Roll or Klassikk Rokk. If you are making money in the music business in the millions of records, it's pop music. All of it. Not just the stuff you don't like or is not sophisticated enough for you, it is all pop music. Quapman: It isn't about being smart. It is about what the music does to your body. Putting IQ points to what music people like is just absurd. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merciful-evans Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Zeppelin was pop. Hendrix was pop. Billy Gibbons plays pop music. But they are defended by the somehow smarter than everyone else that sees them as Rock And Roll or Klassikk Rokk. If you are making money in the music business in the millions of records, it's pop music. All of it. Not just the stuff you don't like or is not sophisticated enough for you, it is all pop music. Quapman: It isn't about being smart. It is about what the music does to your body. Putting IQ points to what music people like is just absurd. rct I see. You have defined pop music your own way and now challenge others to refute it. How very curious :) I don’t give a toss about Zeppelin, Hendrix or Gibbons. Throw me some real bait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cody78 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Zeppelin was pop. Hendrix was pop. Billy Gibbons plays pop music. But they are defended by the somehow smarter than everyone else that sees them as Rock And Roll or Klassikk Rokk. If you are making money in the music business in the millions of records, it's pop music. All of it. Not just the stuff you don't like or is not sophisticated enough for you, it is all pop music. Quapman: It isn't about being smart. It is about what the music does to your body. Putting IQ points to what music people like is just absurd. rct But...there's 'popular music' and the genre pop. Anything that has sold in large quantites is classed as popular music from Miles Davis to J.S. Bach to Lady Gaga, but they are certainly not the same IMO. Pop is disposable music whereas, jazz, blues, rock, classical is not. That's the difference for me. Like I said, generally I can't stand pop. The thought of having to listen to Bieber or Christina Aguilera non stop would make me suicidal, but there are some exceptions. This is one. I always thought as pop songs go this was fantastic despite the totally weird video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AX-MyKQlndo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LPS1976 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 let's bring our old friend Wiki in to clarify... Pop music (a term that derives from "popular") is a genre of popular music that originated in its modern form in the Western world during the 1950s and 1960s, deriving from rock and roll. The terms "popular music" and "pop music" are often used interchangeably, although the former describes all music that is popular (and can include any style). Pop music is eclectic, and often borrows elements from other styles such as urban, dance, rock, Latin, and country; nonetheless, there are core elements that define pop music. Identifying factors include generally short to medium-length songs written in a basic format (often the verse-chorus structure) as well as the common employment of repeated choruses, melodic tunes, and hooks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cody78 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 let's bring our old friend Wiki in to clarify... Pop music (a term that derives from "popular") is a genre of popular music that originated in its modern form in the Western world during the 1950s and 1960s, deriving from rock and roll. The terms "popular music" and "pop music" are often used interchangeably, although the former describes all music that is popular (and can include any style). Pop music is eclectic, and often borrows elements from other styles such as urban, dance, rock, Latin, and country; nonetheless, there are core elements that define pop music. Identifying factors include generally short to medium-length songs written in a basic format (often the verse-chorus structure) as well as the common employment of repeated choruses, melodic tunes, and hooks. Amen! Exactly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Scales Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Fair point. There would be orchestral, operatic, etc music that would sell in decent quantities of albums and so be quantitatively 'popular', but pop music is different to just selling loads - or if so then Back in Black for instance is a Pop record. That ain't it. I still contest that riff v groove lies deep somewhere as a key indicator of rock v pop to me, but it's murky. Frinstance, though very much a rock fan over pop, I would and do happily play Cyndi Lauper and Sheryl Crow's music, which I'd say is pop. By the same token, in theory I should love Green Day - a basic rock trio (my favourite format) playing overdriven 3 minute rockers - oh man yeah, but nope, it does nothing for me and I find it annoying like....pop. It must be the music, not image or personality or whatever cos I actually don't know jack about any of those 3 mentioned artists. Not to worry... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 All definitions, and categories aside...doesn't it really boil down to what you like/love, as opposed, to what you don't? Any other discussion, is merely trying to justify your choices (not needed), and/or change someone else's preference(s), to be more like your own. Doesn't really matter what it is, either...music, art, religion, politics, etc. CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Fair point. There would be orchestral, operatic, etc music that would sell in decent quantities of albums and so be quantitatively 'popular', but pop music is different to just selling loads - or if so then Back in Black for instance is a Pop record. That ain't it. Well, maybe someday the guys that made Back in Black will hit on a formula that sells millions and then they can repeat it like pop music does. [laugh] [laugh] rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Scales Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Well, maybe someday the guys that made Back in Black will hit on a formula that sells millions and then they can repeat it like pop music does. [laugh] [laugh] rct No man, Bon can only die the once. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Pop is disposable music whereas, jazz, blues, rock, classical is not. That's the difference for me. Lennon and McCartney would agree completely. I think. Like I said, generally I can't stand pop. The thought of having to listen to Bieber or Christina Aguilera non stop would make me suicidal, Who does that? Who is telling you that "pop music" and listening to it is listening to Bieber or Aguilers non stop? Have you ever just heard a good song no matter who was doing it? Do you have to go out and get the entire record and listen to the entire thing non stop in order to be listening? I guess the more you make the more you admire what the other guys are doing for gobs of money. Making the songs that One Direction sings is far from easy, that's a serious team of music peoples doing that, they are really good at what we do. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Scales Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 All definitions, and categories aside...doesn't it really boil down to what you like/love, as opposed, to what you don't? Any other discussion, is merely trying to justify your choices (not needed), and/or change someone else's preference(s), to be more like your own. CB, if you ever open a record store, I'll be stuck there a month trying to find what I'm looking for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdgm Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Damned 'beat' combos with their long hair and those awful electronic things they flail at....all sounds the same to me! Turn it off I said! You're supposed to be practicing! Dreadful....bloody country's gone to the dogs..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie brown Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 CB, if you ever open a record store, I'll be stuck there a month trying to find what I'm looking for LOL, maybe?! But, IF I ever opened a "record" store, I'd have (or try to have) as much diversity as possible, regardless of my own personal taste(s). But, not to worry, that's not likely to happen. CB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cody78 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Lennon and McCartney would agree completely. I think. Who does that? Who is telling you that "pop music" and listening to it is listening to Bieber or Aguilers non stop? Have you ever just heard a good song no matter who was doing it? Do you have to go out and get the entire record and listen to the entire thing non stop in order to be listening? I guess the more you make the more you admire what the other guys are doing for gobs of money. Making the songs that One Direction sings is far from easy, that's a serious team of music peoples doing that, they are really good at what we do. rct Ha! Yes, well that was my point with posting that Shakespear's Sister song. Normally I don't care for that kind of stuff, but that tune I always thought was really well put together. There are others 'classics' I like too - You've Lost That Loving Feeling, God Only Knows, The Boxer and stuff like that which is very pop. While I respect and like your posts rct and think you are a cool guy, how is coming up with a 3 minute pop song difficult? It's normally just using a formula that has been used a billion times before with simple chords, simple structure and normally over produced. They have so many writers for one song that it's crazy! I'm not saying simple songs are bad at all, but equally it's hardly like composing a symphony. Could the One Direction team compose something as superb as Symphony No 7 by Shostakovich? Highly doubt it. Ok, neither could a lot of musicians many of us here listen to, but I not convinced pop is as thought out as other genres or has as much passion for the music. Maybe I'm wrong. What was my point again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayinLA Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 This is a funny debate. I just thought I would weigh uninvitedly like that ugly chick that seems to always show up with the girl you wanna hook up with at the wrong time. Truth is..in today's media marketplace Jimi would be lucky to open for Cold Play or Lady Gaga if he came on the scene right now. Today's "grammy" considerations are shiit music. That's the way it is. The real artists who kick ***, play killer material that they wrote and produced aren't given air time. Other than The Alabama Shakes, and Buddy Guy all the grammy winner's music is utter ****. It's like tryin to rub one out in a cold shower with your mom talking to you through the door. Just not gettin off on it. The truth is, thier is a deluge of great music right now, and you wouldn't know it by the **** on the radio, or the catchiest hooks that get made in car commercials. It is **** that sucks beyond comprehension. That being said. If Brittany Spears called me and said she needed a guitar player for a tour, I'd drop the phone and run. But that would be a financial decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cody78 Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 This is a funny debate. I just thought I would weigh uninvitedly like that ugly chick that seems to always show up with the girl you wanna hook up with at the wrong time. Truth is..in today's media marketplace Jimi would be lucky to open for Cold Play or Lady Gaga if he came on the scene right now. Today's "grammy" considerations are shiit music. That's the way it is. The real artists who kick ***, play killer material that they wrote and produced aren't given air time. Other than The Alabama Shakes, and Buddy Guy all the grammy winner's music is utter ****. It's like tryin to rub one out in a cold shower with your mom talking to you through the door. Just not gettin off on it. The truth is, thier is a deluge of great music right now, and you wouldn't know it by the **** on the radio, or the catchiest hooks that get made in car commercials. It is **** that sucks beyond comprehension. That being said. If Brittany Spears called me and said she needed a guitar player for a tour, I'd drop the phone and run. But that would be a financial decision. I totally agree with you on all this, the only thing I would change is it would be Shakira and not Brittany...ideally though it would be Lindsay Ell. Not as well known, but still total pop (of the country influence). Actually guys, I forgot to mention, when I was young I played in a pop band for a short while. I kind of didn't fit so well as I had long hair an dressed like a homeless person, but it was an experience. I have to say I did find the music boring and tedious to play, but did it anyway. We came runner up in a local competition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayinLA Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 It 's and awards show. End of strory. It is an opinion of who is best. Nothing more nothing less. If your band or artist won it means squat. The world is still the same I Stingently disagree. It is an industry that is full of mass media manipulation, and opinion bias created by the executives of the media companies to sell crap and make sure no one is listening to anything that might ask you to stop and look around atthe hypnosis that most suffer from. The world is not the same. It is changing....fast. All media, print TV, radio, Newspapers, Cable Networks, and most Major Labels are owned at the top by about 5 or 6 corporate comglomorates. ABC, Disney, ESPN, Atlantic Records is the same company. Oh...they also own G.E. on of the biggest military defense contractors in America. Oh yea, we've been in fruitless wars for longer than any war in American History for the past 15 years. Don't worry, shut up...the grammy's are on sweetie. Piss off!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted February 19, 2016 Author Share Posted February 19, 2016 No man, Bon can only die the once. :( True. He was a good one. In front of this crowd I'm ashamed to admit I don't even know what took him. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted February 19, 2016 Author Share Posted February 19, 2016 While I respect and like your posts rct and think you are a cool guy, how is coming up with a 3 minute pop song difficult? How many have you tried to write? How many songs have you tried to get a deal on? How many times have you heard "too much <something>" and "not enough <something>" in the same sentence about the same 4 bars of one song? Anybody can write a three minute song that nobody listens to, and more importantly, won't get you a millisecond of all of the things it takes to make a living writing songs if yer of a mind to. rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct Posted February 19, 2016 Author Share Posted February 19, 2016 I Stingently disagree. It is an industry that is full of mass media manipulation, and opinion bias created by the executives of the media companies to sell crap and make sure no one is listening to anything that might ask you to stop and look around atthe hypnosis that most suffer from. Really? The same clowns that can't figure out to update their distribution streams and their media like oh, everybody else, are capable of carrying out this grand conspiracy while unable to cope with college kids in dorms stealing Korn records off the innernetz? rct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Scales Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 How many have you tried to write? How many songs have you tried to get a deal on? How many times have you heard "too much <something>" and "not enough <something>" in the same sentence about the same 4 bars of one song? Anybody can write a three minute song that nobody listens to, and more importantly, won't get you a millisecond of all of the things it takes to make a living writing songs if yer of a mind to. rct unless your name is yoko. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karloff Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 True. He was a good one. In front of this crowd I'm ashamed to admit I don't even know what took him. rct I believe he passed out drunk in his vehicle and died from hypothermia. Like a true Pop star ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Gibson Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Passed out drunk in a car and puked,breathing in vomit. That's what killed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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